August 9th discussion

Box Score Recap

Just a note. The signing deadline is next Monday. At this point, don’t read anything into the chatter about who will and won’t sign. There have been tons of cases where kids were geared up and ready to go to school, only to sign in the last few hours. We’ll find out next Monday, no sense getting bent out of shape before then. Now, the games

Williamsport lost 6-3.
Lakewood lost 5-4.
Reading lost 9-4.
Lehigh Valley lost 5-2.

Sometimes you eat the bear, and sometimes the bear eats you.

46 thoughts on “August 9th discussion”

  1. Zeid pitched very well (7IP, 3 H, 1 R, 9 K, 2BB). the bullpen imploded to take the loss.

    How about Hyatt, once again? On Saturday, he went 7 innings, gave up 2 hits, 0 ER, 5 K, 2 BB. I don’t understand why they continue to leave him in CLW? He’s 24. He clear-ly (no pun intended) has nothing to learn in A+. Move him up and see what he can do. It’s not as if Reading has 5 young stud starters . Some people feel he’ll end up as a reliever. So move him up and let him relieve. Yesterday was the perfect time for him. Naylor couldn’t get out of his own way and they needed an innings eater. Am I overvaluing Hyatt? Does somebody know he can’t perform at the higher level? If the Phils had their top 5 starting pitching prospects in AA, I could understand it.

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  2. By the numbers, I would agree on Hyatt and it looks like the Phillies agree too. I posted an article a while back that had discussion on Hyatt. Noworyta (ML Director) said as follows:

    Hyatt, who has been dominating the Florida State League, isn’t expected to get promoted to Reading, according to Noworyta. Hyatt (10-5, 3.22) has won three of his last five starts and has an ERA of 0.95 over his last nine starts, a 47 1/3-inning stretch.

    “We’re pretty happy with what he’s done,” Noworyta said. “But we have guys that need to finish out the season at Reading and we’re going to be keeping them where they are at.”

    http://www.csnphilly.com/08/04/10/Mixed-Injury-News-for-Phils-Prospects-/landing.html?blockID=283424&feedID=693

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  3. Hey, guess what. It’s the 2nd week of August, with the minor league seasons wrapping up around the beginning of September, so there are not that many starts left for a starting pitcher, so why disrupt the routines through a few levels. If they want to see more of pitchers they will assign them to Instructional League and work on what they need to work on, and see where they assign them next season.

    Looks like Rizzotti is getting little playing time at LVIP and alternating with Andy Tracy and his batting average shows as .444 , something like that.

    Maybe this is elsewhere as this is the first place I looked, but philly.com says Phlly signed Venezuelan SS Anderson Gonzalez for $300,000 . Turned 16 around July 27, Sal Agostinelli says he looks a little like Jeter, has good hands and range and can hit.

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  4. I think you always have to keep in mind that when a player gets moved, cooresponding moves usually have to be made. If a player got moved to Reading, then a body from Reading has to either get released, DL’d, send to Clearwater, or moved to LV.
    The Phillies probably want to keep the Clearwater and LV staffs in-tact, unless someone has to be DL’d.

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  7. I think the whole thing with Rizzotti not playing every day is done out of respect to Andy Tracy more than anything else. Disagree with it all we want, it’s only going to be for a month or so. I really don’t see any situation where Tracy would be back next year, and Rizzotti should be playing every day at AAA next year.

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  8. I agree completely with Matt. Against AL teams you will see both in the lineup with Tracy at DH most likely. Against NL teams, they will continue to alternate. Rizzotti should be the everyday first baseman in LV next year. I don’t think Rizzotti will ever play the OF.

    Just one mans opinion.

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  9. I read both facebook pages on frazier and allen, by what they say have no clue what they are going to do, any info on these guys yet.

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  10. ****I don’t think Rizzotti will ever play the OF.****

    I had read that he was already tried in the OF at some point a few years ago and he simply has no aptitude for it. He’s a 1B/DH, nothing more.

    And thus, he’s blocked in our Org and there’s a very high bar for him to succeed as a hitter.

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  11. The Ironpigs have an unusually long stretch of NL games right now. Wednesday they start 13 straight games against AL teams which means the DH every day. That’ll quell the Rizzotti/Tracy dispute.

