Last “Weak”

The Phillies went 1-5 last week.  They lost two of three against Arizona then got swept by San Francisco.

The Phillies’ remaining schedule is encouraging.  They play nine more games in three winnable series – 3 v. MIA, 3 v. WAS, and 3 at MIA.  Then they finish with 18 tougher games in six series – 3 at ATL, 2 v. TOR, 4 v. ATL, 3 at CHC, 4 at WAS, and 3 at HOU.

Sixteen of their remaining 28 games are on the road.  They’ll need to perform better if they expect to hold onto a playoff spot.

At 73-61, the Phillies are in third place in the division, 11.5 games behind the Mets and 10.5 games behind Atlanta.  Miami and Washington are out of competition for anything other than positioning in the draft pool.

The East Division race has developed into a real race.  St. Louis has opened up a sizable lead on Milwaukee.  The West is over.  The seeding for the division winners still looks to be set – West, East, Central.

The National League Wild Card race is down to a four-team race.  Atlanta is safely well in front for the first wild card if they don’t catch the Mets.  San Diego has the second wild card by a half-game over the Phillies.   The Phillies are two-and-a-half games ahead of Milwaukee.

By merit of the first tie-breaker (head-to-head), the Phillies hold an advantage over  Milwaukee (4-2), St. Louis (4-3), Los Angeles (4-3), San Diego (4-3), Colorado (5-2), Cincinnati (6-1), and Pittsburgh (6-1).

They clinched against Washington (10-2 with 7 to play).

They are ahead of Miami (8-5 with 6 to play).

They are tied with Arizona (3-3).  And, tied with Atlanta (6-6) with 7 to play.

They lost their season series with New York (5-14) and San Francisco (1-5).

They trail the Cubs (0-3) with 3 to play.

They have a 2-game series against the Blue Jays in September and close the season with 3 games in Houston.

The Phillies’ division record is 29-27.  Their record against the other NL divisions is 37-26.  Their interleague record, which doesn’t matter in tie-breakers, is 7-8.

Tie-breaking Procedures:

  1. Head-to-head record
  2. Intradivision winning percentage
  3. Interdivision winning percentage
  4. Best record in the final 81 intraleague games of the season
  5. Best record in the final 82 intraleague games of the season (provided the game added is not between the tied teams), and continue one game back until the tie is broken

Key Dates: some are guesstimates.  Bold dates are pretty much confirmed thru announcements, some digging, and some extrapolation from previous years. Italics are those dates that can’t yet be confirmed.

It has been a long time since we cared about playoff dates.

  • October 3, 2022: Opening Day for the Arizona Fall League
    • November 5, 2022: AFL Home Run Derby
    • November 6, 2022: AFL Fall Stars Game
    • November 11, 2022: AFL Play-in Semifinal
    • November 12, 2022: AFL Championship Game
  • October 5, 2022: Final scheduled day of the MLB regular season
  • October 11, 2022: Opening Day for the Mexican Pacific League
  • October 15, 2022: Opening Day for Dominican Winter League
  • October 22, 2022: Opening Day for the Venezuelan Winter League
  • October 28, 2022: MLB World Series begins (FOX)
    • October 7-9, 2022: NL Wild Card A/B (ESPN)
    • October 11-16, 2022: NLDS A/B (Fox or FS1)
    • October 18-25, 2022: NLCS (Fox or FS1)
  • November 2-6, 2022: Trading resumes the day after the World Series ends.
  • November 6-10, 2022: Five days after the conclusion of the World Series is the deadline for teams to make qualifying offers to their eligible former players who became free agents.
  • November 12, 2022: Start of the Colombian Winter League 
  • November 4, 2022: Opening Day for the Roberto Clemente Puerto Rico Professional Baseball League
  • November 10, 2022: Opening Day for the Australian Baseball League
  • November 16-20, 2022: Fifteen days after the conclusion of the World Series is the deadline for free agents to accept qualifying offers.
  • November 18 or 21, 2022: Deadline to submit 40-man rosters before Rule 5 Draft
  • November, 2022: GM Meetings 
  • November, 2022: Owners Meetings
  • November, 2022: MLBPA executive board meeting
  • December 1, 2022 – Non-tender Deadline – The last day for teams to offer 2023 contracts to unsigned players (pre-arb and arb eligible) on their 40-man rosters.  Non-tendered players become free agents.
  • December 4-11, 2022: The 2022 Baseball Winter Meetings will take place in San Diego, California.
    • December 9, 2022: Rule 5 Draft
  • December 9, 2022: Opening Day for the Panamanian Baseball League
  • December 15, 2022: Close of the 2021-2022 international signing period
  • January 15, 2023: Opening of the 2022-2023 international signing period
  • January, 2023: Deadline for teams and players to submit salary figures for arbitration
  • February 2-10, 2023: Caribbean Series (Venezuela, Dominican Republic, Mexico, Puerto Rico, Colombia, Panama, Cuba, Curacao)
  • February, 2023: Voluntary spring training reporting date for pitchers, catchers, and players recovering from injuries
  • February, 2023: Voluntary spring training reporting date for position players
  • February, 2023: Mandatory spring training reporting date
  • February 24, 2023: Opening Day for Spring Training Games
    • February 25, 2023: (SS) v. New York Yankees (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • February 25, 2023: (SS) at Detroit (Lakeland), 1:05 PM
    • February 26, 2023: v. Minnesota Twins (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • February 27, 2023: at Pittsburgh Pirates (Bradenton) Time TBD
    • February 28, 2023: v. Toronto Blue Jays (SS) (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 1, 2023: at Minnesota Twins (Fort Myers) Time TBD
    • March 2, 2023: at Boston Red Sox (Fort Myers) Time TBD
    • March 3, 2023: v. Detroit Tigers (SS) (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 4, 2023: v. Pittsburgh Pirates (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 5, 2023: at Toronto Blue Jays (Dunedin) Time TBA
    • March 6, 2023: at Baltimore Orioles (Sarasota) Time TBA
    • March 7, 2023: v. Tampa Bay Rays (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 8, 2023: OFF DAY
    • March 9, 2023: v. Baltimore Orioles (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 10, 2023: v. Pittsburgh Pirates (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 11, 2023: at New York Yankees (SS) (Tampa) Time TBD
    • March 12, 2023: v. Toronto Blue Jays (Clearwater) (SS) 1:05 PM
    • March 13, 2023: OFF DAY
    • March 14, 2023: v. Atlanta Braves (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 15, 2023: at New York Yankees (Tampa) Time TBA
    • March 16, 2023: at Detroit Tigers (Lakeland), 6:05 PM
    • March 17, 2023:(SS) v. Toronto Blue Jays (SS) (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 17, 2023: (SS) at Toronto Blue Jays (SS) (Dunedin) Time TBA
    • March 18, 2023: at Atlanta Braves (North Port) Time TBA
    • March 19, 2023: v. Boston Red Sox (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 20, 2023: v. Baltimore Orioles (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 21, 2023: at Pittsburgh Pirates (Bradenton) Time TBA
    • March 22, 2023: at Tampa Bay Rays (Port Charlotte) Time TBA
    • March 23, 2023: v. Detroit Tigers (SS) (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 24, 2023: at Toronto Blue Jays (Dunedin) Time TBA
    • March 25, 2023: v. New York Yankees (Clearwater) 1:05 PM
    • March 26, 2023: at Baltimore Orioles (Sarasota) Time TBA
    • March 27, 2023: at Toronto Blue Jays (Dunedin) Time TBA
    • March 28, 2023: v. Toronto Blue Jays (Clearwater) 12:05 PM
  • March 30, 2023: Season Opener at Texas Rangers
  • April 6, 2023: Home Opener v. Cincinnati Reds
  • July 2023: Rule 4 Amateur Draft
  • December 15, 2023: Close of the 2022-2023 international signing period

This gives you a place to talk about the Phillies for the week.

Here are the transactions that were reported (or uncovered) this week.

9/04/2022 – Phillies placed 3B Nick Castellanos on the 10-day IL retroactive to 9/3, right oblique strain.
9/04/2022 – Phillies designated SS Luis Garcia for assignment
9/04/2022 – Phillies selected the contract of SS Dalton Guthrie from Lehigh Valley
9/03/2022 – Jersey Shore placed C Anthony Quirion on the temporarily inactive list
9/03/2022 – Jersey Shore activated LHP Rafael Marcano from the Development List
9/03/2022 – Clearwater placed OF Justin Crawford on the 7-day IL
9/03/2022 – Clearwater activated RHP Cam Wynne from the Development List
9/03/2022 – C Adony Mejia assigned to Clearwater from Jersey Shore
9/02/2022 – Lehigh Valley transferred RHP Colton Eastman to the Development List
9/02/2022 – Clearwater placed RHP Alex Rao on the 7-day injured list retroactive to 8/31
9/02/2022 – Clearwater transferred LHP Matt Osterberg to the Development List
9/02/2022 – RHP Chase Webster assigned to Clearwater from FCL Phillies
9/01/2022 – Phillies recalled C Donny Sands from Lehigh Valley
9/01/2022 – Phillies selected the contract of RHP Vinny Nittoli from Lehigh Valley
9/01/2022 – Lehigh Valley placed LHP Kent Emanuel on the 7-day IL
9/01/2022 – C Vito Friscia assigned to Lehigh Valley from Reading
9/01/2022 – RHP Jack Perkins assigned to Lehigh Valley from Reading
9/01/2022 – Reading activated RHP Aidan Anderson from the Development List
9/01/2022 – Reading activated LHP Josh Hendrickson from the 60-day IL
8/31/2022 – RHP Vinny Nittoli roster status changed by Phillies
8/31/2022 – Toronto traded RHP Vinny Nittoli to Phillies for C Karl Ellison
8/31/2022 – RHP Vinny Nittoli assigned to Lehigh Valley
8/31/2022 – Lehigh Valley transferred LHP Ryan Sherriff from the 7-to the 60-day IL
8/31/2022 – Lehigh Valley placed RF Justin Williams on the 7-day IL retroactive to 8/30
8/31/2022 – Reading sent RHP Joel Cesar on a rehab assignment to Jersey Shore
8/31/2022 – Jersey Shore transferred SS Casey Martin from the 7-to the 60-day IL
8/30/2022 – RHP Trevor Bettencourt assigned to Lehigh Valley from Reading
8/30/2022 – Reading activated C Jack Conley from the temporarily inactive list
8/30/2022 – LHP Matt Osterberg assigned to Clearwater from Reading
8/30/2022 – RHP Estibenzon Jimenez assigned to Clearwater from FCL Phillies
8/29/2022 – Toronto claimed CF Bradley Zimmer off waivers from the Phillies
8/29/2022 – Phillies signed free agent RHP Chris Devenski to a minor league contract
8/29/2022 – RHP Chris Devenski assigned to Lehigh Valley
8/29/2022 – RHP Andrew Baker assigned to Reading from Jersey Shore
8/29/2022 – Jersey Shore activated LHP Keylan Killgore from the 60-day IL
8/29/2022 – LHP Tristan Garnett assigned to Jersey Shore from Clearwater
8/29/2022 – Clearwater transferred OF Emaarion Boyd to the Development List
8/28/2022 – Jersey Shore placed SS Uziel Viloria on the 7-day IL
8/28/2022 – Jersey Shore transferred RHP Matt Russell to the Development List
8/28/2022 – Clearwater activated LHP Jordan Fowler from the Development List
8/27/2022 – Jersey Shore activated SS Kendall Simmons from the 7-day IL
8/27/2022 – Jersey Shore placed SS Casey Martin on the 7-day IL

242 thoughts on “Last “Weak”

  1. We all agreed that Arizona has become a more competitive young team. And after taking 2 of 3 from the Phillies they just helped us by taking 3 of 4 from the Brewers. (Thank you DBacks!)

