Box Score Recap – 6/11/2015

Lehigh Valley (21-41) lost to the Norfolk Tides 4-3.  Seve Gonzalez threw 97 pitches and lasted 4.1 innings.  He left trailing 1-0 with one out and a runner on second.  Not too difficult a situation for a reliever, but it took 3 batters before Chris Leroux managed to allow the inherited runner to score.  Four before he actually recorded an out.  Not much offense, but Gabriel Lino went 2-3 with 2 RBI.  Adam Morgan (0-6, 5.07) pitches tomorrow.

Reading (33-26) beat the Altoona Curve 8-7 in 18 innings.  Zach Eflin was lifted after five shutout innings and throwing 82 pitches.  He allowed 4 hits and struck out six.  Hoby Milner gave up five runs and Ryan O’Sullivan two over the next 1.2 innings.  The bullpen rallied after that with 11.1 shutout innings.  Brock Stassi went the last three striking out three.  Art Charles tied the game in the bottom of the ninth with a pinch hit, 3-run HR (6).  Roman Quinn scored the winning run on a one-out, bases loaded walk to Cam Perkins.  Quinn and J.P. Crawford each had 2 hits.  Stassi went 4-8.  He and Perkins each had 2 RBI.  Tom Windle (2-3, 4.85) pitches tomorrow.

Clearwater (30-30) beat the Bradenton Marauders 4-2.  Matt Imhof came off the DL and bumped Yacksel Rios from tonight’s start.  Imhof pitched 5.0 innings and threw 80 pitches, 53 for strikes.  He allowed 2 runs (one earned) on 5 hits and 2 walks.  He balked once and picked a runner off first.  Rios came on to throw four strong innings in relief to pick up his first save.  The Threshers struck for three second inning runs on Aaron Brown’s 2-run home run (3) and Emmanuel Marrero’s RBI single.  Later, they added an insurance run on Harold Martinez’ sacrifice fly.  Willians Astudillo returned from XST to go 2-4 with a run scored and a double.  Victor Arano (0-7, 6.20) pitches tomorrow.

Lakewood (29-28) beat the Lexington Legends 7-6 in 11 innings on a Carlos Tocci HR in the top of the inning.  Tocci and Malquin Canelo each had three hits.  Canelo had 2 RBI.  Ranfi Casimiro allowed 3 runs in 6.0 innings striking out five.  Scott Harris and Alexis Rivero took turns blowing saves, but Rivero did get the win.  Manny Martinez struck out the side in the 11th to wrap up his first save.   Chris Oliver (3-4, 2.82) pitches tomorrow, then Edubray Garcia (3-5, 3.58).

Williamsport (0-0) starts its season on the road against the State College Spikes on June 19th, home opener on June 20th.

GCL Phillies (0-0) start their season across the bay against the GCL Yankees1 on June 22nd, second game at the Carpenter Complex on June 23rd.

DSL Phillies (5-5) No box score posted.

VSL Phillies (7-14) lost to the VSL Tigers 2-0.  C Lenin Rodriguez  went 2-3 with a double.

Here’s the affiliate scoreboard from MiLB.

Extra Innings –

  • Reading Fightin Phils activated RHP Ryan O’Sullivan from the 7-day disabled list.
  • Clearwater Threshers placed C Jose Mayorga on the 7-day disabled list retroactive to June 10, 2015.
  • Clearwater Threshers activated LHP Matt Imhof from the 7-day disabled list.
  • Kelly Dugan assigned to Clearwater Threshers from Reading Fightin Phils.
  • Jose Mayorga assigned to Lakewood BlueClaws from Clearwater Threshers.

