Reader Top 30; runoff for #21/22

2010 Reader Top 30

The voting for #21 was separated by only 1 vote, and as I mentioned, I want to speed up this process a bit because spring training is closing in and we still have stuff to cover here, including my top 30, figuring out assignments for 2010 and a bunch of other stuff. So we’ll do a run-off for #21 between Jon Pettibone and Yohan Flande. The loser becomes #22, and then we add 2 new names for #23. Check below for the poll

01. Domonic Brown, OF
02. Trevor May, RHP
03. Phillippe Aumont, RHP
04. Tyson Gillies, OF
05. Anthony Gose, OF
06. Domingo Santana, OF
07. Sebastian Valle, C
08. JC Ramirez, RHP
09. Jarred Cosart, RHP
10. Scott Mathieson, RHP
11. Antonio Bastardo, LHP
12. Brody Colvin, RHP
13. Jon Singleton, 1B
14. Justin De Fratus, RHP
15. Jiwan James, OF
16. Freddy Galvis, SS
17. Brian Rosenberg, RHP
18. Vance Worley, RHP
19. Mike Stutes, RHP
20. Joe Savery, LHP
21.

37 thoughts on “Reader Top 30; runoff for #21/22”

  1. Sorta of apples and oranges here. Flande even though he is older because he has accomplished more.

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  2. I’ve got them bunched together, but lower at 27/28. Let’s go with Pettibone and high hopes for the high ceiling future. My highest rankings not on the ballot yet – Schwim and Villar.

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  3. I went with Flande. Pettibone as far as I’m concerned hasn’t accomplished anything. I don’t know why he’s going above pitchers like Jesus Sanchez who can match him in stuff and have succeeded in higher levels.

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  4. Continue with Petitbone, I was likely to put ’em both in for the next 2 spots anyhow, so that’s all right.

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  7. Cool, now I’ll actually get a chance to vote for Pettibone. I had been voting Castro.

    Flande isn’t in my top 30. Throw out the Futures Game appearance, and there’s not a lot to be excited about. Yes, I know Pettibone hasn’t really ‘done anything’, but you have to like the projection. We’ve reached that point in the top 30.

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  8. Just can’t see Flande this high. He pitched at Reading with Worley and Stutes, but was over 1-1/2 years older than Worley and over a half year older than Stutes. He has also been in professional ball a lot longer. His Reading numbers are not as good as Stutes and a little better than Worley. He doesn’t have an especially low batting average against for either righties or lefties. Good base on balls rate, sort of mediocre K rate, although its midway between Worley and Stutes in Ks. He did put up very good numbers at Clearwater, but that he is even starting the season at Clearwater, at his age, says a lot.

    Clearly, I voted Pettibone. My choice for this spot was Carpenter. Those who voted Flande, might consider that Carpenter spent the whole season at AAA, is only 1/2 year older than Flande, and put up better numbers.

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  10. I don’t have a top 30, but if I did, Flande either wouldn’t make it or would be at the very back end of the list. Not an exciting prospect as far as I’m concerned.

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  11. Didn’t get in in time to vote Mayberry, though it looks like I’ll be beating a dead horse on that front.

    I do like Pettibone, but went with Flande here. Those knocking him for his age are being a bit harsh, in my opinion — ARL is a bit more important for hitters than pitchers, and Flande essentially got back on track age-wise in 2009. The fact that he jumped over two levels and posted impressive numbers in the FSL is a plus, and it’s not like he looked out of place in Reading, where he had a better K/BB, HR rate, GB rate, and FIP than Worley, Stutes, and Savery.

    Between the worm burning tendency (52.1% GB), the control, and not much in the way of a platoon split, Flande looks like a decent shot at a back-end starter to me. If you’re focused exclusively on upside, maybe the lower ceiling is enough to knock him down/off your list, but if that’s the case, he should be accompanied by Worley, Stutes, and Savery as well.

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  12. If this site were “Future Iron Pigs” I’d pick Flande, but given his age and low strike-out rates, I don’t see him making it past AAA. Pettibone, on the other hand, is a riskier bet to make it to AAA, but his youth, fastball, and strike-out ability give him more major league potential in my book.

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  13. Positives for Yohan Flande:

    1. Though he is not especially young for his levels, he jumped from Rookie Ball to AA in a single season. He faced a drastic increase in the quality of competition and responded well.

    2. His HR ratio is extremely low, just 0.4 per nine innings over his career.

    3. His control is solid, and his career K/BB ratio is nearly three.

    Given the choice, I’d rather have a groundball control pitcher than a pitcher who throws hard with little control.

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  14. ***Given the choice, I’d rather have a groundball control pitcher than a pitcher who throws hard with little control.***

    Alan, I agree with that statement assuming we’re comparing guys that are the same age. Pettibone is still really young. The hope is that he’ll develop better control.

    I had not considered Flande’s level jump. It’s a good point.

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  15. I am a huge believer in K/9 when it comes to pitchers and projecting out what they could be in the future. While Flande had pedestrian K/9 numbers as a 24 year-old in A+/AA last season, Pettibone had impressive numbers as a 19 year old in short-season ball. Gotta go with Pettibone. Flande didn’t make it in my top 30.