    But to be swept by the Giants, who had lost 7 in a row entering the weekend, is disappointing.

    It’s a long season though and the Phillies just need to get back to winning ways now back at home!

  2. Garica is a mammoth disappointment and is still only 21 or so but has done nothing since the GCL. The new development staff gave him a chance and he didn’t respond, young age or no young age. This is a wakeup call for guys like Ortiz and Martin. Perform or get passed by or left behind. The way it should be.

    While I am on the subject of disappointments, Moniak was a disaster as a 1-1 pick. Not only did he give the Phillies nothing, the Phillies had such little confidence in him that they thought it appropriate to trade their #1 position prospect for a CF the same age and taken in the same draft as Moniak.

    1. When it comes to monetary value placed on a prospect….Luis Garcia’s $2.5M signing bonus in the 2017/18 international class could be considered the equivalent of a first round pick.
      And yet another 7 figure signing Latin disappointment

    2. No, it’s worse for that. They didn’t trade him for Marsh. They traded him for a #4 starter on an expensive one year contract. So he netted us a high-cost, low-upside rental. Not good.

    3. NL, in 6-year hindsight, who do you think the Phils should have selected instead of Moniak/Gowdy?

      1. This has always been my question for the people who say that he was a wasted pick. Who were you calling for?

        And yeah, I get that it’s not OUR job to identify talent. But sometimes there is no good answer. We didn’t luck out in a draft with Strasburg or Harper or Gerrit Cole. This wasn’t a Phillies issue… it was league wide. Sometimes draft classes are just not that good. So of course one of our only TWO number 1 picks ever was in a poor draft class. Not a single player from the 2016 first round has made an all star appearance (later picks have, but since literally EVERY team had a chance to draft them and passed, it’s irrelevant).

        More to the point, the players who were considered possibilities at #1 by… well, everyone, have all disappointed to a certain degree. Senzel and Corey Ray are both 27 and arguably been worse than Mickey. Kyle Lewis is also 27 and with a little success, but nothing commensurate with a number 1 overall. Neither Groome nor Pint have made it to the show yet and neither have been great in the minors. Ian Anderson and AJ Puk have had some success. But Anderson literally got demoted this year due to his 5.00 ERA and Puk is a 27 year old reliever with exactly one good year to his name (I’m not counting 11 IP as a good year).

        Quantrill might be the player with the best outcome among those who were “considered”. But remember, he had HUGE question marks (read: Tommy John surgery). The Phils would have been crucified for taking that big a risk with the number 1 pick. Plus his peripherals are also only okay. If anything, he seems more like a product of Cleveland (who inevitably squeezes every ounce of talent out of pitchers) than a solid draft pick.

        So yeah… Slim pickings. At least with Moniak he’s still relatively young and shown flashes of more.

      2. This has always been my question for the people who say that he was a wasted pick. Who were you calling for?

        And yeah, I get that it’s not OUR job to identify talent. But sometimes there is no good answer. We didn’t luck out in a draft with Strasburg or Harper or Gerrit Cole. This wasn’t a Phillies issue… it was league wide. Sometimes draft classes are just not that good. So of course one of our only TWO number 1 picks ever was in a poor draft class. Not a single player from the 2016 first round has made an all star appearance (later picks have, but since literally EVERY team had a chance to draft them and passed, it’s irrelevant).

        More to the point, the players who were considered possibilities at #1 by… well, everyone, have all disappointed to a certain degree. Senzel and Corey Ray are both 27 and arguably been worse than Mickey. Kyle Lewis is also 27 and with a little success, but nothing commensurate with a number 1 overall. Neither Groome nor Pint have made it to the show yet and neither have been great in the minors. Ian Anderson and AJ Puk have had some success. But Anderson literally got demoted this year due to his 5.00 ERA and Puk is a 27 year old reliever with exactly one good year to his name (I’m not counting 11 IP as a good year).

        Quantrill might be the player with the best outcome among those who were “considered”. But remember, he had HUGE question marks (read: Tommy John surgery). The Phils would have been crucified for taking that big a risk with the number 1 pick. Plus his peripherals are also only okay. If anything, he seems more like a product of Cleveland (who inevitably squeezes every ounce of talent out of pitchers) than a solid draft pick.

        So yeah… Slim pickings. At least with Moniak he’s still relatively young and shown flashes of more.

      3. Cal Quantrill has accumulated more bWAR than any other 2016 1st round pick. That’s not to say he’ll end up that way. Gavin Lux could eventually overtake him. The second round (and beyond) is where the Phillies really could have scored some eventual prolific talent:
        Round 2 … Pete Alonso, Bryan Reynolds, and Bo Bichette
        Round 3 … Zac Gallen, Sean Murphy, Austin Hays, and Dustin May & Jesus Luzardo (as likely high end SPs with nice careers ahead of them now that they are recovered from TJ)
        Round 4 … Corbin Burnes(!) and Shane Bieber(!)

        On another note, the Phillies 2021 draft could end up being as good as the 2016 draft was bad. When you look at the projections of Andrew Painter (1), Griff McGarry (5), and Andrew Painter (11), and consider the upsides of Jordan Viars (3), Micah Ottenbreit (4), Christian McGowan (7), and Jose Pena Jr (6). Ottenbreit and McGowan are recovering from TJ, but are good looking prospects. McGowan was the top JUCO arm available for last year’s draft. I think he has a chance to quickly climb through the system as either a starter or reliever if/when he gets healthy.

        1. Just a typo, Hinkie. I think you meant Andrew Baker at #11. I have not given up hope on Ethan Wilson, although he has not exactly shined so far.

        2. yes, outside of Quantrill nobody else being talked about with that #1 has really done anything, but its that it was compounded by not really getting anything out of the overslot picks after that, Gowdy, Stobbe, Romero, and Irvin, and Stephan, either. All those guys Hinkie named above except for Luzardo i think, signed for much less than the guys we drafted. So ironically, might have been better off without the Moniak underslot savings- though of course whoever they drafted was going to be somewhat underslot.

          1. My bad, matt. Yes. I meant to type Baker instead of Painter as the Phillies 11th round pick.
            v1 … and Quantrill would have probably taken the same type of discount Mickey accepted at 1-1 (~3M in savings) because he didn’t throw at all in his junior season at Stanford while recovering from TJ.

      4. I (heart) don’t want to answer that because that would be the ultimate Monday morning quarterbacking. I didn’t have a problem with Moniak when he was drafted but that was based on only Youtube highlights. I don’t follow the draft like Hinkie and I wasn’t paid by the Phillies to get the pick right.

        Still, that pick has cost the Phillies in many many ways. The guys paid to get it right didn’t.

        1. NL, I think you can look at the pick of Moniak, which incidentally I didn’t and don’t now have a problem with, and recognize that drafting a high school player adds a lot of risk to a risky proposition in the first place, but obviously an outfielder is not nearly as risky as for a HS pitching prospect. Just generally speaking, there are so many physical risks for any prospect. However, many have discussed the drafting philosophy of MacPhail and Klentek and their tendency to draft sure “floors” rather than players with star potential. Moniak may do much better, but his defense gives him a floor as a MLB regular. Even 6 years later it is tough to find a 2016 first round draft choice that would have been a better pick- so perhaps the general draft philosophy is a better candidate for disdain than one player or pick. In that draft the Reds made a marginal choice with Senzel, the Red Sox certainly didn’t get it right with Jay Groome, the Brewers with Corey Ray, the Rockies with Riley Pint nor the As with AJ Puk – who has done nothing until this year. And, then you can look at the Phillies first round draft choices in 2015 or 2017!

          1. Four of the top 7 prospects in that 2016 draft according to were HS players…..non panned out so far….Pint, Moniak, Rutherford and Groome

      5. 2016 wasn’t a strong draft at the top and there’s nobody who you could look at and say “that’s the guy they should have taken” because most of the really impactful players were late firsts and beyond.

        If Ian Anderson gets right he could be one guy we regret missing but IIRC it was a minor surprise he was taken that high. Looks like Puk has become a good pitcher but injuries relegated him to the ‘pen. Kyle Lewis might be good if he could stay on the field. Jay Groome hasn’t debuted yet but looks close. Garrett and Quantrill look like solid pitchers and that about does it for the top 10, plus a couple guys who were linked to the Phillies at draft time.

        1. There were the two HS position players…… ranked in the top 60 but not in the top 10… infielders .Gavin Lux (37) and Bo Bichette (56).
          It would have been a real reach for the Phillies to take either of them at 1.1

  3. Jim – you have so many things listed in your dates to come, maybe you should add the March WBC dates also. Especially since JT and Bryce, if healthy enough, will be playing in it. Some of our pitchers might ultimately join also.
    I was worried about this road trip and the team played poorly. The pitching looks exhausted and needs to rebound if we’re to make the playoffs.

  4. Tuesday’s game should be a real mile marker contest. Was the just completed west coast trip a hiccup? Or was it just the beginning of a bad bout of COVID? Can Aaron Nola step up to be a slump buster? Or is he destined to be the shrinking violet he’s traditionally been in September?
    And another series with Miami where the Phillies DO NOT miss Sandy Alcantara. It’s just unbelievable his off days never come during a series with the Phils.

    … and with the pitching staff in general, and the BP specifically in flux, I wouldn’t be shocked to see Dave Dombrowski reach for an injection of youth/energy into the pen/team by promoting Griff McGarry and maybe even Andrew Baker. Obviously, this organization is “all in”. All hands need to be on deck.

  5. I wouldn’t mess with McGarry just yet. Would like him to go to the AFL after a rest. I wouldn’t mind seeing Nick Duron promoted. He has been pretty consistent and is only 26. Barring that I am for giving Baker what amounts to a triple promotion. Not done that often.

  6. The reason why Garcia has been a “mammoth disappointment” as NL wrote is basically because we as Phillies Phans expected too much from him and treated him as the second coming of Rollins.

    Sure, he was given a $2.5M bonus but we didn’t heed the words of Dr. Jimmy. Garcia, back in 2018, his first year in the org in the Gulf Coast league batted .369. Naturally, we all got very excited.

    But Mr. Jim, who had seen him play regularly, warned us that the kid was not really that good. He had tons of blemishes and it would take a lot of work for him to succeed. And, as usual, he was correct.