93 thoughts on “Box Score Recap – 6/11/2015

  1. is there any precident for someone who spent three years in the low minors like tocci succeeding? he looks great

    1. The way to look at this is not the number of years at a certain level but his age to that level. Tocci is 19. If he’d been drafted out of HS (which he wasn’t), that would have been last year. He was in A ball last year. There aren’t too many HS’ers who go straight to A ball. He had a pedestrian .242/.297/.344 last year. This year he’s breaking out. He’s ahead of schedule and showing he can handle it. If he has a half season in A+, we’ll see how that progresses. He might need a season and a half at A+ and he’d still be young for that league. I haven’t been a big Tocci supporter this year or any year but he’s smashed a pie in my face.

      1. Put it this way: Tocci is 8 months younger than his Lakewood teammate Cord Sandberg.

        Incidentally, while Tocci cooled off for a while after his blazing hot start, he’s been coming on again recently. His May slash line was a paltry .302 / .345 / .368, but in the last 10 days he’s hitting .286 / .382 / .500.

        Basically, he never stopped hitting for average (high BABIP, low K%), but he did walk less and hit for less power during his slump. But he’s reversed that the last two weeks.

      2. Also, compare Tocci’s performance to Crawford’s in Lakewood last year (Crawford was 4.5 months younger than Tocci is now):

        Tocci (in 60 games):
        .289 / .393 / .395

        Crawford (in 54 games):
        .321 / .388 / .434

        Or if you prefer peripherals:
        (BB% / K% / ISO / BABIP)

        Tocci:
        8.0 / 11.8 / .113 / .361

        Crawford:
        13.9 / 13.9 / .106 / .337

  2. Any reason why Zac Elflin was lifted in the 5th inning when he was pitching so great , just asking.

      1. Actually I think it was 80 plus in five innings (50 plus strikes)….that’s a pretty decent workload for only five innings.

    1. I keep saying this and I’ll say it again – the blinding spotlight on Aaron Nola is the only reason we are not paying more attention to Zach Eflin. Eflin’s performance as a 21 year old in the tough AA Eastern League is superb. He has good size, outstanding command, above average velocity, unusual mound presence and maturity and he can just flat out pitch. He reminds me of a young Matt Cain and I don’t think that the comparison is a stretch by any means. By the end of next year, Nola and Eflin should be firmly entrenched in the big league rotation.

      1. Best line of the night? Brock Stassi – 4 for 8 with a walk AND 3 innings pitched, no hits, one walk and three Ks!!! I’ve seen Stassi in person and he grows on you. I view Charles as a non-player, but I think Stassi now deserves a chance and there might be something there. He’s 25, so he’s basically in the last year of being a real prospect just playing in the minors. Let’s see if he can hit AAA pitching – I think there’s a decent chance that he can.

      2. A little disconcerting to see this major league’s scouts thoughts on Aaron Nola’s future as a number three:
        “He might not have overpowering stuff, but he really knows how to pitch,” said a major-league scout who has seen Nola several times. “I think he can be a No. 3 starter in the big leagues.”
        Read more at :http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/phillies/minor_leagues/20150612_A_year_since_he_was_drafted__Nola_still_on_fast_forward.html#IVDRSYztPWjLOEEh.99

        1. I thought the consensus when he was drafted was that he was a solid #3, with a chance to develop into a #2, but that his big selling point was he was remarkably high odds to reach that #3 status and would do so quickly. When he was drafted, nobody was saying he looked like a potential ace.

        2. Major league scouts are all over the board about players. I’ve watched Nola a lot – and his ceiling is definitely, definitely higher than a #3. As I view him, his likely floor (assuming no injuries or unexpected implosion) is a #3, he’ll probably be a #2 and he’s got an outside shot at being a #1. But you have to watch him a lot to appreciate his abilities – aside from his command (which is plus), he doesn’t do one thing that blows you away, but he does many, many things very well and the cumulative effective of those advantages is what makes him so good.

      3. 33 K’s in 66 IP is VERY worrisome. That’s a 12.5% strikeout rate.

        How many hitters strike out less than 13% of the time? That’s an ELITE strikeout rate for a hitter. The average is around 20%, and I would expect a good pitching prospect to be close to that number in AA.

