37 thoughts on “Box Score Recap – 8/12/2017”

1. I wonder if Haseley is tiring some…..about 100 games counting UV exhibitions and regular games and those he pitched in which there were 11, and then GCL and now NYPL.

   1. I would hate to think a 22 year old kid is tiring after a 100 games or so. Many guys in the majors have played that many games and more at that age.

      1. Maybe “tiring” isn’t the best word, but pro ball can introduce a grind that the kid isn’t accustomed to. It’s not entirely wearing down from a physical perspective.

         1. I think most of us have a limited appreciation at best for the minor league life style. Morning workouts and instruction; night games. Playing 5 or 6 days a week. Now the hard part: adequate, not 4-star, motels; long bus rides; limited food options. Seems very tiring to me. FMI, WHAT CAN YOU TELL ME ABOUT “host families?” Do the Phillies minor league teams use them? If so, which reams?

      2. “Many guys in the majors” is the key phrase here. These kids are not major leaguers. They are first-year pros who have never played so many innings in one season prior to this. Why are there pitch counts? Innings limits? Why are young players shut down?

         1. Yes…..besides the obvious physical change, the life changes from college lifestyle to a professional career and new living and working surroundings, the whole nine yards, it is an adjustment.

            1. I guess I was trying to make a point that many major leaguers have played 140 to 160 games in the MAJORS at the age of 20, 21, etc.

               1. Its not the age, it’s the experience of playing that schedule. those 20-21 year olds are not playing 140-160 games in their first season at the ML level. They’ve been through the grind. Especially true for many Latin American players who play all winter long..

         2. He played in the Cape Cod League last summer for 44 more games and 154 more ABs.

            So he has yet to reach playing time far exceeding last year. When the minor league season finishes he may have played about 5 to 8 more games than last year.

      3. Haseley had three weeks off between the end of his college season and the start of pro ball. So I doubt he is tired. A slump is the most likely reason. He was very hot up to the Staten Island series so I doubt he got exhausted in the last five days.

         1. Yes…The Phillies would love to have some of their players in “slumps” with a .272 BA.

            1. He is 1 for his last 14. I’ll call that a mini-slump. You can tell everybody he is completely exhausted. I guess if he goes 3 for 4 today he has found his wind and is no longer tired.

      4. It’s more mental fatigue than physical. HS/College players are not conditioned to play baseball 8-10 hours a day, everyday..

         Reason I can nothing about a players numbers in their first season of professional baseball..

         1. Then there’s Micky Mo who continues to fade.

            I know the Phillies keep saying he’s just where they want him to be, but I don’t think 248 BA and 656 OPS is where they wanted him to be.

            Hopefully, he’ll come to life next year.

   2. I Know we had a chance to get instance offense in senzel who didn’t get tired coming out of college to pros. I never saw such loser talk kids tired they are learning to hit better pitching. In college how many times do you face kids who wont get drafted, in minors all the kids are drafted except for a few free agents who didn’t get drafted. so really stop making excuses. The front office really blew it with not taking this kid. but nothing they do it wrong

      1. front office also would have had to explain why they picked a third baseman with short path to the majors when at the time they were making a 23 year old third baseman the offensive face of the franchise.

         1. Could be easily explained by taking the best talent available and figuring out the rest later. I was on board with the Moniak pick at the time; the bigger disappointment to me is Gowdy’s lost (so far) season. With the bonus he got, I look at him as a first round pick.

            Writing of Haseley at this point is ridiculous. Short season stats for college players mean next to nothing, imo. Hoskins and Asche were terrible in Williamsport, for example.

         2. You draft talent and worry about postion later. The worst thing to do is take a lesser talent based on position

            1. Glad you’re not running the FO Rocc lol

               1. I am glad too

               2. rocco….since the first of May….JPC’s BA/OBP is .261/.368.
                  That 100 point delta between BA and OBP is still plus.

      2. There are some really good comments on this message board. The single most disappointing thing is the excuse making a lot of people make for prospects. Let the prospects play and have their season ending stats do the talking.

         You can make anybody look like a future star if you selectively edit their stats. Kid starts fast and ends slow so he is tired. A kid starts slow and ends fast so he was adjusting to the league. A pitcher starts slow and he isn’t used to pitching in cold weather. A college player starts slow and he is adjusting to wood bats. Then the old standby that he is young for the league. Pro baseball is funny in that a hitter is not allowed to pick the age of the pitcher he is batting against.

         Players are paid to perform from the first game to the last so looking at year end stats is the most honest way to evaluate the type of season a player had.

         1. Everything you cited is a valid reason, not an “excuse”. It is why you cannot judge a player on half a season of pro ball. I fail to see why people are so down on Moniak and Haseley based on their stats, which are not really all that bad, after such a short time in pro ball, yet they are so high on Kilome, ignoring the fact that his stats are not all that good. My biggest question is and always has been, do you actually get out there and watch these kids play in person? When you see for yourself how, for example, these three perform live and in person you realize, or should realize, that stats aren’t everything.

            1. Nobody is down on Haseley. People are just responding to the “he’s tired” excuse.
               Yes, I have watched a ton of minor league ball over the years. The first minor league game I went to was in 1970 at Reading just to see Greg Luzinski play. If my memory is correct he struck out four straight times against the Manchester Yankees.

               I am the very first person (along with Rocco) to tell you that people should go out to see minor league games in person. Stats are one things but to see a pitcher throw live is another.