    1. Garcia is yet another one of their recent epic failures from their minor league hitters.

      I am not sure I can remember a minor league season that was a disastrously bad for their hitters as this one was. There was one really good hitter for them in the minor this year – Logan O’Hoppe – and he was traded. Other than that (with some rays of hope in rookie ball), there was very little. Rojas was okay at the end, Guthrie was good, Hall had a nice half, but aside from that, it was seemed like minor to major disappointments all around. I’d have to give them about a D- when it comes to the hitters and if you gave them an F I am not sure I’d argue too much about it. It was really, really bad this year.

      Fortunately, they are getting an A (or A-) when it comes to the pitchers. What a bizarre, night and day difference.

  7. ciada, part of it is that we see LA star players throughout the league, so if we even get a sniff of one, we have him on the All Star team. I am as guilty as anyone, and the amount of the Bonus makes me even more hopeful that our Home Run signing is finally here.

    1. matt…..can be such a crap shoot signing 16-year olds.
      Some teams are able to identify and develop them…Braves and maybe the Dodgers, seem to be the two biggies right now…….and some strike gold on just their one big signing…Soto, Wander Franco and Rafael Devers.
      Phillies just have missed the boat so far.
      Maybe Ranger will take off.

      1. Maybe not as inspirational as the Dodgers or Braves or Marlins, but there might be a few others that did a bit at the major leagues…. Carlos Ruiz, Freddy Galvis, Cesar Hernandez, Maikel Franco, Hector Neris. Plus in addition to Ranger Suarez, Sixto Sanchez(even if not on the Phillies), Simon Muzziotti (sp?), Jhailyn Ortiz, William Bergolla or Starlyn Castro might still be successful! The Phillies scouting has had SOME successes in Latin America, hasn’t it?

        1. Yes….forgot about Chooch from Panama for a $5K bonus.
          Seems their best were low bonus signings….Sixto @ $35k and Ven players Freddy and Cesar less than $100K
          But if you go by WAR…add all those you mention together….and how would that compare to players right now like Acuna, Soto, Albies, et al!
          Phillies have struck out for the last 11 years (Tocci in 2011) on their selected big bonus guys and generally have to hit on the unexpected signings of lesser known players.
          Just look now at Johan Rojas…was not on anyone else’s radar 5 years ago.
          Another low bonus signee.

          1. I agree with Romus. And, I am afraid that Jhailyn Ortiz will be another high Bonus $ signee that does not work out. I did not mean to imply that we have had zero luck in signing Major League players, but rather the Star player has eluded us. And, teams other than the Dodgers and Braves have gotten them.

            1. Tack on the Rays now with Franco…Mariners with JulioRod, Sox got Devers, Padres with Tatis and his warts now……….a lot of those MLB teams get that one big jackpot hit, all-star level hit, on a Latin position player.
              Phillies need to get theirs.

            2. FYI – the White Sox signed Tatis although the Padres were smart enough to trade for him before his value skyrocketed.

            3. Yeah… Tatis was part of that t Shields trade…..Padres saw the potential in him…same with Yoan Moncado….Sox to Sox in the Sale trade.
              WSox also struck gold with ABreu as their first baseman….and ‘Stros getting Yordan A. from the Dodgers minor league system in 2016.

            4. Relative to the LA interchange – in a galaxy far far away and long long ago the Phillies discovered Julio Franco, George Bell, and Juan Samuel. Whatever happened to the scouts that found those players ? or the system that fostered them signing with the team in the first place. Makes one wonder ?

  8. The curse of the 2016 draft strikes again. Zach Collins 1st round, drafted 10th was FDA by the Blue Jays..

    I can’t recall the last time the Phillies didn’t play baseball on Labor Day.

    1. What a weird schedule this year. They didn’t play on July 4th either for like the first time in a century (seriously). Who is putting together this nutty schedule?

  9. Curious what peoples thoughts are here … in the days before pitch counts and innings limits, do you think the Phillies would have considered Andrew Painter for the big club this year?

    I honestly think that if he had capacity to pitch more innings (he’s at 94 for the year and would think he’s capped at 105-110), he could get the call. Crazy to think, but they are desperate for arms.

    1. To refresh my memory I looked up Rick Wise and Larry Christenson. Wise pitched the entire 1964 year at 19 years old with the Phillies. He pitched only 65 innings in 1963 in the minors but then spent all of 1965 and most of 1966 in the minors.

      Christenson pitched part of 1973 at age 19 with the Phillies. So it has been done by the Phillies in the distant past but I don’t want to see Painter up here this year. Let him finish on a high note in the minors and perform well at AAA next year.

        1. I am fine with trying him as a reliever for September and beyond this year. Also, and I’ve said this before, I think Abel would be as good or better than McGarry as a reliever right now. I get that they don’t want to mess Abel him because he’s such a valuable asset (and I respect that), but he could be a very effective major league reliever right now for the stretch run and then they could return him to AAA next year as a starter.

          1. Still think Abel is the guy to promote if they are looking for a power reliever. He’s a bit old than Painter, better control than McGarry and the stuff is electric. Were it not for Painter we would be going more nuts about Abel right now.

    2. Okay, below, I wrote a little piece on how the team has drafted, here’s my quick review on the “Big Three” (Painter, Abel and McGarry).

      1. McGarry has elite stuff. Not good. Not very good. Elite. In terms of pure stuff – he has a plus plus fastball (96-98, touching 99 with plus movement). He also has a plus plus slider and a decent curve and change. But his control/command, while improving, is still below average. His ceiling is David Cone (a near HOFer) or a poor man’s version of Max Scherzer. His floor is either as a high leverage reliever (which would be a waste of his other plus pitches) or a 3/4 who sometimes dominates and sometimes gets hit around (like Edwin Jackson). His most likely outcome is as a 3 with occasional dominating performances, although he could easily become a 2 or better.

      2. Abel. Since Painter passed him and McGarry emerged, he’s been in the shadows a little (I’m guilty of this too). He shouldn’t be. He’s a superb prospect. Like McGarry and Painter, his FB sits 96-98 and touches 99 (I watched each of them pitch this week and other times and, really, they all sit 96-98 and touch 99 or higher). Abel has a plus slider and a good curve. His control is quite a bit better than McGarry’s but he doesn’t have as much movement on his FB. Abel’s most likely outcome is as a 2, although he could be a 3 or an ace too. His ceiling, while he is not likely to reach it, is essentially John Smoltz. Not a bad ceiling, eh?

      3. Painter. He’s the crown jewel. Interestingly, however, right this moment, his pure “stuff” is not quite the equal of the other two. So why is he dominating than the other two? The reason is that Painter has tremendous control and great command of his FB, which sits 96-98 and touches higher. He puts that plus plus pitch wherever he wants. As for secondary stuff, when you watch him pitch, you see he is primarily trying to develop other pitches and it’s a work in progress. His slider varies from decent to plus plus, but he’s only 19 and he’s learning. By next year, I expect a couple of those pitches will be plus to plus plus and he’ll be ready for AAA and the majors. His most likely destination is as 1/2. I would say a 1, but I’d hate to add that burden to him. Still, his ceiling is as the next Justin Verlander or a young Zack Greinke – essentially, a generational pitcher. If he stays healthy and his velocity doesn’t drop, his floor is a 2/3, but I doubt that healthy Painter only becomes a 3.

      1. catch … nice scouting reports. I agree with you on Abel’s FB. IMO, he really has lost the ASR he showed in HS. I’d have him mix in a lot more 2-seamers. Maybe it’s just me, but it seems like he uses the 4-seam FB too much. The 4-seamer may generate a little more velo, but the 2-seamer gives him (or at least in the past has shown) greater movement.
        And I love his SL. When it’s on, that offering is sick. That thing can be dominating.

        Witness the 2-seam FB/sinker as a prepster ⬇

        Now look at the 4-seam FB ⬇. There’s more downward plane on it, and he throws it 2 or 3 ticks harder, but it looks more hittable to me. BTW … check out the SL third pitch into the video (abou tthe 7 second mark).

        1. And when it comes to the 4-seam FB, McGarry’s is exceptional!
          The life is unreal! The pitch carries right up and through the catcher’s glove. That pitch has got similar attributes to Spencer Strider’s FB.

          And lastly, I posted this a couple of weeks ago … BA wrote that only two MLB pitchers match Andrew Painter’s (still just 19 YO) FB characteristics: 96+MPH velo w/> 18″ IVB. Those two MLB pitchers are Gerrit Cole and Dylan Cease!

          1. Should have said Painter’s FB has characteristics matched by only two MLB *SPs. I would imagine Edwin Diaz (and a couple other relievers) has the velo and IVB to match.

  10. Well, the Brewers won last night, lowering our lead to 2. And, I hope, convincing the team that we actually have to win games. We can’t count on Milwaukee losing every game. I know they are pushing their narrative that this a different group of players, but Nola and Hoskins aren’t new, new guy Castellanos is on the IL, the only recent good SP performance was from Bailey Falter, the BP looks gassed, Bryce hasn’t exactly come back from the IL and hit HRs every game, and I will still root and talk myself into believing that we make the Playoffs, but I am honestly a long way from being confident.

  11. Here’s my 30,000 view on our drafting/selecting pitchers and hitters.

    1. For pitchers, the team has focused most on raw tools. For pitchers, that means velocity and perhaps also flashing another plus pitch. I’m not saying they aren’t looking for other stuff, but they want guys who throw hard and are not focused too much on control. For those following at home, this approach is exactly the OPPOSITE of what Johnny Almaraz was looking for (he wanted pitchers who had good control and velocity was secondary – which resulted in a ton of low upside draft picks).

    2. Just as with the pitchers, for hitters, the team has focused most on raw tools. This means, they are looking for athletic players who are fast and have significant power potential. They have not been overly focused on the hit tool. Again, for those following the team, this approach is also exactly the OPPOSITE of what Johnny Almaraz was looking for (he was focused on the hit tool to the exclusion of almost everything else – which turned out poorly, especially since he wasn’t good at evaluating the hit tool in his prospects).

    3. So how is it going? Very mixed. Here’s the bottom line, I think you can teach a pitcher who throws hard to improve his control, but it’s hard to teach a guy to throw harder. And, guess what, so far, their approach has been working like a charm with the pitchers.

    4. For the hitters, however, it’s been kind of a disaster. To be a really good hitter, you need to be able to hit – make contact. The power and plate discipline are super important too, but you have to hit and I think it’s exceedingly difficult to “teach” a guy who otherwise doesn’t make good contact how to be a hitter. It’s not a coincidence that guys like Bohm, Stott, Maton and Vierling have succeeded in the minors whereas guys like Casey Martin and Jhailyn Ortiz have not.

    I hope they are learning their lesson. It looks like the most recent draft featured hitters with a good hitting record, not just raw athleticism. We shall see.

    1. Exactly:
      4. In baseball, if you cannot make contact…you are kaputski.

      I am keeping my fingers-crossed with Marsh…his MiLB K rate of 24% is a little higher than I would want…then again his BB rate is 11% which for many minor leaguers is above average.