        Going by his peripherals this year (12.5 K% and 5.3 BB%), I suggest another comp, who has put up a remarkably similar 12.9 K% and 5.3 BB%: Jerome Williams.

        1. In fairness, I should note that Eflin has managed a ~17 K% in the past, while maintaining a 5-6 BB%. If he can get back to those numbers, he could be a decent pitcher.

          But the point is that I don’t consider his performance this year in AA to be good. And while I don’t want to conclude anything from a 4-point drop in K% over 66 innings, it COULD be a sign of a problem going forward, if he doesn’t have the stuff to put away hitters at the higher levels.

          1. You remind me of a commenter on another Phillies site. No one ever proclaimed him to have lights out stuff. I’d honestly rather have several pitchers who have amazing control.

            1. I believe as Jim so eloquently put it earlier this week ‘please give me guys with control over guys with velocity but no control.’

              Velocity is nice but without control and pitch selection pitchers struggle and burn out.

          2. According to my spreadsheet, 33Ks in 66 innings is just about 17%, not 12.5%. So, much ado about nothing?

            1. Sadly, Eflin has not thrown a perfect game every time out, so he’s faced more than 3 batters per inning pitched.

              Overall, in his 66 innings Eflin has faced 265 batters, and struck out 33 of them, yielding the stated percentage.

        2. I am normally worried about K rates too but, trust me, it’s not going to be much of an issue with Eflin. Eflin makes a concerted effort to induce weak contact so as not to throw too many pitches and, unlike the vast majority of pitchers, he has the ability to actually do it. Second, when he wants to get Ks, he can do so. He struck out the side last night. Third, his stuff is very good and his command is unreal. He’s a lot like a young Matt Cain or a young Roy Halladay. Eflin is going to be very good and he’ll get the Ks he needs. I’m not usually a fan of pitching to contact, but Eflin is a different beast.

          1. As a 21 yo Matt Cain was in AAA and struck out 10.9 batters/9 innings over 145 inning sample. Exactly what about him reminds you of Eflin?

            Look I like Eflin and he is far better than having JR on our dreadful MLB team. But the “pitches to contact” meme is a fallacy. It doesn’t work in the majors. If you can’t put hitters away then their “contact” ends in very big innings. He seems to have stuff, but not an out pitch. Until he has an out pitch, he is a #5 in my book. Maybe a #4 on a weak staff. Meaning he is just another guy.

            If he throws as hard as his reports suggest, then I would assume that he can develop an out pitch. But to dismiss this requirementfor MLB success is a fools errand.

            1. and then Cain threw his arm out and may never be the same pitcher again. its not all about fastballs and Ks

            2. I didn’t say fastballs. I said k rate. And yes, it is ALL about Ks. No one pitches forever. The window is short. But to be able to be a high quality MLB pitcher you need to put guys away. Otherwise you can’t limit damage.

            3. You will see – he is NOT just another guy. If he doesn’t get hurt or lose velocity, he will NOT be a 4/5. His velocity, size, command (serious WHIP numbers), movement down in the zone, poise and mound savvy are all above average or plus.

              First. What reminds me of Cain? Uh, I actually watch him pitch – I view most of his starts on MilbTV. His stuff is very reminiscent of a young Matt Cain – velocity, movement, comand, almost everything.

              Second, I’m not typically a fan of “pitch to contact” – in fact, I normally hate it. I’m a strikeout guy too. But Eflin is the exception. He is going to get more than his faire share of strikeouts and, in fact, will learn that he must strike some guys out in order to excel at higher levels. In fact, I think that may be one thing he is working on now – but, historically, Eflin hasn’t had to strike guys out to get outs and found out that he could last longer in games by just making people roll over on difficult to hit pitches. How many 20 and 21 year olds even have the presence of mind to think that way? I assure you, it isn’t many.