               I have seen Moniak about 7-8 times and Haseley five times. I have commented several times on Moniak. Either he or Haseley will eventually be traded.
               Concerning Haseley, I like everything he does. He is an athlete with decent speed and good defense and I believe he will hit. He is a “gamer.” Whether he was worth the 8th pick in the draft is an entirely different thing and nobody can say that now.

               The Phillies need to start producing stars, not just solid players, if they ever want to win anything meaningful. The two lousy World Series the Phillies have won in their non-illustrious history had legit stars on their teams.

         2. Actually one of the most disappointing things I see is the inability by some to recognized that we are talking about 18-22 year old young men who are going through a major life change, both personally and professionally. The fact that some handle the transition faster/better than others is part of the process. Some never handle the transition or they discover that they don’t have the talent or desire to do what’s necessary. Other’s just take time.

            But looking that their stats at the end of the year tells very little, especially early in their careers. Also, not recognizing that player progress isn’t linear but can happen suddenly or not at all is rather short-sighted.

            You can call that excuse making but I call it a recognizing the reality of the situation..

            1. The realty of the situation is everybody is in the same boat. The kids on the Rome, Ga (Braves) have the same travel schedule, same workout schedule, same problems of being away from home as do the kids on the Lakewood, NJ (Phillies). Same with the Staten Island (Yankees) and the Williamsport (Phillies). Seems to some on this site only the Phillies minor leaguers have the young for league, adjusting to a new league, getting worn down, need to adjust to wood bats problems.

               I would suggest stop making excuses for kids that probably don’t want excuses made for them and let their play do the talking.

               1. Yep, they all are in the same boat and all teams have the same issues, where some prospects struggle and some do not. My guess is that you only notice the prospects in other systems that are doing well vs. all of the prospects in the Phillies system, both good a bad.

                  If Dansby Swanson was a Phillies SS prospect and not a Braves prospect we would be having the same discussion about him. He was a #1 overall prospect and has been underwhelming in his performance.

2. I have written this before, but as the AAAers exit for the majors, it’s clear that the organization is following a different script than Theo’s Cubs for building a powerhouse and sustainability for the future. Whereas the Cubs develop bashers and acquire pitchers, apparently, the Phillies are doing the opposite. Or, worse yet, the high level pitchers are not talented enough to stick in the five-man rotation of a terrible team. Either way, the only way to contend in the near future is to become mercenaries. Let the money flow begin.

   1. More than one way to skin a cat. The next wave of pitching prospects is coming: Kilome,Sixto,Anderson etc. There will be surprises as well. The next wave of hitters are progressing as well. The phans are just
      Going to have to be patient, a virtue this town has harnessed for decades. Randolph,Moniak,Hasley, Ortiz will need to bring in the next major group. We can be worried about them, but you need to give them a chance Before stating this org. Is not growing the bats. I see signs I don’t like as well, but looking at Crawford as an example, you neee to let them develop. Some of it is maturity, experience, etc. Personally, I think the Phillies have a nice mix. Hopefully they can either develop the players or trade
      For a proven commodity with these guys. Theo doesn’t have the only blueprint.

      1. Well said.

3. Clearwater is hitting itself out of the postseasson.
   Its pitchers are also human. No run support since the beging of the week. Let’s see how it goes this afternoon.

   1. If you look at the top 10 CLW hitters with more than 15 games in A+, Seven of the those 10 have graduated to AA or higher. Coppola, Tomscha, Sandberg, Herlis Rodriguez, Campbell, Stankiewicz and Grullon have all been promoted. Laird, Wilson Garcia, Emmanuel Marrero and ‘C’ are the only guys remaining who have over .250 BA. Garcia isn’t even over .300 in OBP. Only Garcia and ‘C’ are over .700 in OPS. Until the younger call ups, perform, they are going to score very few runs. We’re into August and opponents pitching often fades a little. The hitters should get a tiny advantage, unless they are tired themselves. But someone has to step up.

      Look at LHV, they’re going to have a lot of trouble holding onto their Wild Card lead. Most of the guys, who carried them, are playing in the Majors. It’s time for the other guys to step up and show they belong in the bigs and the younger call ups to start screaming, “Look at me.”

      1. Excellent assessment

      2. Hoskins should be in LHV for their WC stretch run

4. Williamsport dropped two on a very looooong night. There was a rainout on Friday, making Saturday a doubleheader with the first game scheduled for 5:05. Mother Nature did not cooperate and gave us a one-hour rain delay. In the middle of the sixth during the second game we had another delay of a half hour as fog rolled in. After tying the first game at 3-3 in the 5th, Zach Warren pitched in relief and promptly gave up a few hits and what prove dto be the winning run. The bats were silent in game 2 with only two hits. Julian Garcia only gave up one hit, no runs, but four walks against 5 Ks. Connor Brogdon gave up 3 runs in relief to give Tri-City a 3-0 win.

5. Some notes regarding recent transactions: Alejandro Requena to Williamsport is a paper transaction. Mauricio Llovera to Williamsport and back to Lakewood was all on paper. Connor Seabold went from Williamsport to Clearwater, just not to the Threshers. Word is he’s shut down because of pitching a lot of innings in college. His pro innings were just to get a look. (Some would call this an “excuse”). And, as many of you already know, Dalton Guthrie and Kevin Gowdy, while on the Williamsport roster have been in Clearwater the whole time. This has been common practice for years. Just posting this as info for those wondering why some names never show up in a box score.

   1. When this has occurred in the past, Jim usually has clarified and posted these as ‘paper’ transactions in the thread, or above in his ‘Transaction’ section.

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