    2. Regarding your last few sentences, that may be true of Crawford and Boyd. Let’s hope so. We’ll see on Rincones. But all the later bats strike out a ton, so they still love guys with tools who can’t make contact. Cade Fergus has 49 Ks in 86 ABs. Schreffler, Ricketts and Leitch are whiff machines too.

      1. There are concerns everywhere. I was on record that I was not too big of a fan of the Crawford pick. Hmmm . . . with their first pick, the Phillies select an athletic, toolsy, fast, outfielder. Where have I heard this before and, more importantly, when was there a happy ending to that story? Oh yeah, pretty much never, right? So I clearly wasn’t doing cartwheels over that one. I am not burying the guy, I’m just saying it doesn’t smell great from a distance.

        1. I’m right with you. I’d say he passed his first test but we’ll know a lot more when he starts in full season ball next year. And we’ll know pretty much right away if he’s a legit prospect. He’ll either show that he belongs or he pulls a Moniak/ Randolph / Larry Greene and sends up red flags.

          1. While I’d love to disagree with you, I can’t. You’re entirely right. If he doesn’t make a lot of contact or draws no walks, chances are it will never work out. People don’t understand this about hitting prospects. While there are always rare exceptions, especially in the lower minors, good hitting prospects generally start hitting right away. The guy who can’t hit a breaking ball or never draws a walk or can’t catch up to high heat, generally does not make the majors or have a decent big league career.

  12. It’s easy to complain about the defensive issues this team has but we knew what we were getting the day they signed the two corner OFs. We didn’t know that Harper would be the DH but we were certain the outfield would be weak. We thought the corners would make up for lack of defense with homers and RBIs. We got some of that but a lot of Ks and less power than anticipated. Three and four years of this to go. I just hope that the next few seasons show good results.

    My hope is that the Phillies are up three games on the Brewers when they end the season with three games in Houston. If the Astros are playing for the top seed in the AL, that series will be tough to win or even to get one game out of it (as seen with the Giants). There are 7 games left with the Nats and 6 with the Marlins. The Nats are much, much improved to compete with the Phils and the Marlins have enough pitching to shut them down. We can’t count the chickens here.

    1. As the Phillies were losing games this weekend, I began thinking about this Houston series.

      The Astros have a comfortable 11-game lead over the Mariners in their division race and an equally comfortable 6-game lead over the Yankees for the top seed as well as the tiebreaker by virtue of their 5-2 season record against the Yankees.

      The Astros may not need to win games in that series, but they might not see a need to rest players. The series with the Phillies runs from 10/3 thru 10/5.

      The ALDS starts on 10/11. The Phillies may have to face the Astros’ top 3 pitchers in those final 3 games.

      One bizarre note: while the Astros are 5-2 against the Yankees, they are 5-10 against the rest of the AL East.

    1. You wonder with Garcia if there was something more than just poor hitting. He won’t turn 22 until October, was given a $2M plus bonus and was “promoted” to Reading for six games. Then don’t let the door hit you in the you know where.

    1. 8 in a row, Garcia, Zimmer, Vasquez, Tyler Cyr, Sam Clay, Oscar Mercado, James Norwood, Roman Quinn

      1. In a way that’s a good thing since it means there’s some depth of talent here. Detroit is a high waiver priority so Garcia didn’t make it far. There’s probably hope for him yet though time is running out.

  13. I was pretty optimistic but I see no reason why this year is different than September’s of the last few years.
    Philadelphia Collapsers should be the Phillies new name 😦

    1. Well, if they only win 13 games this month as they did in the previous two Septembers…..then a 86-76 record will be their final entry.
      And another play-off less year.
      They have the 16 left vs Nats (7), Marlins (6) and Cubs (3)….a .620 % would give them 10 wins vs those teams….that is a minimum for those less than .500 teams

  14. I can’t even say you are trolling, TrollU, because I was optimistic heading to Arizona, and am pretty pessimistic today. There is a good deal of chatter that we may see both McGarry and Eflin in the Phils’ BP before we say so long to September. That would be very interesting to see.

  15. We will know soon…..these two guys better step it up, put on their big boy pants, or it could make for a very uneasy off-season for them

    1. Hoskins’ Sept….424 PAs…slash .204/318./447
    2. Nola Sept….W-9 — L-14…..ERA-4.60….HR allowed 32

  16. You know, Romus, I have, forever, been on the side that is opposed to trading Nola or Hoskins. But, you laid it out pretty clearly. Although any decision to trade them is totally separate, the point remains that this team needs much better Septembers from them both, than what they have produced, and we are not looking at small sample sizes. Fatigue, bumps and bruises, all of that is irrelevant, as it’s every player at the end of a long season. But, we need those 2 to step up their games, produce enough adrenalin to overcome fatigue, etc., and perform in the stretch. That hasn’t happened yet.

    1. matt13…..Dave D will get to see how it turns out for the team and the key players in this stretch drive.
      I guess we all know…..if they fail to reach the play-offs again…..he will make the changes, and most likely not around the margins with the role players.
      He will shake up the team.

  17. Guthrie will be the 8th Phillies 2017 draft pick to appear in the majors. That’s the good news. The bad news is that Connor Brogden leads them all with 2.1 career WAR, and collectively those 8 have produced a grand total of 1.5 career WAR.

  18. Whether they win or lose this game, Rob Thomson misplayed his hand beginning in the 7th inning. IMO he should have allowed Nola (at 97 pitches) to finish the 7th inning (made no sense to go LHP vs RHH). Then let Alvarado (who is one of your two best relievers with Ser-Ant’ny out) handle the eighth inning. Then have Robertson close.

    And the Schwarber/Hoskins/Alvarado threesome has gone MIA.

    1. Agree Hinkie. Not sure why he keeps using Alvarado for 5 pitches when he’s their 2nd best reliever right now.

      Also need to shuffle the top of the lineup.

      1. My bad. Schwarber/Hoskins/Harper. And Harper really almost blew it in the 9th when he didn’t bust it out of the box. Agree with 3up. Thomson needs to re-do the lineup.

        1. Stott
        2. Bohm
        3. Harper
        4. Realmuto
        5. Schwarber
        6. Hoskins
        7. Segura
        8. Vierling
        9. Marsh

        1. Yeah, Anderson doesn’t lose his footing there, Harper is 0 – 4 and he was almost out at 2nd for not hustling. Like your proposed lineup.

        2. Hinkie – I agree with you re: Harper ? What in the world is he standing there looking at the ball and coasting down to first ? That almost cost them the game as the play at 2B was close and it should not have been !!!!!!

          1. Don’t think he was watching it as much as he was mad at himself for popping it up to LF but agree that’s no reason to not be running it out.

            He acknowledged it after the game in the interview I saw.

  19. By only using Alvarado for one batter, it allows him to pitch Robertson for two innings. I really hope that doesn’t ever happen again.

  20. Thomson seems to leaning on Robertson heavily when Dominguez got hurt. The Phillies need Dominguez back real soon. Hopefully, he’s back on the 13th but I expect the Phillies will really baby him i.e. no back to back stints to start.

  21. Luis Garcia, after being claimed by the Tigers, is now #24 on their top 30.

    Andrew Baker has now entered the Phillies top 30.

        1. They have Francisco Morales 11th. Wouldn’t surprise me at all to see Baker in the top 15.

          I personally wouldn’t put relievers that high in most cases but the MLB list doesn’t seem to care.

          1. We have had a whole bunch of highly touted L.A. arms that ultimately turned into nothing. Although I think Morales has a better shot of succeeding than guys like Medina, I think it’s a 50/50 proposition that he turns into an above average major league reliever. And, yes, you have to put Baker above him. Baker throws laser beams. He sits 98-100 and seems to be developing an off speed pitch. The Ken Giles comp isn’t bad. That said, he throws harder than Giles did at the time (although, not by that much) and he hasn’t developed a solid second offering yet as Giles ultimately did. When he does develop that reliable second pitch, he should move toward the big leagues very quickly.

            1. catch … I use the Ken Giles comp because he not only was drafted out of JUCO, but Baker has the same big, 100 MPH FB/sharp SL combo. I think his breaker is further along than you seem to.

            2. has it as a 50 grade pitch. The quality of that second pitch could be the difference between Baker becoming the next Ken Giles as opposed to the next Sam Coonrod.

            3. Hinkie – maybe you’re right. I think when I saw him, the main issue was consistency and lack of control, but he if he can get consistent with controlling the breaking ball, it seems the pitch itself is quite good.

            4. BaKer’s CB has all the bite and break of a 60 or better pitch……trouble is, does not stay come out looking like a strike enough.
              He needs to get ahead in the count on his FB.
              He would be better to perfect and develop a cut FB or 2Smr.
              Not sure how his change-up is.

  22. The Rockies do the Phillies a solid by scoring 9 runs in the final 3 innings to shock the Brewers at Coors Field.

    1. On the other hand, a catcher for the Padres named Alfaro set the Padres team season-record for walk off hits as they made a huge come-back to win.

  23. Glad to see Seranthony and Eflin air it out yesterday.
    Both seemed fine and admitted it…..but will see how they feel this morning.
    Phillies will need both over the last few weeks.

  24. Over 50% of minor leaguers voted to join the MLBPA.
    Only 30% required.
    MLB ownerships turn to make their move.
    Look for minor league game prices to soar,
    ….and more importantly , look for smaller farm systems in the future.

  25. And, while I’m at it complaining about the Phillies approach to signing and drafting talent – with a focus almost exclusively on “athleticism” – I’ll add Yhoshwar Garcia to the list of what I think will ultimately be seen as foolish signings. They spent $2.5 million on a twenty year old who has no power and a poor hit tool.

    Like I’ve said, they have nailed the pitchers recently (which is awesome! I give them full credit for this), but have done EXTREMELY poorly in signing, drafting and developing hitters. I am not sure how much of this is the fault of the development staff, but I am pretty sure that, with hitters, they are just not focused on the right things when they select players to draft or sign.

    1. Hopefully Bergolla and Perez can buck that trend among LA guys. Both are seriously lacking power but seem to have good bat to ball skills. Also NPG impressed with a 1:1 strikeout to walk ratio, facing a lot of older and probably more experience pitchers.

      1. Both players have had an encouraging start, which is great. However, I’ve learned over time not to put too much stock (either good or bad) in DSL and rookie league performances (see Luis Garcia and Rhys Hoskins). I really start trusting what I’m seeing when a player starts at Clearwater.

        1. Hao Yu Lee is, in my opinion, for real and, personally, given that he appears to have a great hit tool and power potential, I might have him ranked ahead of Rojas and certainly ahead of Crawford for now. Being a great position prospect mostly means being a very good offensive player. Lee has the most demonstrated offensive potential of our prospects. Others may ultimately perform, but he’s shown he can.

          1. Full season ball is definitely a separator. We’ve seen plenty of guys suddenly look overmatched there after being solid even in the old short-season A level facing college players.