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  13. I honestly don’t think either Tracy or Rizzotti gets the call on 9/1. There simply isn’t room on the 40-man roster. Right now they have 39. You can get one more by putting Moyer on the 60-day DL. That leaves you with 2 openings, one of which will definitely be used on a catcher. The other will probably be Ransom who is more versatile. Also means that if a pitcher isn’t on the 40-man, you can pretty much forget about a call-up this year.

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  14. Yeah, Ransom’s versatile alright. He can suck defensively at several positions and not hit at all of them as well.

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  15. Rizzotti has never played any position other than 1B or DH. Those saying it was attempted and he had no apptitude for it are simply talking out their ___.

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  17. Are there really that many players who need to be called up that also bringing up Rizzotti would not be possible? Who are the 15 other players that would come before him? I am just wondering.

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  18. If rizzotti hits at his current pace (above 350) until sept, I will be floored if they don’t call him up.

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  19. What value would calling up Rizzotti bring the big club?

    1. Can he be used as a pinch-runner? — No
    2. Can he be used as a defensive replacement a several positions — No
    3. Can he pitch? — No
    4. Can he hit right-handed? — No

    So he only value in September would be as a left-handed bat off the bench so lets see what opportunities he would get.

    Would he ever PH for Howard, Utley, Ibanez, Rollins, or Victorino? — Barring injury – No

    That leaves potentially PH’ing for Werth, Ruiz, Polanco, and the Pitcher and he’s not going to hit for either Polanco or Werth.

    Now look at the roster pecking order for left-handed bats:

    Gload vs. Rizzotti – I’d take Gload
    Brown vs. Rizzotti – I’d take Brown
    Dobbs vs. Rizzotti – I’d take Rizzotti (Manual would probably take Dobbs).

    Best case scenerio, he is the 3rd left-handed pinch-hitting option off the bench to bat for the pitcher or maybe Ruiz. Why would the team want to use up a 40-man roster spot for a guy who would get maybe 5 at-bats in September?

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  20. I get your point about his limited utlity. Fair enough, but so many players that get promoted when rosters expand fit that definition and barely see playing time (Lou Marson and a cast of thousands). The question remains – who are the 15 players that come before him?

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  21. I’m a bit biased on Zeid. He’s a Connecticut guy and was a tremendous prospect in HS. His College career was extremely shaky to start. He changed schools and came into his own a bit more in the last two years. He’s 23 and old for Lakewood but he’s been impressive as a starter. They used him mostly as a reliever early in the year but Parent said he was a starter and that’s what he was going to do. When Cosart went on the DL and many of the young pitchers were on restricted innings, Zeid’s picked up the slack. Is he top 30? Probably not. You might see some votes for him. If he can move up pretty fast, he’ll be a nice prospect or at least trade fodder. He might be next year’s Hyatt.

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  22. I’d put Josh Zeid in the same category as Austin Hyatt. Too old for his league so difficult to say if he’s a prospect. Same will be said next year when he’s 24 in Clearwater, unless he gets double jumpled ala Worley and Stutes a few years ago.

    Anyone care to guess on the Reading starters next year beside Hyatt and Sanchez? Cisco? JC Ramirez I would think. Aumont?

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  23. Catch, I would say for the 15 players that get called up before him, you can pick any relief pitcher, and any outfielder. And anyone off the streets that can play the infield (at least that’s what it seems they would have to do, with the system’s infield the way it is). But a left-handed first baseman/DH bat who is having the season of his life simply isn’t going to get promoted over more experienced players. Right or wrong, it’s just the way it is. If he played any position, other than being limited to first base, there would not even be a discussion. But his limitations in the field and side of the plate he hits just aren’t going to be overcome with one spectacular hitting season. I would be absolutely SHOCKED if they called him up. It’s just not in the cards.

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  24. Again, each of those “cast of thousands” served a specific role. It’s not about who’s the better player but rather who fills a potential niche. Marson filled the role as a 3rd catcher while Rizzotti fills no specific role to help the 2010 Phillies.

    23 players on the Phillies 40-man are pitchers. Which one of those guys do you want DFA’d to open a spot? Right now there are only 2 catchers, they will undoubtably add a 3rd which will take up the final open spot.

    There are 7 total IF. Of those 7, Dobbs is the only “expendible” and he is their back-up at 3b.
    There are 7 total OF. Would have to DFA someone like Mayberry to make a spot. Not happening..

