Box Score Recap – 4/8/2014

Box Score Recap

Cameron Rupp did it again. Four HR in 4 games. Can I call him “Babe Rupp” without you all booing me off the site and into a shame spiral that ends with me face down in a ditch somewhere with an empty gallon of vodka?  No? Ok, then, I won’t call him that.

Jesse Biddle had a good night, earned runs not withstanding. Tommy Joseph went deep and ditto Art Charles. Phillippe Aumont walked four batters, which led me to assert on Twitter that Aumont is French for self-parody. And hey, look, I just did it again.

Here’s the affiliate Scoreboard from MiLB. http://www.milb.com/scoreboard/index.jsp?sid=milb&org=143&ymd=20140408

4-8-14

55 thoughts on “Box Score Recap – 4/8/2014”

  2. Bright side: At least Aumont only allowed one run?

    It’s so depressing knowing he comes in to pitch though. You know the result when he’s put in the game. Will he ever figure it out & start showing some consistency?

    Tune in next time on Phillippe Aumont: Walking in a run or finally getting some strikeouts (ok, I probably went too far with the Rocky & Bullwinkle thing, but it amused me.)

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    1. Its really a shame that a kid with his arm and stuff, just cant trust himself, to throw strikes, he can get away with mistakes in the strike zone with his stuff, some guys just never get it, and it seems he is on of those guys,

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  3. Whenever I talk with someone about Aumont, I’m usually the one to say we need some patience and shouldn’t give up on him just yet. And then I see he threw 11 strikes and 23 balls and I just want to facepalm. That must have been torture to watch.

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  4. What does it say about the Phillies’ pitching coaches that no one seems to be able to reach Aumont? He’s essentially shown no progress since he got here. He’s the same pitcher he was 4-5 years ago.

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    1. It says nothing about the pitching coaches. It says a lot about Aumont. I have actually come to believe that command can’t be taught. You either have it or don’t. It can improve marginally. But I can not think of one guy (on any ball club) that had “electric stuff but poor command” and turned out to be a good pitcher. Open to hearing examples though.

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      1. Nolan Ryan. He’s the all time leader in Ks but he’s also the all time leader in BBs. He lead the league in BBs 8 times. He also lead the league in WPs 6 times. I saw him pitch a couple of times and the K, BB, K, BB, K innings were hard to watch. I can’t imagine standing in a batter’s box against him . Luckily, he only led the league in HBP once and I don’t remember him ending anyone’s career.

        Randy Johnson was another. He led the league in BBs 3 straight years and it took him until he was 30 to get his control down.

        I’m not comparing Aumont to them but …

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        1. It wasn’t phrased nicely, but blaming several completely different sets of team personnel for the recurring problems of a flawed prospect doesn’t show a lot of understanding of how prospects develop (or more often, don’t develop). It’s the same mentality that leads fans to say, “The team isn’t hitting. Fire the hitting coach!”

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  5. Rupp’s homer was especially impressive – saw it on MILB archives. He took a ball that he appeared to be jammed on and flied it to right. Off the bat, it looked like a weakly hit fly that wouldn’t make it anywhere near the warning track, but it went out of the park. It was so impressive that, even though I knew before I saw it that that was the bat in which he homered, when he hit, I thought – well this one didn’t go out. Pretty incredible.

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    1. was at the game. wind was a gale to right field and many balls were off the wall. on a normal day its caught 10 ft from the wall. best hit ball all night by us was Franco’s bullet to left caught at the fence. in regard to above post, watched Aumont finish the 7th. didn’t have the stomach to watch him pitch the 8th and left.

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      1. Thanks – that helps what I saw make more sense. He still got a lot on that ball given where and how he hit it.

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  6. When is it time to completely give up on Collier? At least drop him to #9 in the order. It looks like Hewitt is getting less ABs and doing late inning replacement. Interestingly, Hewitt’s 0 for 6 with 4 Ks against lefties and 2 for 2 with an RBI against righties.

    Shane Martin’s line looks ugly at first giving up 6 hits and 3 runs in 5 innings but he gave up 4 hits and all 3 runs in the 1st inning. He gave up a bunt single and an infield single the rest of the way.