            On the other hand, rookie level stats are all we have to go on for those guys, along with scouting reports and bonus money. In a system this weak offensively they’re just about all we have. I get having Lee ahead of Crawford but I still have to give the edge to the first round pick with added value from defense and base running. For now anyway. If Lee kept up a .900 OPS all year I might feel differently but he never really got going again after he came back from injury.

    2. Catch, Garcia did one thing for me. I learned how to pronounce his name — Jo Aw Shwar. Who’d a thunk it?

      Actually, I saw Garcia play in what was probably the best series of his career earlier this year and have to say that if he can maintain that level of play, he’ll be, well, a great base-running, light-hitting outfielder. As though we don’t have those guys throughout the organization.

  26. I wanted to see something from Nola last night, and I did, so I have to give him kudos for his performance. JTR’s ability to throw out runners was a huge part of the W. I can’t understand, at all, what Harper was doing standing there staring at the ball, and Robertson cannot pitch more than 1 inning. Segura really came through, and you could feel the emotion through the screen. He was genuinely pissed they walked JTR to get to him, and that was not showmanship, but real emotion. And, I think Morales has been a huge disappointment. I don’t have him anywhere close to 11.

      1. skeet, good question. I thought he did a really good job for us, up until his last few appearances where he seems to have lost command. Is that a product of running out of steam? That seems to be a common theme lately, He, Ranger, Robertson, all having trouble throwing strikes. I think we will have at least 3 new faces in the the BP in significant roles next season. 1 may be Griff. I have almost forgotten that we once had Familia and Knebel as high leverage relievers.

        1. BP is just an area that for whatever reason the Phillies just cannot get right.
          It was my biggest concern at the start of the season. It is almost always a tense moment. Luke Williams bailed Robertson out last night.
          Hand is nowhere near what he was a few years ago. He might be a middle inning guy going forward but he is kind of like Hector. Rarely does he throw strikes.

        2. Griff’s highest and best use is as a starter. If they move him the the bullpen permanently, that would be a waste of a potentially outstanding asset and I don’t believe they will waste him.

          With Hand, he could easily be back, but let’s see how he finishes the season. Robertson is being stretched farther than he should due to unusual circumstances. Under the right contract and with a confined role (one inning in the 7th or 8th), he would be fine to have back.

    1. Hi Matt. I got to watch last night. I thought Nola was good. JTs throws are great. But one thing I have often wondered here is that many do not hold Segura in very high regard. I think he is the best defensive player on the field. Also, he is to me maybe the most clutch hitter as well. He does not come through all the time, but he is a tough out almost always in key situations. Not all of our guys are that.
      Most important is all the wins are important now. The one thing that still bugs me with the lineup is that with Schwarber and Rhys at the top there are just so many times when no one is on base for the middle of the lineup.
      Schwarber is totally all or nothing. I am sure he is going to reach the 200 Ks for the season. I have never been a Rhys fan hitting 2nd. Oh well.

  27. in the giving credit where credit is due, Dept, Sosa, last night, in addition to providing most of the offense, IMO deserves a LOT of the credit for the caught-stealing of Williams in the 9th inning, by catching Realmuto’s one hop throw and applying a perfect tag. And perhaps some of that credit could go to the people who got him into the lineup in the first place.

    1. Sosa is another one of those “around the margin” moves that separate a good GM from a bad one. It’s not a major move/addition but he’s an upgrade off the bench over what they had.

      1. Edmundo Sosa is still only 26. Looks like he needed a change of scenery and the Phillies are reaping the rewards (0.6 WAR in 20 games). He was a 3 WAR player last season for the Cardinals.

        Put Sosa and Maton in a platoon at 2B to start 2023. The Phillies need to find out what they have in both these players.

        1. I agree completely. I like Maton a lot and have a sense that management does too. Spend the money on pitching.

          1. Yes. Of course the other side of the Sosa coin is the Phillies either not being confident in what Jo Jo Romero would pitch like after recovering from TJS, or not being willing to wait, and needing to replace a left handed pitcher.

  28. I heart and 3up, I agree with you both. I think Matt Gelb, or one of the writer’s said the same thing about Sosa’s tag on Williams. Yes, JT’s throw was on the money, but that was a great tag. And, he has certainly be a big help to the team, last night ” big help” is a gross understatement. Don, I knew when we signed Schwarber that unless there was another move, like a lead off hitting CF, that their plan was to bat him leadoff. Yes, his HRs have been big, but we have to be better going forward at leadoff. And, Rhys is 2 because of some notion that he has a great eye, and they want him taking pitches, and getting BBs, and I have always thought he is better batting 6th. It’s not like he BBs over 100 times. I think he is on pace for what?, something like 75? And, I think it makes his less aggressive when I want to see him attacking the first good pitch, not looking them over. But, I don’t make out the lineup card. And, it is time for our MVP to get hot and carry this team, starting tonight.

  29. Matt one other point on them. If they do get on 1st they are no threat to steal a base. So, it takes 2 hits to get them in. It would be nice for Bryce to pick things up but an injury like his just takes time. Hopefully less than more.

  30. Rockies beat Brewers this afternoon so Phillies can pick up a game if they can put Miami away tonight. These so called “gimme” games against sub .500 teams are going to be a whole lot tougher than many think.

  31. matt gelb piece in Athletic today about trying to get Nola more rest this year- only 11 starts on regular rest, down from prior years.
    This season, Nola has a 4.14 ERA in 67 1/3 innings when pitching on regular rest. He now has a 2.86 ERA in 110 innings with extra rest

    Braves just make me sick/jealous- 9k in 6ip for Strider today- has a chance to make it 200 k’s for season in about 130 innings. Meanwhile Harris and Grissom through a combined about 425 major league at bats, roughly 316-26-66 with 20 steals.

    1. Yeah, the Braves do make you sick, don’t they?

      The most frustrating thing with so many of these Braves prospects is that when they turn a corner in the minors, they are essentially ready for the big leagues straight away. The Braves promote the player, plug him in and, he plays like an elite veteran right away. Meanwhile, our position prospects have to go every level and experience growing pains and then slowly develop into decent major leaguers at the big league level. How do the Braves do this? Where do they find these guys? And it’s not like this is a new thing. This has been going on for like 25 years or so, at least since Andruw Jones (who also sprinted through the minors) and on through Freddie Freeman and so on. And most of these guys aren’t top 10-15 picks. Strider was a 4th rounder. Grissom was chosen, I think, in the 11th round. Harris was a 3rd rounder. Meanwhile, “toolsy” guys like Casey Martin can’t hit their way out of a paper bag in A ball. Frustrating!!!

      1. I get a feeling this is how football fans outside of Philadelphia feel about the Eagles. Imagine Giants and Commanders fans ranting about how the Eagles got Jordan Mailata with a 7th round pick. At least I tell myself that so I can feel better about the Braves and Phillies.

      2. 1 difference, catch, when it comes to hitters, is the often discussed love for “athletic” prospects, when the most important trait to look for is the ability to actually hit the baseball.

        1. Yes, the ability to hit, hit for power and exercise good plate discipline are probably the 3 most important attributes for a player. I never heard anyone wax poetic about Ted Williams, Harmon Killebrew’s or Jim Thome’s “athleticism” – but they did more than alright don’t you think?

          1. exactly, and catch, I don’t discount power, but I would sure like one of those line drive gap hitters. When I think of just drafting for power I get Larry Greene. And, I think plate discipline is part of being able to hit. Probably only Ichiro, or Tony Gwynn, could hit those breaking pitches that bounced up there.

  32. We need to thank Sosa for this W. I would say he was a really good pick up! It would be nice to get something out of Schwarber, Hoskins and Harper. I know Bryce was out for a long while and maybe his power isn’t back but his head needs to be in the game.

  33. Hinkie….I see the DELCO kid from Monsignor Bonner, Upper Darby is ranked 7th among HS players for next year’s draft. H may be the highest ranked DELCO kid since Ben Davis in the mid-90s

    7. Kevin McGonigle, SS/2B, Monsignor Bonner HS (Pa.)
    A member of the USA Baseball 18U team, McGonigle just hits. Everywhere he goes, he shows off a professional approach and extremely impressive bat-to-ball skills, including during PDP League play and the High School All-American Game. He’s a solid left-handed-hitting middle infielder who might end up at second base, where he could take after his favorite player, Chase Utley.

    1. Yeah, Romus. Two straight summers excelling on the showcase circuit. I’ve heard him comp’d (by multiple people) to Cole Young, the HS MIF from Pittsburgh who got drafted by Seattle @ 1-21 this summer.

      1. One of his teammates told me the Yankees have been scouting him heavily for the last few years…..wonder if the Phillies would be interested in him if he were available when their turn came up.

        1. Under Brian Barber, they’ve only picked prep players in the first round so I’d say he’ll get consideration. However, Barber also has a thing for taller (and more projectable) prospects. I think (w/o going back to look) Barber has only drafted two players across three drafts under 6-feet tall. McGonigle is 5’11”.
          The kid I love for next summer (other than Dylan Cruz, of course) is Hurston Waldrep. I wrote about him in my Phillies Way Too Early Mock in July. Waldrep was a dominant SP for Southern Miss, but has transferred to Florida for the 2023 season. He has a big FB, and wicked secondaries. He’s going to shoot up draft boards next season so not very optimistic he becomes a Phillie.

  34. Edmundo Sosa:
    Not sure all that went on in St Louis with Sosa….but glad he was picked up by Dave D…….this could be a real find. Perhaps it was a numbers game out there with Gorman stepping into 2B now and DeJong entrenched at shortstop. And , I do not think it was a personality thing like Munoz’s quick departure in spring training last year.
    Nevertheless, I am glad Dave D traded for him.
    Sosa was signed as a 16-year-old by the Cardinals for $425K during the July 2012 international signing period. That was the biggest bonus payment to a Panamanian player that year. As an amateur, he showed good eye-hand coordination, a level swing, and good bat control. At the time, as a defender, he showed good range and the instincts and arm to remain at shortstop.
    In 2013, playing for the Cardinals’ team in the DSL, he hit .314 in 169 at-bats, with a .396 on-base percentage and an OPS of .846. And he continued his good hitting metrics all the way up thru their system…though the Cardinals seem to delay some of his promotions within their system….perhaps due to injuries, I do not know.
    His minor league metrics indicated a above average MLB middle infielder player in the making.–000edm

    1. Agreed. It was the type of move a very good GM like DD would make. Sosa has a decent history in the minors. He hit 17 homers in AAA in 2019 and also for a decent average. The only thing you can knock him for is that his walk rates are historically much too low. But with some power and plus fielding, he’s a very nice find, even though I was disappointed to lose Romero, who has done very well out of the big league Cardinals bullpen so far.

    2. Actually, it was Tommy Edman and Brendan Donovan that made Sosa expendable. Edman moved over to SS when Gorman arrived and has been one of the best players in the NL with a 6 WAR to this point of the season. Donovan has also excelled at multiple infield positions, just not to the extent as Edman.