    So that accounts for all 40 spots. Now they could move Moyer to the 60-day dl and free up a 40-man spot but again, why would they free up a spot for Rizzotti vs. adding someone who can pinch-run, bunt, or play multiple positions like a Ransom or Bocock?

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  26. Valdez can play third, but until Utley comes back, he’s a starter, thus making Dobbs a member of this squad until then.

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  27. The short answer to the question: What 15 players would be called up before Rizzotti?
    Answer: Guys already on the 40 man, plus a catcher.

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  28. Kelly Dugan continuing to rake in the GCL – through 6 innings, 2 for 3 with a double and a run scored. Obviously very limited sample size but through 8 games, hitting .538. He’ll be 20 to start the 2011 season – might the Phillies start him off in Lakewood next year as they did with Santana, with the possibility of a demotion once short season starts?

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  29. There won’t be 15 guys called up for September. If history repeats, more likely 3 – 5 guys get the call. Rizzotti in addition to not serving an obvious need, isn’t on the 40-man. To call him up requires a yes answer to two key questions: 1) is he one of the guys who will win a 40-man slot over the winter. I think the answer to this should be yes, but it is a close competition with a couple pitchers on the bubble and 2) does he have so much value to the current big league club that it’s worth adding him to the 40-man now and starting his option clock a year early? The answer to that is probably no, unless they decide he is such a good bat off the bench that they want him on the post-season 25-man roster. I’m guessing they don’t.

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  30. Here’s my take on the September roster. The one current open spot will go to a third catcher.
    I still feel that the Phillies will trade for a veteran RP. When that happens, they’ll move Moyer to the 60- day DL to make room for the newby. Most if not all of the following players who are already on the 40-man roster will be recalled: Mathieson, Worley, Bastardo, Carpenter, Zagurski, and Mayberry (assuming none of them are traded for the mystery RP). One other possibility would be LHP Escalona. The one other type of player that they might try to make room for in Sept. is a PR. I don’t see anyone on the current 40-man roster that can be this PR specialist. They could use Brown in that role but I don’t think they would. Could Rich Thompson be that guy? His numbers suggest that he could be. I haven’t seen him in person this season. Is he still an above average runner? It seems that the Phillies have been having a season long tryout for this PR role – Taveras, Duffy, Wise, etc. As much as I like Rizzotti, even I can’t see them making room for him in September unless we continue to have multiple injuries with our position players then anything could happen.
    A question to the group here…if we had to DFA one or two players to make room for additions on the 40-man roster in the next month or so who are the favorites to go? Dobbs? Naylor? Someone else?

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  31. Geancarlo Mendez impressed me back in a game he played in XST with the way he square up the ball. On Saturday and today in his last two games in the GCL he has hit a three run, two out homer in each game. He is hitting over .300 with RISP. The first thing I look for is what a batter is hitting with runners in scoring position. The three run homers with two outs are just icing on the cake.

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  33. Jim Kaat,

    I’d guess that once Utley is back healthy, Dobbs would be a candidate as well as possibly Naylor or Carpenter. I really doubt either Naylor or Carpenter would be released unless they were actually adding a significant player for the stretch.

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  35. Hi guys. I’m thinking of heading with my father to see a Lakewood game, either on Thursday or Friday. Anyone have any idea who the probables for those nights are? The Blue Claws website still has “TBD” pitching both games.

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  37. TBD is a projectable righthander. Throws 89-91 with a decent curve. His change up needs work and he has some command issues. Back of the rotation guy.

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  38. Jeff, despite your somewhat lukewarm wrapup, the fact that TBD is starting back-to-back games seems pretty remarkable to me. What is he, some kind of character out of the Chadwick era? Has anyone told Conlin about this guy?

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  43. man Rizzotti is hard to watch at 1b. i would much rather tracy hopefully rizzotti just DH’s when they play AL teams. saw ransom at the lhv game today.

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  44. I noticed Ransom too — I sit near the on-deck circle and didn’t realize he was on-deck or at the game til someone yelled “We all hate you”…

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  45. Nice to see the kid McGuire from Ridley (Delaware County) pickup the win last night for Lakewood. Had to be a thrill for him to get a win for his hometown team

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  46. @JoeDE…no chance on Schwimer or DeFratus getting the call on Sept. 1. They aren’t on the 40-man roster and there just isn’t room for them. For guys that could realistically get recalled, please click on the ‘Rosters’ tab at the top of the page.

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