              Third, there are many guys who developed into fine pitchers who did not start out with great K rates in the minors. They are in the minority, but they exist. Check out Roy Hallday’s minor league statistics – the K rates were pretty similar to those shown by Eflin.

              Fourth, consider the context. Do you have any idea of how difficult it is to pitch as effectively as he’s pitched in the Eastern League as a 21 year old? It’s extremely rare.

              But, sure dismiss him. It make take a few years before he hits on all cylinders in the majors (just as it does for most pitchers), but you’ll see. This kid can be something special.

          2. Catch, I respect your opinion, and I hope you’re right. But I have my doubts.

            Certainly it’s possible for a pitcher to succeed despite a very low strikeout rate, but it’s not easy. A 13% strikeout rate is a red flag, and overcoming it requires remarkable talents in other areas.

            Does Eflin have such remarkable talent? Perhaps. But banking on a player in AA to have remarkable talent that makes up for a large and obvious flaw is a losing proposition most of the time. Plus-plus control is really really rare.

            So I’m going to stay cautious on Eflin. Maybe he turns into Matt Cain. I think Jerome Williams or Kyle Kendrick is more likely. We’ll see.

            1. By the way, like all of you, I certainly would like to see an uptick in the K numbers and, again, I usually don’t favor this type of pitcher.

      4. I would consider Nola to be 2-3, Eflin 3-4, Lively 4-5. And there’s nothing wrong with that. The days of 5 aces are long gone. When the time comes, if the Phillies needed to get a 1, they have the money to do so in FA.

        1. We are projected to have the top pick in the draft next year and the best player is florida’s pitcher Puk. So he Nola could very well end up being a 3rd starter behind Puk and FA. Not the end of the world.

          1. I Thought the best player is a high school pitcher pinto I think is his name. He dominate all the showcases. hits 97 with good breaking ball. may be I am wrong?

            1. There’s also the HS lefty from Barnegat. But a HS righthander has never been taken 1-1, so there’s that.

        2. You can pick up a 4/5 any off season for $4 mil. Heck, we just got Harang off the scrap heap.

          The only value are prospects who are clearly 1s, 2s or 3s. Everyone else is a JAG (just another guy).

          1. Agreed that 4s and 5s are fungible. After he settles in, Eflin isn’t going to be a 4 or a 5.

            1. Nah, not really. With a middle market team these guys fill in around the edges and get paid like middle relievers – with a little planning it’s no big deal.

          2. 4/5s are a little more expensive now a days. At least when you are talking about real 4/5s and not reclamation projects like Jerome Williams and Harang. The Ultimate 4/5 for the Phillies has been KK over the last several years and he was valuable because of the Arbitration numbers he was getting paid. The Idea should be rolling in younger arbitration eligible players at 4/5 so you can either pay to get or keep your 1/2/3.

      5. All those things about Eflin are why he edges Quinn in my prospect rankings. He may edge Randolph too, but I’m not sure about that yet.

        Anyway, I think he has a long way to go to reach Matt Cain status and a lot has to go right, but I could see that being his ceiling. Right now he reminds me of Jon Pettibone, stuff-wise, with a good fastball and plus change, and being more of a GB guy than a strikeout guy. But his age and size means that there’s still some projection left. With more experience and development of his breaking ball he could start missing more bats while still getting a lot of weak contact. It’s good to see him have a start with more Ks than IP, even if it wasn’t his most efficient outing.

  3. Glad to see that Matt Imhof came back with a very good outing.
    Any velo numbers?
    Read on another site, XST rehab he was 88-89, T90

    1. Another site!?! Are you cheating on me Romus? Or did you maybe read it here? (jk)

      I reported the following in the 6/6 Recap –
      “Matt Imhoff pitched 5.0 innings this morning. He was mostly 88-89, but touched 90 a few times in his first couple innings. He needed less than 60 pitches to navigate through five innings. He allowed one hit, a solo HR on an off-speed pitch that hung. He looks like he’s ready to claim his spot in Clearwater’s rotation back from Arano.”