      DeJong has spent more time in the minors than majors this year, as he wasn’t hitting enough. The Cards might end up trading DeJong in the offseason for another bad contract.

      For sure, it was a shrewd move by Dombrowski to acquire Sosa, as he provides a lot of flexibility, now and in the future, to make further moves. It was widely reported that Boston and NYY tried hard to acquire Sosa at the deadline but the Phillies beat them to the punch. I’ll be curious to see how much he’s utilized, going forward.

  35. Ser’A pitches in a rehab for LHV tonight, and according to Matt Gelb, may need only the one outing. Eflin pitches tomorrow, and his plan, and I am assuming it’s the team’s also, is for him to pitch out of the BP down the stretch. Maybe in an opener role? We can use them both, and it would be a nice boost. Just getting Ser’A back healthy will be a big help.

  36. A lot of us thought Camargo was the cat’s meow just a few months ago. I don’t see him as a Phillie next season. Let’s hold judgement on Sosa until he’s played more.

    Amazing how Romero pitched for the Phillies compared to what he has been doing for the Red Birds so far. Both stints are SSS but the Cards have a way of tapping into talent.

    Logan O’Hoppe is carrying about the same type of stats for the Angels’ AA team as he did in Reading. I’ve got a feeling that he might just be on LA’s roster next season.

    1. O’Hoppe has played a good deal better for the Angels. He has a 1.146 OPS for their AA team in close to 90 ABs. He had an .889 OPS for Reading. He was the type of catching prospect that comes along in a system maybe every 10 or 15 years. It was really sad to see him go and, no, Marchan is nowhere close to being his equal because Marchan is not a very good offensive player right now.

      1. Phillies have invested in 18-year old Perez…and he could be the one at a later point of time. But so many things can happen before then.
        Will like to see what they do with Sands come Nov 18

        1. I’m a fan of Sands. You wonder if he can become a guy who can play catcher, first and the outfield. The Yankees have had guys like that over the years who could hit a ton.

          1. Sands may have that ability to play other positions…he has played some 3B in the past and 1B……LF should not be an issue.
            What I have been rather surprised of lately in the majors and some other teams I have been watching have been doing it, taking infielders and throwing them out into the OF….without them ever playing the OF in the minors, other than shag balls during batting practice.
            Even the Phillies put Vierling at 2B one time
            I guess the assumption is, if a guy is athletic enough and a MLB player, he should be able to adapt at other positions.

            1. What was wild to me was when the Dodgers took big, beefy Max Muncy and threw him in the mix at second base and, overall, he was pretty decent (Phillies game screw-up aside).

            2. Think it has more to do with the idea that in the world of 3-true outcomes, many teams have devalued defense in exchange of getting the better bat in the line-up.

              I don’t necessarily agree with that approach and think it’s one of the reasons the Phillies have failed to get over the playoff hump for the last decade.

            3. 3up…….one of the reasons I had heard why players were going to the TTO approach was because of the defensive shifts that were becoming the analytic norm.
              Players had to get it over the shift vs trying to get it thru the maze of defenders on the one side of the field.
              To get it over those players….the LA and lift became the thing to do.
              And what that did was create more strikeouts on the upper-cutting approach and of course yuo could have mre HRs…when the balls were juiced.

  37. I was watching the end of the game last night and wondered what happened with Mark Appel. I know it was only a few outings that I saw before I missed most of the summer games, but he was pretty good in those games. It just came to mind as I watched Brogdon thread softly through that last inning. Thanks.

      1. Romus…he is from Franklin. He is a stud. Probably unlikely. Franklin is a 4A school in Indiana. 4A is the top class. Although Franklin is one of the smaller in that group.

        My grandson team was 2A this year. Their basketball team got bumped up to 3A but I never heard on the baseball team. Some schools who are close bounce back and forth plus Indiana has a success factor that plays into it as well.

        Franklin is only about an hour or so from here. My granddaughter played in a couple of softball tournaments down there last Summer.

        The conference and most of the games they play are North of Indy. I have not seen a schedule printout for next season. They do play Hagerstown who had the team in the LLWS a couple weeks ago.

        1. Don…ok, but you never know though, he could see him on a traveling team or on the AAU circuit if your grandson is within that two year age window

          1. Romus…it would be more likely that it would be possibly in a hs tourney of some kind. Almost all of the travel teams play in their age group. Grandson will be in 16U next season. In Indiana they go up to 17U mostly and then the graduating seniors play kind of a pre-college type season at various sites around. Grand Park has a league for them. Kokomo has a league for them. I am sure there are others in the state as well.

            My daughter did believe the Canadian All-Star team was old for the tourney last Summer. She said several had full beards. Kind of difficult for 15s. My grandson said they were the best he faced.

            1. LOL…those Canadiens…..’several had full beards’….they skipped puberty, .it must be all the Beaver Tail they eat..

  38. Here is a question for anyone. Does anyone feel that the Phillies will promote any or more of these top young pitchers going down the stretch? I know some of you have had the luxury to watch them pitch some this summer. My throughs are that if they are ready to get major league hitters out why not bring them up if necessary.

    I know some will bring up the time starting for arbitration and free agency. But they only have so many pitches in those arms so why waste them on AA hitters.

    Some of the other leagues have no issue strictly on age. If a kid can compete at the highest level, they play. Just wondering if any see promotions. Thanks.

    1. Don…if Seranthony, Eflin and Wheeler are ready to go and remain healthy…I can only see one being added to the 40….McGarry…and that would be if guys like Brogdon, Bellatti, Hand, Sanchez or Nelson start stumbling.

      1. I have been super busy with the concession stuff. Two more events. One started tonight.
        Clark is committed to Vandy. Doubtful if high pick.
        Just saw online McGary is to pitch for Iron Pigs.
        I tried to look and see what class my grandson team is for next year in baseball but no luck.
        I did see open field baseball practice began this week
        Open gym basketball began last week. He is back at it. He had about 2 to 3 weeks off.

  39. I agree with Romus, Don. I thought there was more of a chance for McGarry, but with Ser’A and now Eflin heading for the BP, I think McGarry’s chances have lessened. I don’t see a call up for Painter or Abel at all.

    1. Hi Matt. The Phillies have to figure out a way to make the playoffs. It would be a disaster if they fail again. I think DD will do whatever is necessary to achieve that end result.
      I watched last night, and it sure seemed to me that the dugout had NO other options with any degree of confidence in the 9th. I too hope that those 3 return and can help. but what is they do not? There has to be a Plan B and it now almost has to come from within. One has to think that McGary will be 1st since he is pitching for the Irion Pigs now.
      If these guys are as good as most of you say they are I have no problems with them helping out. Look at the Nats and Braves. They pulled youngsters up to fill voids and they won. Plus, every move the Braves made last season turned to Gold. Maybe Sosa can be that for the Phillies. He definitely plays with confidence and energy.

  40. Guys, it appears that the MLB Rules Committee is set to meet and vote on changes for the 2023 season. It is expected to pass from what I read, the vote being a mere formality according to MLBTR. With the pick off rules, 2 attempts, this would seem to favor speed guys and encourage stealing bases. Also, the 2 fielders, on the infield grass, and 2 on each side of 2d base seems to be a pretty bold move. I am in favor of it, but didn’t expect it to be a fair accompli. What are your thoughts?

  41. Getting easier to decide which pitcher should be replaced in the rotation when Wheeler gets back.

  42. Free game on Defend Gibson all you want. He is not worth 7,8,9 million a season. The guy is maddening to watch. Move on to somebody else.

  43. Think interim manager needs to have a team conversation about making assumptions. Another failure to run from a team veteran leader.

  44. Now I wish he had walked the lead off hitter. I also wish Hoskins had caught that ground ball. And Robertson does not have “closer stuff”.

  45. As the Phillies coughed up the lead in the 9th inning, I heard the dogs in the park barking. I said to myself, “how appropriate”.

    And where have you gone Bryce Harper?

  46. Simply a game you have to win. Two areas of major concern reared their ugly heads again. Defense and BP. You just simply have to have someone who can get 3 outs at the end of the game. It seems even when they do it takes 20 some pitches and then they are out a day or two.
    I do not see the answer in the present guys they have in the BP. Hope I am wrong.

  47. Tough loss. Can’t score 5 off Alcantara and lose, but we are getting nothing from Bryce or Schwarber, and Hoskins just butchered that ground ball.

  48. I know Hoskins was a key offensive performer tonight you just can’t make that error. He had terrible form and should have just squared up on the ball and kept it in front of him. He had no other play. It’s beyond me how a major leaguer can make that type of mistake. This is just one reason they must move on from him. They need better defense there and more lineup flexibility. Too many DH’s already on this team. I appreciate his time and offensive ability but trade him for decent value and move on.

  49. Hoskins should have fielded the ball in the 9th inning, but similar to what might be said if Nicky C had made a bad fielding play in the same situation…. what was Hoskins doing at first base in the 9th inning of a home game with a one-run lead?

    1. true, could have put Sosa at third and moved Bohm to first, especially with Hoskins having batted in the 8th.
      Brewers lose Peralta and Lauer hurting too.

  50. Phillies probably had no business winning that game anyways…..Bleday’s one blatant miscue open the door for them…should have been end of inning. Then there was his ill-fated dive for Bohm’s hit.

    1. That is true. But it seems so often when I get a chance to watch the Phillies rarely score on the other teams BP. Conversely it seems the other team most often scores on the Phillies BP.

      I am working with an 8-year old grandson now on the play that Rhys had.
      The best players are the ones who know at all times what they are going to do in each situation if the ball is hit to them. That is one of the things the 15- year old is so good at doing. Rhys knew he had NO play at 3rd. He just took a horrible route to the ball. Plus, the ball was not hit very hard. But Kruk said Wendle would hit the ball to that side to move the runner up. Because he plays the game the right way.
      Agree on Bleday but when a team gift wraps a game for you it is imperative you take advantage. Hopefully that is not the difference on the final day of the season.

      1. Don…believe it or not…until the first of Sept….Rhys was second in SDI in the NL.
        Christian Walker ARI 10.4
        Rhys Hoskins PHI 3.1
        C.J. Cron COL 2.0
        Matt Olson ATL 1.1
        Paul Goldschmidt STL -0.4
        Freddie Freeman LAD -0.5
        Eric Hosmer SDP -1.0
        Michael Chavis PIT -1.2
        Josh Bell WSN/SDP -1.7
        Joey Votto CIN -2.0
        Rowdy Tellez MIL -2.1
        Pete Alonso NYM -3.5

        1. Romus…I do not feel Rhys is a bad 1B. I think overall he does ok. Simply on the play last night he has to field that ball and just get 1 out at 1B. That keeps all other things still available. I always coach the young kids to get 1 out on a play. Do not try to do too much. I think he thought if he charged the ball, he might have a play at 3B. In fact, he has made some really nice plays recently. The thing is that ball was a potential game winning play. I guess as it turned out it was a game winning play for the Marlins.