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    2. Way too early in the season to make statements like that. 2 more hits and we’d be cautiously optimistic about his start. We need more options in the high minors and it is not like he is holding anyone back, especially with Altherr out. It would be nice if someone in the Reading OF could earn a promotion to AAA because the OF there is pretty devoid of prospects.

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        1. Dugan is probably the best of the prospects, but I actually might push Collier if he has any success. He is repeating the level and at some point he does need to move up or out. Gillies at AAA needs to also put up numbers quickly or be in danger of being released so better prospects can play.

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          1. Collier and Gilles have graduated to org filler, so I don’t think it matters one way or the other how they do..

            Progress in the strength of the system is going to come from improvements from our real prospects, not improvements from guys who, if they improve a LOT, might get a cup of coffee in the majors as a bench player.

            The only reason that Gillies and Collier are still playing are that there aren’t “better prospects [who] can play.” That isn’t likely to change in the short run, as the OF prospects who could push them are all either at the same level (Dugan) or two or more levels lower (several players).

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            1. Gillies and Collier are still playing because they have major league tools. Collier is also only 23 still, so there is a little time on his side. Players with lesser tools like Susdorf or even Leandro Castro will get fewer chances because they simply have less value at the major league level. Since Gillies and Collier both could potentially add value on defense and on the basepaths, their simple OPS stats are less important than they are for a guy with lesser tools.

              Gillies is probably out after this season or half season, but Collier still has some time to prove he belongs. It is not as if Clete Thomas is much quality competition.

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            2. I’m sympathetic to the tools argument up to a point. I’ve often argued the other “side” when a young prospect in the lower minors doesn’t have good numbers but the scouting reports are positive. But tools only get you so far.

              These guys present different stories. Gillies is a guy who looked very promising, but injuries have cost him years of development time, AND are an ongoing issue. He’s done as a prospect.

              Collier is a slightly different story. The problems is that the tools haven’t really manifested, and they very rarely do at his age. Twenty three years old for a guy who has never really hit isn’t “only.” (And, minor but relevant, he turns 24 in September.) Even a guy who has defensive value and value on the base paths (and, regarding the latter, his SB% is nothing special) don’t have major league value if they can’t hit.

              Really this gets back to something that people are very sick of hearing from me. Collier would have to make a HUGE improvement just to project as a second division regular. Guys like that aren’t really prospects. And yeah, I know, there’s always the “fourth or fifth outfielder” argument. And you would think that outfielders who have some defensive and base running value (but can’t hit) would perhaps have a shot at a major league bench job. Except they generally don’t.

              Here’s a question for you: can you find ANY outfielders who had an wRC+ under 90 (Collier was at 85) in AA as a 22 year old who went on to a meaningful major league career (i.e., not just a cup of coffee or cup of coffee extended a little by a hot streak)? If you can, it’s likely someone whose AA performance was injury related or significantly below his prior minor league performance.

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            3. Which isn’t to say that they won’t, or shouldn’t, have a chance to prove me wrong, given how thin the system is at the upper levels. But the fact that neither player is in the organization’s top 30 says a lot.

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            4. One has to consider exactly what tools Collier actually has. He seems to lack the hit tool, which is a very big deal. I know some got very excited about a good August after and awful rest of 2013, but that really is just cherry picking a SSS data point, like when Hewitt has a good month or some guys have a good two weeks. Collier was also good at the end of 2012 and over the fall in 2012 but didn’t have that good a rest of 2012. He has yet to turn in a truly plus season with the bat. It is well and good to say that his speed and D will make him a plus major leaguer if he ever learns to hit, but hitting is so very essential that this is almost an empty statement. Speed is the least significant tool. Collier has walked at a nice rate last year and in a week of play in 2014, but that’s about the extent of the positives in his AA offense. I’d still play him, if largely for the D, because they really don’t have anyone else at the moment. When Altherr returns, I’d give him the CF shot, since his offense has a chance to be good enough if he can play CF, while I doubt Collier’s does. Not saying Collier can’t be a cheap 5th OF for the Phillies, as they guy who can sub in CF, but that is looking more and more like his ceiling.

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            5. agree atown…Altherr should be given the best opportunity in CF once he returns from injury. I think most on here would also agree.

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  7. Aumont Watch:

    It didn’t feel as brutal to watch as usual because the team was trailing at the time and not really hitting well. It felt like he could let it go a bit if he wanted with little fear of it effecting the outcome of the game.