      And this in the 6/1 Recap –
      “Matt Imhof pitched 3.0 innings. He threw 55 pitches and was consistently 87-88 with his fastball. He gave up a couple runs, a couple walks, a couple doubles, a wild pitch, picked off a runner, and benefited from 2 caught stealings.”

      The game was in Bradenton, no velo reports. It is safe to assume that he was at least 88-89, T90. Back in April, he was 87-88, T90 in the home opener. After his second start in Jupiter, he was shut down on 4/17.

      The Threshers start a 7-game homestand tonight, Imhof should pitch again Tuesday. I’ll be able to get velo off the stadium gun.

      1. Me cheat!
        No cheating from me Jimbo.
        I think it was either Matt or ever-enthusiastic Baseball Ross.

  4. My head says stassi won’t hit AAA pitching but my heart really wants him to. Only one way to find out though, time to promote him. He’s the man. Really hope he makes it even if he just gets a cup of coffee or maybe a bench role.

    1. I could be wrong but I think AA is typically tougher competition than AAA. AA is usually the top prospects. Either way, he deserves to be moved up.

      1. I really think aaa is so tough on younger kids. They for the most part are older veterans that throw a lot of junk Most have low velocity. which is the reason they are in triple a imo. But they can ruin a kids with that off speed junk they throw. That is the reason you see some of them brought up but they cant get away with that low velocity offspeed stuff in big leagues, unless you have pinpoint control, and as you have seen, guys like o sullian. bucanan, don’t. They are emergency guys

        1. For hitters, the jump from Reading to Lehigh Valley is huge – they are going from a great hitting environment to a pretty hard hitting environment and at the next level, the pitchers throw decent breaking pitches for strikes. The Phillies have had dozens of hitters who couldn’t make that jump, including guys like Rizzotti.

          For solid pitchers, however, the jump from Reading to Lehigh Valley isn’t that great for exactly the same reasons (easier pitching environment in Lehigh Valley). That’s why, so frequently, when the Phillies have a really good starter at Reading, he only needs to make 7 or 8 starts before going to the big leagues – it’s not a coincidence. That said, a pitcher who struggles with control can get eaten alive when they go to AAA and have to face borderline big league hitters who will not chase middling breaking stuff and will make the pitcher throws strikes to beat them. I envision that Nola and Eflin will have little trouble in AAA – a guy like Biddle might struggle quite a bit until he harnesses his control and command.

    2. The problem with Stassi isn’t just that he’s an overage first baseman. It’s that he’s an overage first baseman who’s repeating AA and has never really hit for power.

      His ISOs by year are .104, .095, and .173. The last one is decent, but hardly eye-popping, while the first two are pitiful. And these are all in hitter’s parks, with the last two in Reading.

      I’m all for seeing what he can do in AAA because the BB/K numbers are nice, but it’s hard to have much confidence he can hit enough going forward unless he starts showing some more power.

      Not to mention that I’m skeptical of people named after secret police forces.

  5. Reading, Clearwater and Lakewood are all at .500 or better. That is a big improvement. I know the focus is development, but it is nice to see the farm teams winning games.

    1. They aren’t just at or over .500, they’re all hitting and pitching really well! We deserve a better farm system ranking, but our future is bright.

  6. How can you not be incredibly happy with what Malquin Canelo has done this year? That is one exciting prospect. He’s show WAY more pop than I was expecting.

  7. Malquin Canlo didn’t really hit until this year. I Know he is young. wondering what kind of prospect he is in the minds of scouts. and phiilies fo. I Am only going by his numbers never seen him. would love to know if they view him as a legit prospect. a starter in majors

    1. I imagine part of the reason the phillies didn’t go after any pure short stops in the draft was in part due to Canelo.