          1. Don……..IMO, Rhys has a problem with processing thought at times, his inability to apperceive when different situations (non-routine) occur often result in taking attention away from a task and diverting his attention to another. His diversion last night was 3rd base over fielding the ball. He is adequate at 1B as long as everything is static or routine. Bad bounce, high throw, foul fly down the line, throw to 2nd with runner in the way, …..not so much. I think it affects his bat also, but to a lessor extent. Sitting on a pitch, waiting for the right pitch, didn’t get it, strike 3.

  51. Sure, Romus, but a good team capitalizes on mistakes like that. We have not progressed to be called a good team yet. An above average one, yes, one that should make the Playoffs, yes, but not yet what I consider good. Too much poor defense, lack of clutch hitting and Pitching uncertainty. We still need to make the Playoffs, somehow.

  52. Matt, I agree with all you said. At this point even if they get in and I think they must get in or this is a total lost season this team is not going very far. Just no consistency in so many areas
    It is 3 teams for 2 spots. Probably in the end it will be defense and pitching that puts 2 of the teams in. Those 2 areas give me cause for concern..

  53. In the past couple of weeks, the Phillies have played some really poor games in all areas. The players and manager say that they just need to “flush” those games and move on. If that’s the case, the toilet is now really clogged and more than a plunger is needed to get this team back on track. Anyone have a snake or maybe some Draino?

  54. We need Ser’A back, healthy, and a healthy Wheeler. We need Harper to get out of whatever funk he’s in, and we need Schwarber to do something other than race towards 200 Ks. And, I don’t want to harp on it, so this is the last mention, but Hoskins cannot butcher a routine play by failing to have his glove on the ground, have his feet out of position, and take a poor route to the ball, which was a simple grounder. Sure, Robertson gave up a lead off 2B, but we could have been tied going into the bottom of the 9th, even if that guy scored. And guess what, a runner on 3rd base, and 1 out. How many times have we failed to score a runner from 3rd with less than 2 outs? More than I want to think about. Just a horrible play.

  55. Matt, I hope the pitchers can contribute. As constructed at the moment it will be a major struggle to grab that 6th spot. I do think 6th is better than 5th. Avoid either Mets or Braves in 1st round. Your point of a runner on 3rd and 1 out is what I was alluding to earlier. Lots of teams not just the Phillies fail to score in that situation. Maybe a pop up or strikeout or even line drive at someone. Maybe Rhys thought the ball was hit harder off the bat. I have no idea what the thought process was but as I tell the youngsters get an out.

    Matt and Romus. I learned something last night as I was trying to find what baseball class my grandson team is in this year in Indiana. I did not find out that. I even texted both my daughter and grandson but guess they were at some Open something. No reply back. But I found out that his basketball team will play on December 30 at Gainbridge Fieldhouse. That is where the Pacers play. That will be cool. Some strings had to be pulled for that. Maybe because the girls’ team has been to that State Finals 2 of the last 3 years. Had his team stayed in Class 2A rather than being moved to 3A they would have had a chance to make the Finals. Oh well. Four of the top six players are Sophomores so they have some time. Maybe add a couple transfers for the cause.

  56. Matt. You were correct on the rule changes for 2023. Jeff Passan has article on ESPN now. I like the pitch clock of 15 and 20 seconds. I really like the ban of the shift. Maybe there will actually be some hits. Only 2 guys on each side of 2B. Feet on the dirt. I watched a couple AAA games in Indy on TV during State Fair. Those games moved at a faster pace than MLB. I think these moves will help the game. Hope so.

    1. Oh I am so happy about the pitch clock. Starters tend to work pretty quickly, but relievers are often painfully slow to throw a pitch. I also like that they are banning the infield shift and making infielders stay on the infield dirt. Both changes will be good for the game and hopefully we can get back to games that are comfortably under 3 hours again.

    2. Don53….shift change rules…I do not like it.
      1. Takes managers out of the game on defensive strategy.
      2. IMO, should have kept the shift, but all infielders must be on the dirt. MLB players hit the ball hard enough to get it through.
      Ohtani has been the player most ill- affected by the shift this season
      The other rule changes are fine.

      1. I’m good with all changes. Games are taking way too long and baseball is hard enough without the shift.

        It’s weird that the MLBPA voted against the shift. You would figure that offense would be up which means better numbers for hitters and better salaries. On the flip side, get ready for pitcher ERA’s to go up.

  57. Romus…I get your point. We will have to see. No doubt left-handed batters have been more affected by the shift over the years. More than the infielder in RF to me is the guy directly behind 2B. That may not change much if defense sets up correctly.

    1. Don53….what is stopping a manager now from moving the CF closer to the infield and leaning toward right center, and then moving the LF closer to the CF into the left center field area?
      Nothing really….just another form of the shift.

      1. It is, but no team will do that. If you have a slow LF and a quick hitter, it’s an easy triple for a ball into the LF corner, which normally wouldn’t happen at all.

        1. True…someone like Schwarber would be a detriment, however, what is the difference now from a guy hitting down into the LF corner with the LF not at straight-away?
          There isn’t….guys cannot hit that way when the pitcher is pitching inside.
          The pitchers play into the shift as well.

      2. Romus…too complicated for me. I guess they can put the outfielders wherever they want. No outfield restriction I can see other than no 4 outfielders at a time. We will just have to wat and see how things play out.

  58. Shifting from shifts.
    What is the realistic number of wins the Phillies need to get in playoffs?
    I was picking 90 for a while but they are not going to get there now.
    They hold tie breakers with most so that helps a bit.

  59. THANK THE LORD, Hallelujah!!!

    Ban the shift…. Hate it … always hated it. Nothing worse that hitting a ball
    Back up the middle and watching a SS not even have to move, to get the Put out. It killed the game in many ways. A 4th OFer? See you later, won’t miss you.
    I like pitch clock as well .. though for playofffs I believe they should extend the time. It takes a team forever to get there, let’s not rush them out so fast 🙂

  60. I would have liked just the first base to be made “bigger” by adding another base to its right side like they do in softball. This would help the runner to stay on the right side of the first base line and not drift over to the left side while running out a bunt or soft grounder in front of home.

    I would also like for the Phillies to be tuned in this weekend because this Nats team is much improved and a lot more competitive. After this weekend, the schedule has 3/4 with the Marlins/Nats. Other than that, they play all good teams including the Cubs who swept them in Philly.

  61. The game i grew up and loved is done, Bigger bases, Three batter rule, no shift, all cause people want faster games, What a joke, Baseball to my old eyes is dead, When you change the game cause the players refuse to change, Bunt, hit the other way to stop the shift, Three batter rule isn’t baseball. its a joke, Having to leave in a guy to face three batters, plain stinks, Shame people are so impatient, and want speed racer game, so they ruin it, all records should start from now, don’t tarnish the older players who hit a dead ball, play with little gloves, ran over catchers to win a game, now you cant block the plate, Fundamentals are gone and so is baseball

    1. rocco…..they want to speed up the game….but still have 2plus minutes between every half-inning change for advertisements…..minor leagues do not have that length of time between innings.
      If the largest sport on the world …FIFA… can do it, why can’t baseball do it……have a few running commercials each inning , split screen, between pitches and shorten the time between inning changes to 75/90 seconds.

      Probably the two most challenged leaders the game has seen are currently occupying the top seats….Rob Manfred (MLB) and Tony Clark (MLBPA)

  62. Ricky Bo just made a really interesting point on the pregame about the shift ban: it will force GMs to get guys who can actually field instead of standing where the computer tells them and then moving 6 inches to catch the ball because it was hit right at them.

    I’ve been on record here for several years against the shift. All other sports limit defensive positioning.

    The limit on pickoff attempts, however, is stoopid.

    No Bryce tonight.

    1. Exactly – the rules of the other major sports Change all the time. Baseball has changed very little over the years. It’s still baseball, the sky isn’t falling and the ridiculously long games were a HUGE problem for the future of the sport. A 3 1/2 regular season baseball game is too freaking long. I can’t even watch a game that long most of the time.

  63. To me, it’s always been the QUALITY of play and competition that determines whether the game is worth watching, not the length in hours and minutes. And let’s not forget that sponsors want every extraneous second for marketing. The game in its purest, original design has become an afterthought. “Hey, let’s pan the crowd to see who’s dancing to the obnoxious piped in pop song drowning out everybody’s conversations while we tell folks how they can waste their money on ingame betting…or let’s see what’s the Phanatic is up to before we turn to see who’s dropped by the broadcast booth…”

    The relatively rare triple may have been deemed the most exciting play in baseball, when the stolen base should be still. Or how about a hit and run every once in a while? The 3-outcome approach has utterly sucked the suspense and managerial feel out of the game. Cut and paste, cookie cutter strategies based on the research of algorithmic non-baseball fans may appeal to the new breed of onlookers, but let’s not call it baseball anymore, okay?

    1. mark…I wonder how you really feel!
      Seriously, all fair points.
      Baseball, for better or worse, has evolved…like everything else.
      Just have to see in a few years what the results amount to.
      Try this experiment…mute the game…no sound…just video.
      There is enough screen tracking and graphics to see what is happening

  64. I hope Marsh was worth it! O’Hoppe after 101 PAs .297/.475/.689 with 9 HRs and more bbs than ks. (MLBTRS) So far Marsh has been a little underwhelming IMO. I’ll give him the rest of the year to prove he’s worth it.

    1. Skeet … O’Hoppe after 101 PAs .297/.475/.689 with 9 HRs and more bbs than ks. You left out the last part: in AA. I’m not saying Logan O’Hoppe won’t be a good MLB catcher. He may, or may not end up being that. I’m just telling you MiLB offensive #s don’t necessarily predict MLB success. Brandon Marsh slashed .300/.384/.428 in 4 times more PAs (412) while he was in AA with the LAAs. And … once upon a time … Andrew Knapp was 360/.419/.631 at Reading over 241 PAs.
      Again, I’m not trying to throw a wet blanket on what Logan O’Hoppe is doing. I’m happy happy for him, and wish him lot’s of success. I’m just saying there is still a lot of time left to grade that deal.

      1. Hinkie….very well put.

        There apparently is a lot of ire being directed from the trades to the Angel and Cubs …..perhaps it should all be directed at the person responsible for making those trades…..Ruben Amaro, oops, sorry….Matt Klentak, oops, sorry again….Dave Dombrowski.

      2. Hinkie… my defense I just quoted the MLBTRs article, which says “Since joining the Angels ………(quoted stat line)…”. It doesn’t indicate they are AA stats.

        1. It being in AA isn’t the important part. He’s saying that we traded a player in the minor leagues for a player in the major leagues. If Brandon Marsh never improves one point in his triple slash, that is still better than someone who has never made the majors (which is a category O’Hoppe could in theory end up in).

          Don’t get me wrong, I am firmly in the “we shouldn’t have traded O’Hoppe” camp. But there’s no point stressing over stats that don’t ultimately matter. If he ends up being a stud in the big leagues, we can bemoan the trade then. But by then, Marsh may have turned a corner as well. We’ll just have to see.