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  16. FYI, Jim Callis is chatting in an hour over on espn.com. Let’s pepper him with Phillies questions, like “Pettibone or Flande?”

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  17. Flande is a better prospect than Joe Savery.
    Younger. Better numbers. More control. Best change-up in the system according to BA.
    Flande and Savery’s Fastball are both 87-91. So If Flande has a plus offspeed pitch and Savery does not,Flande has the leg up.
    To say Flande is not top 30 but Savery is top 20 is ridiculous.

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  18. “To say Flande is not top 30 but Savery is top 20 is ridiculous.”

    Not ridiculous. I fully understand why people elected to choose Savery over Flande, but, following about pick 15 or 16, we are now in the land of the marginal prospect. Truth be told, while there is a huge difference between the top prospects and those around 15 or so, there probably won’t be that much of a difference between prospects around pick number 20 and those that fall right outisde of the top 30.

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  19. Since he may be in major league pen this year and has done very well at Reading, despite being old for the league and doing less well at Allentown, I think Escalona should be added to the list.

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  20. Because Flande is Left Handed, has control and a good change-up, he is nearly guaranteed to be in the Majors at some point.
    Savery does not have a major league skill. Soft tossers have to have control. Savery can not throw strikes. Savery’s ranking is based on hopes and wishes, nothing tangible.

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  21. Yeah, what happened to Escalona? Honestly, I like him more than most of the guys on the board. Guys who shoot up through the system and then float around for a short period of time often get lost in the mix.

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  22. Pettibone and others who can still project as starters should all be ahead of an Escalona, who is middle relief, tops, if that.

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  23. Hudson made PPs top 10 list back in November before the trade of Drabek, d’Anaurd and Taylor and he can’t even crack the top 20 list with the readers today.

    Going to be a lot of differences between the 2 lists once finalized. So tough to gauge where these toolsy players really belong since most flame out.

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  24. Yeah honestly at this point it doesn’t really even matter. 30 seems a little excessive… I’m confident a random number generator would put them in an order that would turn out to be more accurate in a year or two’s time

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  25. I do not believe Hudson made PP’s top 10 list. I believe PP was trying to predict Baseball America’s top 10 phillies’ list that was being released lated that day.

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  27. Hudson may be great next season, but what has he shown thus far to set himself apart from even Altherr, Hewitt, and D’Arby Myers. He signed, showed up, got his 37 AB, which is too small a sample size to mean anything, and put up his sub-.450 OPS. So, we know he is fast, know he is athletic. We have lots of guys like that. In those 37 AB we could be seeing a slump, adjustment to wood, or that could be a fair representation of his ability. Who knows? It’s not like he’s even a 1st or 2nd round draft pick. As an end of 3rd round pick, who has yet to show a thing, he shouldn’t make a top 30 list.

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  28. BA actually ranked Hudson #14 in our system. I personally think he is far too high on their list. Still, if you have confidence in your scouting reports, you can absolutely make a distinction between Hudson and a player like Aaron Altherr.

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  29. I voted for Flande, but it seems like he won’t pull it out. I would like to see Sanchez or Villar added soon. My next five:

    1. Leandro Castro
    2. Andrew Carpenter
    3. Jesus Sanchez
    4 Jonathan Villar
    5. Colby Shreve

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  30. Hudson was the only 2009 pre-season HS all-american the Phillies drafted. He has more pedigree than those you are comparing.

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  31. I still do not think pure age is a primary factor though it does contribute to the important factor of projection. I still think Flande has projection and lefthandedness is certainly useful.
    Pettibone had little fanfare from high school and was a surprise pick for the Phillies. Are comments actually trusting the Phillies evaluation of talent in ranking him so high? He was very inconsistent but so are all our ‘toolsheds’.
    I cannot disagree with the idea of voting for the high ceiling guys in the Top30 just because they may become franchise level players where Flande will not.

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  33. What’s the deal on Pettibone. Why are people so in love with him Take out three of his starts and numbers are not good. Was he hurt last year? I went with Flande this time.

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  34. Pettibone is legit around this range, I’d say a few spots lower with Carpenter, Castro, Shreve, ahead of him, then Villar, Flande, Sanchez, Escalona.

    I’ve seen Flande in Reading. Just not all that impressed watching him or looking at his numbers. Carpenter is definitely better.

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  36. Alan,
    Have you seen http://www.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?
    ‘Round 3 (compensation): Jonathan Pettibone, RHP, Esperanza (Calif.) High School. The Phillies received compensation for not signing last year’s third-rounder, right-hander Brandon Workman. Said area scout Darrell Conner of Pettitbone: “Long, lean athlete who will fill out and get stronger. Projectible high school pitcher. Played basketball. Can be back end of the rotation starter. Father, Jay, pitched for the Twins (1983).” ‘

    http://www.philliesnation.com/archives/2009/08/prospect-rankings-no-22/
    “There is little information on Pettibone in the form of scouting reports, though one report said his low-90s fastball projects well as his development progresses.”

    kphilly, the second half of article addresses your question about his 2009 season.

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  37. got to go Flande we have not seen enough from Pettibone yet i just wish everybody else could understand that. But i actually like Castro better i think he is a future allstar

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