  8. watched the Lakewood game on Milb.tv, Tocci had a good night of course, Sandberg’s double just missed going out. He kind of reminds me of Walding a bit, looks the part but just doesn’t end up producing. Tromp just missed a bases loaded double on a foul ball by inches, then strikes out next pitch. Canelo was impressive as well, going to be interesting to see what he does whenever he gets moved up.

    Casimiro was getting hit around a little, but overall wasn’t bad. He sure is tall, it was my first time seeing him, so not really sure what to make of him. Rivero while he gave up the HR, I thought his stuff looked good. I’ve seen Martinez now twice over the last few weeks and he really impressed me both times. The ball just seems to jump out of his hand. I know he was sitting 94-95 from what I heard the announcers but it looked faster at least.

  9. Reality check, striking out 4.5 batter per 9 innings is HORRIBLE. For a pitcher, no other stat matters as much as k rate (with walk rate a close second). If you can’t strike guys out, then you can’t be a quality pitcher in the majors. As such, you all are way over-valuing Eflin.

    Sometimes I thing you guys forget how big of a jump it is from AAA to majors.

    It is really not that complicated. If you can’t strike out minor league hitters then you won’t strike out major league hitters. And if you don’t make hitters swing and miss, then you won’t get them in pitcher’s counts and then they will Crush you. Rationalizing it as “he pitches to contact” is silly. That is a good way to get slammed by major league hitters. Pitchers can work their way through a minor league lineup even at AA. But the majors hitters are all AA all-stars. Actually, most major league lineups are filled with guys who were elite at AA.

    To be clear, I am not saying that Eflin is not a prospect. But I am saying, he doesn’t seem to have an out pitch. Or at least he isn’t throwing it this year. And until he demonstrates an out pitch, he will not be a quality MLB starter. I am not hating on him. I want him to be successful. But I view this as the reality of prospects. And before you bash me, do some homework and show me a quality MLB starter with a k rate of 4.5/9 at AA. Just name one guy.

    1. Well, of course, you are cherry picking which statistics you will use to prove your point.

      Eflin’s minor league K rate across all levels is 6.0. He’s in his first year at AA, he’s quite young for the level, and it’s a very hard league. Even guys who end up being dominant major leaguers often only have ok stats in the Eastern League. Roy Halladay was at 5.9. Greg Maddux’s minor league K rate across all levels was 5.7 and his AA K rate was 4.9 and his AAA K rate was 4.7, I think he turned out to be successful, no? This is why actually watching the pitcher matters. Of course Maddux and Halladay were exceptions, but they obviously had things about their game that allowed them to excel at higher levels notwithstanding the lower minor league K rates. I’m not saying Eflin is another Maddux or Halladay – that’s unfair to both of those players and to Eflin. But what I am saying is that there’s a lot more to Eflin than looking at those K rates might suggest and, while a pitcher can lose velocity or his ability to command pitches at any time, if Eflin continues on this trajectory he is not going to just be another guy. He’s way better than that.

      1. To clarify – Hallday’s minor league K rate was at 5.7 across all levels. He also had some very low K rates in the majors until the latter part of his career.

        I will also say that I do not expect Eflin to show up in the majors as anything more than a 4 to begin. He’s not Matt Harvey – that’s not his game and never will be. Rather, I expect Eflin to make a fairly gradual progression – he’s all about command and changing speeds and mixing pitches. Most guys like that do end up being 4s and 5s, but most guys like that don’t have Eflin’s extraordinary command or his well above average velocity. That’s what separates a guy like Eflin from Sev Gonzalez (who I DO view to be just another guy).

      2. I mean to comp to Roy friggin Halladay is kinda crazy, but to respond, Halladay struggled in his early career. He then went down to minors and completely changed his throwing mechanics.

        1. It’s not crazy when you start with a dare to find “anyone” – dude, I found somebody – I found a few in fact who had similar numbers and went on to stellar careers and those are just guys I remembered off the top of my head. I am sure there are many others who were very successful and started out with K rates in the minors in the 6 range.