    He quickly finished off Nesseth’s inning, stranding two runners. The trouble came when he started the next inning. He was 90-92 with the FB by the stadium gun. It looked like he was aiming for corners, and to be fair, Home Plate Umpire Brad Myers was squeezing him pretty good. The off-speed stuff though, when it appeared, was no where near the strike zone.

    So I’m still working under the assumption that Aumont is working on delivery consistency and control, and that’s why the velocity is down. Is his “stuff” still as “electric” at 90-92 rather than 94-96? I don’t know. I guess he didn’t give up any hits last night, so there’s that. Also, no wild pitches or passed balls, either. We’ll see.

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    1. alot are struggling early. Franco is still on break. Joseph and Tocci arem’t hitting yet and Biddle is still getting hit around. If it wasn’t for Crawford and Rupp I doubt many would be following this.

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  10. Figures, I drop everything to go see JP Crawford the night after he has 4 hits and a HR, and he is benched. Nothing else to report. LGJ still awful in the field. Tocci still overmatched physically. Zach Green really needs to shorten his stroke.

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  11. What I find most interesting – not significant, one way or the other, but interesting & fun – is that Rupp continues his “three true outcomes” results. 4 games, 16 PA, and only two balls put in play.

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    1. i will add that, while a 4 game SS is NEVER truly significant, the fact that the good things that he is doing are BBs and HRs makes is … not significant, exactly, but … less insignificant, maybe … than if he was simply getting a high number of hits on BIP.

      Still a lot of Ks (though not a ridiculous number of Ks), but that’s just who he is.

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      1. Agree with this – his walks relative to his Ks at CLR were what really got me thinking he had the stuff to be a player all the way up to the bigs. Before that I was just guessing based mostly on pre-draft projection.

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      2. Yeah, I guess I go back and forth a bit … probably its just SSS – but if you take his Oliver projections and bump up the HRs and BBs a bit, he’s a guy who could be much more than the “experts” think. I still think the Napoli comp (was that yours? Too lazy to check) is quite optimistic (though the obvious comp if you want to be very optimistic). I especially don’t see that level of plate discipline. But 6 BBs in 16 PA is … pretty good.

        One point about K% – I made a slight mis-characterization there – actually, his K rate improved so far also. But the fact that the difference between 3 Ks (what he has) and 4 Ks (what I thought he had) can be the difference between good and bad just points out how low the SS is so far.

        Get back to me in a few weeks – maybe then I’ll start getting excited.

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        1. Hmm, you were one of the ‘experts’ over the winter who thought he couldn’t be much. I think he offers more than Joseph and will be on the Phillies next season, if not half-way through this season.

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          1. I thought he would eventually be a back up. In that sense, yes, I agree with the experts. I say “agree” rather than “agreed”because, while intrigued, four games won’t and shouldn’t change my (or anyone’s) mind. Something like the Steamer projection (.229/.283/.359) still seems like the most likely outcome to me. And that’s a back up – a good back up, but a back up. I certainly could be wrong, though.

            I will say that his performance so far, ironically, justifies the decision NOT to make him a back up this year. It is also what you can make the case that Hernandez should be in AAA. These marginal prospects – marginal in the sense of marginal regulars – probably benefit from a chance to play full time in AAA where they have a real opportunity to proved us doubters wrong.

            As for Joseph, I’ve pretty much written him off.

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            1. Based on what the Phillies expect from their catcher’s progression to age development, I believe Joseph will eventually be their MLB catcher, ETA when he is 24 or 25-years old. Phillies are reluctant to rush catchers to the major leagues.

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            2. I don’t disagree with any of this. I’d have liked to see him on the Phillies, but it makes sense that he be the backup in AAA so that they have a 3rd catcher stashed and he gets more playing time. It just struck me as odd/funny when you put experts in quotes.

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        2. No Napoli comp from me. I try to avoid comps except on things like body type or delivery, things that don’t describe the player’s game/abilities.

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  12. Most of the damage vs Biddle came via a 3 run HR and he had a 1.00 WHIP which I was very happy to see. If indeed his injuries of last year were responsible for his slide, I am hopeful that this is the beginning of a resurgence followed by a promotion by mid-May.

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    1. Simply not a prospect, but it doesn’t hurt to have in the lineup to help the other guys.

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