          And Marsh deserves more than a couple months of leash. He’s still only 24. At least give him an entire offseason with the hitting coaches and see where he’s at next year.

      3. Hinkie, again, love your work and posts but this is not a sound argument. Of course good minor league statistics do not ALWAYS predict major league success. But, especially with hitters, they are our best predictor of major league success and a 22 year old minor league catcher with O’Hoppe’s build, stats, defense, plate discipline and power is much, much more likely to be a successful major league hitter than one with mediocre statistics. Nobody is saying he is a stone cold lock guarantee major league regular – I know I’m not saying that. However, his stats suggest he has a very good chance to be an excellent major league hitter and, as far as I’ve heard from scouting reports and what I can see from the stats, he had no clear red flags that would cause us to ignore the stats.

        I’ll stand by my prediction. He is more likely than not to be a top 10 catcher over time and it’s quite possible (35% chance?) that he becomes a top 5 catcher.

        1. And by the way, I thought of another way to measure why this was not a good value trade (they gave more than they got). Do you think, at the end of the season, we could trade Marsh for a prospect as good as O’Hoppe? No freaking way in my view.

          And again I don’t hate Marsh at all as a player and I hope he turns into a good one. Just saying . . .

          1. catch … I love your enthusiasm for O’Hoppe. I’m not saying he can’t be a top MLB catcher. It’s possible. I’m just stating (for the umpteenth time) that he is not a lock for anything. Putting up great #s in AA is nice (I don’t blame you or anybody for your enthusiasm), but It’s MiLB. A lot can happen between AA and MLB. Calling this trade a bust (and I’m not talking about you, Skeet … I wasn’t aware you were quoting MLBTRs) is very premature.
            Marsh holds a good deal of value. He’s a top defender in CF w/a history of good-to-very good MiLB offensive #s, who is just 24 YO, and is under team control for 5.5 years.

    1. I think this is a mistake. When they brought him in they said it wasn’t to be part of a platoon and they should stick to that. It’s not like Vierling is hitting well enough to force his way into starts.

      I also think that it’s going to take longer than the rest of this season to “fix” Marsh. Obviously with what his numbers were with Anaheim, it was going to take more than telling him to drop the leg kick. He’ll need reps with whatever mechanical changes they make and, in the meantime, he’s their best defensive option.

    2. Did Thomson make some kind of announcement about a CF platoon? Because otherwise, I don’t get how you guys figure he’s not starting full time.

      Outside of his IL stint, he’s had consecutive days off exactly once. Stott just had two days off, is he in a platoon?

      Since we acquired him, Marsh has appeared in 20 games. 19 of them were starts. He missed 10 games due to injury. The Phillies have played 34 games in that time frame. Minus the 10 he was ineligible for, that means he started 19 of 24 games. That’s over 79%. Is starting 4 out of 5 games considered a platoon now?

      1. He’s sat the last 3 games against lefties, by my count. Including 2 games in a row with an off day in between. Looks platoonish to me. They were playing him every day after the trade but that hasn’t been the case since he’s come back from the injury.

        1. He started against lefties on 8/29, 8/31, and 9/7. That’s 25% of the total games (3 of 12) since his activation, and more than a third of his starts (3 of 8).

          Seems like you guys are jumping to an conclusion about a manager who quite literally just benched Stott for Sosa two days in a row (note: Sosa has earned his playing time, just odd to have it for Stott two days in a row instead of giving Segura or someone a day off). If he keeps sitting multiple days in a row (or 33%+ of the time), or if Thomson announces a platoon, then complain. Until then, just assume he was getting a rest and/or Thomson was trying to jump-start something.

      2. DanK…..unfortunately, due to the nature of that trade, Marsh is becoming a very polarizing player, a lightning rod of sorts, to those who are dwellers who live deep into Phillies prospect land.
        To the average Phillies’ fan , O’Hoppe was just another player in their minor league system who probably, for the most part, is an unknown. another Lou Marson/Travis D’Arnaud….chattel for a larger item.
        I hope the best for both players….we get what dave D wanted from CF in Marsh…and the Angels get their future catcher in O’Hoppe.

        1. Oh yeah, I get it. I am very much cheering for O’Hoppe. The best case scenario for me is that both Logan and Marsh develop into perennial all-stars. Or maybe even Hall of Famers (I can dream). How cool would it be to have a trade of two future Hall of Famers?

          No reason both teams can’t win a trade. Especially when we virtually never play that team (since neither of us make the playoffs often, let alone the World Series…).

  65. Whether Marsh is a platoon player or not, he’ll get plenty of starts the next five games. He’ll face Fredde and Sanchez this weekend and Alcantara, Cabrero, and Lopez in Miami. Then they go to Atlanta where the only lefty starter, I believe, is Fried.

    Speaking/writing of the Braves, they are just amazing with their drafting and FA signings. I don’t see them resigning Morton ($20M) or Janson ($16M). They’ll sign a cheaper starter and a cheaper closer. They just seem to reload. Incredible!

    If Robertson wants to come back as a setup man for say $5M, I think that would be fine. No way he gets $10M next year to pitch anywhere. Knebel ($10M), Familia $7(?)M and Hand ($6M) were not great signings. Hope the FO can do better next season.

  66. Whatever they said for public consumption,
    the Phillies should absolutely platoon Marsh the rest of the season. Give Kevin Long the offseason to “fix” him.

    Marsh’s career splits are: .704 OPS versus righties, and .505 OPS versus lefties. .505!!!! They’re crazy if they play him against lefties this year.

    I’m not a big Vierling fan, but he has a career OPS of .748 versus lefties (and .600 versus righties).

    That platoon would effectively be a centerfielder with about a .715 to .720 OPS (Marsh would play a lot more) and mostly good defense (when Marsh is playing). Not bad.

    1. Disagree. Our offense is (or should be) potent enough without the need for that platoon. We’re much better served having an excellent defender in center to make up for our corners. Especially when Castellanos is back.

      Anything hit to the corners is already a guaranteed extra base hit. We can’t afford the gaps to be as well.

      1. Marsh would have to be an unbelievable defender, the best in the game, to make up for a .505 OPS. That’s a little better than Vince Velasquez (career .469 OPS) but not as good as Max Fried (career .542 OPS). Think about the worst hitters the Phillies have had — someone like Andrew Knapp, with a career OPS of .623, is tremendously better than Marsh is against lefties. Or how about Scott Kingery in 2020, when he hit .159/.228/.283, had an OPS of .511, better than Marsh against lefties.

  67. In exactly half a season — he’s played 81 games since May 31 — Stott has put up this line:

    81 games
    304 PA
    .268/.326/.429 for an OPS of .754
    9 HR, 8 SB, 23 BB (7.6%), and 44 K (14.5%)

    IF HE DOESN’T IMPROVE AT ALL, next season we’re looking at a shortstop with 15-20 HR, 15-20 SB, above-average offense overall, and a salary of $700k-ish, meaning the team can put $ towards other needs.

    And I think he’ll improve.

    1. This guy Stott is just fantastic. He really does everything well and he’s a winner. If this team goes places he’ll be one of the key guys on that team. Man, they nailed that pick. Can’t say enough good things about Stott. Believe in the tools and believe in the guy.

  68. In the midst of the O’Hoope moan-fest, might I gently point out that JT is playing as well as he ever has and catcher really really really is the least of our concerns? Gelb had a great piece on JT this week which included that he is still #1 in pop time among all catchers, and tallied the net affect of his base running and throwing. I remember Ben Davis 2 years ago raving at how well JT takes care of himself, anticipating that he would age well.

    On the other hand, not looking good with Wheeler, which increases the likelihood we need to spend on pitching in the off season. Good thing Sosa is looking like an outright steal.

    1. JT better take care of himself since he’s still under contract for 3 more years. We need him to not completely break down until his final year.

      I’ve mentioned this already, the Phillies need to spend on the rotation sooner rather than later. Yes, having the big 3 (Painter, Abel, McGarry) is great but banking on all 3 to be effective starters is dicey and likely won’t happen. The Phillies will almost certainly have to extend Wheeler or Nola and likely not both of them.

      So the rotation for 2023 should be:

      Falter (he deserves a shot)
      Sanchez/Plassmeyer/FA on a 1 year deal

      Whoever doesn’t get the last rotation spot

      1. They’ll bring in somebody to be the 4th starter. Falter will be in the group competing for the 5th spot but it’s probably his job to lose.

  69. Sosa….red-hot…. in the starting lineup again.
    Not sure I am sold on him for a 140 game season player.
    To the naked eye he looks like the real deal…his minor league metrics were all very good also.
    St Louis had a numbers game issue with him….maybe he is the real deal.
    Will Dave D decide to pass on a big time free agent shortstop and keep Sosa as the guy at either shortstop or 2B?

    1. Sosa is doing a lot of good things right now that it’s getting hard to keep him out of the lineup. It wouldn’t surprise me to see the infielders getting more time off to get Sosa in the lineup in the remaining 23 games.

      1. Really like Sosa but don’t lose track of Nick Maton – he’s the guy they can’t let get lost in the mix. He can really play and his power is real. Don’t trade this guy, Phillies. Scout your own players!!!

  70. Why was Ranger out for the 7th? Just like Syndergaard, if we can get 6 that is terrific. Neither should go out for the 7th. I know the BP is exhausted, but that’s no excuse for looking for more from starters than they are capable of giving.

    1. I agree with you, but . . . when the 7th started, Ranger had been cruising for several innings, the lead was large and the bullpen needs tons of rest. I get why he started the inning, but perhaps the plug could have been pulled a little sooner. Overall, however, Thomson is the best Phillies manager I’ve ever seen – and it’s not just because they are winning. Charlie was as good with players, but he was worse strategically and he didn’t play young guys the way Thomson does. We are going to second guess him from time to time of course, but he’s a really fine manager.

      1. Absolutely, Catch……personally I believe 6 under the belt is the “wall” for Ranger. I like what I see from Thomson.

  71. A couple things not yet mentioned in the O’Hoppe/Marsh debate: First off let me say I am still not sold on it being a good trade, but I do understand it. All off season we cried that a centerfielder was one of our biggest needs. With all due respect with what has been asked of him, Vierling is a below average hitter and a slightly below average fielder And with an outfield of Castellianos and Schwarber we really need a better Centerfielder.

    Others have stated the Phillies best window of opportunity is the next 3-4 years before some of the larger contracts start to decline. So the question is who is the bigger upgrade over the next 3-4 years? Marsh over Vierling or O’Hoppe over Realmuto?

  72. Moniak is back. Got a hit, too. Making him play LF so some bum named Trout can play CF.

    That bum homered in his sixth straight game. And, finally, why are the Dodgers keeping Hembree?

  73. Good recovery from a weak week with a 5-1 homestand. With 22 games remaining, an 11-11 finish would force the Brewers to go 15-6 over their last 21 games.

    Big week coming up with the Phillies hitting the road, but more important, the Brewers week includes 2 against the Cardinals followed by a road trip to play the NYY and NYM.

    Big opportunity for the fightins to open up some space.

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