          Also, look at Halladay’s middle major league career (after he had crashed and burned and resurrected his career) – he had several years where he was awesome and averaged less than 7 Ks per nine and several years he was in the 5s.

          1. You didn’t respond to my challenge. Halladay had a k rate of 7.5 in AA. I asked you to find someone with a 4.5 k rate. Waiting…

        2. Though Dusty W. did bring up Greg Maddux’s name and Aaron Nola in the same sentence…..which I thought was unusual since coaches and players try to avoid that

      3. Let me also respond to the “cherry picking” comment. If you have ever watched low minor league games (which I have a lot) then you quickly come to the conclusion that the stats WITHIN A RANGE are meaningless. The only statistics of significance are the extremes (bad or good). Defense is so inconsistent in the low minors. As are hitters. The difference between a 3.10 ERA in A ball and a 3.9 is not as significant as it seems.

        Also, It is not a coincidence that peripheral stats worsen as you move up. Hitters get better. It is that simple.

        So using an average across a minor league career is a way to talk yourself into a prospect. But he has to prove himself at every new level. So referencing his most recent season stats is not “cherry picking”.

        1. Have to agree with that rational.
          Probably the true measure of a pitchers’ value is at the AA and higher level.
          But sometimes you have to factor in age relativity to the level.
          Eflin can repeat and still be age appropriate next season.

            1. What? He had one blow off the tires start. Aside from that he has dominated this season. An ERA at or below 3 in the Eastern League is excellent for a 21 year old prospect in his first year in the league and that’s where he is right now. At age 22 Matt Harvey had a 4.5 ERA in the Eastern League. At age 22, Jordan Zimmermann had a 3.21 ERA in the Eastern League. At age 22, Zach Wheeler had a 3.22 ERA in the Eastern League. As a 21 year old in Reading, Carlos Carrasco had a 4.39 ERA.

              I get the concern on the strikeouts – I get it. But to say he hasn’t been highly effective and even dominant – that’s not entirely fair or accurate especially given his age.

            2. 1. Your Matt Harvey comp basically makes my point. That within a range, ERA is meaningless. That k rate is much more of an indicator. Harvey’s AA k rate was 9.8.
              2. I NEVER said that Eflin wasn’t effective at AA. I said I don’t think that he will be a high quality MLB pitcher until he develops an out pitch.

            3. Yeah, okay, so basically every stat is not that useful except the one stat that you want to use. Come on.

              By the way, I would normally agree with you about the out pitch – and getting that out pitch is probably what Eflin would need to be a top of the rotation starter, but I’ve spent a lot of time watching him pitch and seeing what he does and how he does it – he won’t need an out pitch to develop into a middle of the rotation guy – he’ll just need to continue developing at his present pace.

            4. 1. Yes. I believe that k% and bb% are by far the biggest indicators of future success. I already stated above why ERA (within a range) is not important when evaluating a prospect.
              2. Your statement (“he won’t need an out pitch to develop into a middle of the rotation guy”) is the crux of our disagreement. I think that is the recipe for being a 4/5.

        2. Well, it is a bit when he’s only a third of the way through the season, he otherwise has outstanding numbers, has good stuff and is young for the level. I would be shocked if his K numbers do not stablize as the season moves on. I don’t think anyone quarrels with the fact that his K numbers have to at least improve somewhat for him to continue this success as he moves up the ladder. But having watched him pitch quite a bit I’m confident that will happen.

          1. I would think most posters here realize if he started in Reading next season, it would not be detrimental to his progression nor his confidence, especially if he dominates.

            1. That would be nice….but not sure the Phillies are that aggressive. Along with the fact, Nola will probably be there and they may try to get Biddle fast-tracked at some point early next season. Will they want a lot of rookies in a rotation? May be another top pick in 2017. Perhaps a September call-up in 2016

      1. he was running to first, they didn’t have the camera on him but the play by play said it looked like it was his left leg.

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