Aumont back to the bullpen

Per Matt Gelb, the Phillies have decided to move Phillippe Aumont back to the bullpen. They cite his comfort level there, and I suspect they’ve ascertained that he doesn’t have enough weapons to really make an impact in the rotation. 2010 was a lost year for Aumont in a lot of ways, but he did log plenty of innings, and I have to think that experience will prove beneficial. He’s still very young and still has plenty of time, but when looking at his value now, you have to examine it as a reliever. Discuss.

44 thoughts on “Aumont back to the bullpen

  1. That drops his value markedly. Also, I don’t I get why the phils don’t continue to start him as he works on his mechanics. Even if he’s destined for the pen I would have thought at this point in his career the additional work would be very beneficial.

  2. I rated him late teens on the assumption that his future and best abilities lay in the bullpen, so this doesn’t really change my opinion at all.

    I do think that it is quite possible that Aumont really takes a huge leap forward in the bullpen.

  3. hes got 2 plus pitches. You got to think if he can come up with any command he could be at least a set up guy.

  4. If Aumont were a stock you might interpret this bit of news as a sell signal. But since he’s a human being and not a stock I really like this move. Apparently Aumont wants to be in the bullpen and I think at this stage it’s important to give the guy a break. To be blunt, anything to put last year behind him makes sense. You worry about his psyche now as much as his arm; very few guys have had to deal with what he dealt with last season. Since 2010 didn’t kill him we can only hope it only makes him stronger.

    It’s highly undesirable to yo-yo an arm back and forth from the pen, especially since it involves a change in arm-slot and mechanics, but nothing precludes the possibility of moving him back into the rotation in the future. I seriously doubt they will ask him to start again, though.

    I wish him all the best and I expect good things from him this season.

  5. I was afraid this was gonna happen…and it may be too soon to just give up on him as a starter. The more he get’s jerked around though, the tougher it will be for him to settle down and just do what he’s capable of.

    I’m bummed out, I wanted to see Aumont get more experience as a starter…

  6. Wish they would have said this a week ago so that his rating on here would be closer to where his talent is……I usually am optimistic(overly?) when it comes to Phillies prospects, but with Aumont I have zero confidence of him ever pitching in a regular role in the MLs…..

  7. If this was a stock you would’ve bought right before now because he would’ve been a penny stock after his last year.

    I would let him go back to his original arm slot and let him start with the assumption he is destined for the bullpen.

    I still hope this guy contributes and soon… Dpw

  8. Hopefully Aumont can take the Madson approach and give everything he has towards that one inning. Remember he is still young and things can change with good coaching and hard work.

  9. As one of the vocal supporters of Aumont a spot or 2 before he was finally ranked, with his move to the pen he falls into the mid-20’s behind Mathieson, Schwimmer, and 1 or 2 others.

  10. Finally!
    If he want to be a bullpen guy, then put him in the ‘pen. He has the ability to be effective there..

  11. As a reliever Aumont is behind Bastardo, Mathieson, Schwimer, DeFratus, Zagurski, Stutes, and arguably Carpenter, Diekman, and Kissock. Ellis and Lugo are coming up quickly behind him.

  12. …continued…

    I really think he doesn’t belong in the top 20 given this move and the more advanced players ahead of him. For example, I really have a hard time rating him ahead of Schwimer, and Schwim isn’t even on the radar in the polls yet.

  13. They keep fooling around with Aumont and he’s not going to be able to get used to a certain position.

    Maybe if they gave him more time in a starter role, he’d improve, but they keep flip-flopping him back and forth between the bullpen and the rotation.

    BTW: this seems like deja vu to when the phils messed with Brett Myers by putting him in the starter role. Now with more experience back in the rotation, look at his numbers with the Astros.

  14. Agree with nowheels, regardless of his role he needs to pitch better.

    I think most of his international appearances are either short or in relief. I assumed he was going to the bullpen when ranking him. He still has two above average pitches with one being a sinker so the bullpen should be fine. I like his tools better than any of the other relievers except maybe Bastardo. DeFratus has the control that Aumont lacks and ranked higher in my list. If Aumont projected to stay a starter I would have ranked him in Top10 (closer to May).

    I remember a post trying to use typical major league salary as judgment of potential upside. Since Closer is near #3 Starter (both ~$8M/yr) then I fell justified in ranking relievers a bit higher on the prospect scale. However, I agree that consistent closers are a rare bunch. Aumont is certainly nowhere near that now.

  15. I am happy about this. I never saw him as a starter so I didn’t like when the phillies used him as a starter. I think either him or De Fratus will be the future closer in a few years.

  16. Projecting a guy who has never pitched successfully above A-ball as a major league closer is a real stretch. Most closer pitch as starters in the minors. Projecting a guy who has never pitched successfully above A-ball ahead of a guy who has pitched successfully in A, AA, and AAA (Schwimer) is another real stretch, and most people don’t seem to think Schwimer is a top-20 prospect in this organization.

    Honestly, the guy can hump it up with bad mechanics and throw a 95 mph fastball he can’t control, and has a decent curve, again, a pitch he struggles to control. And he couldn’t hold a starter’s job that was handed to him last year, throwing 84-86 mph in his Reading starts. I really find it hard to understand how anyone rates him as any kind of a prospect. But that’s just MHO. Baskin Robbins has 31 flavors, y’know.

  17. Let him get command of his two plus pitches in the pen and go from there. I agree that he needs his confidence back first and foremost.

  18. You could see this coming for a while now. The Phillies usually do quite a good job managing minor league talent. But they have really done just about everything wrong with Aumont thus far. And, by the way, I’m not so sure that, in the future, Aumont may not move back to the rotation. But they have to jump start him and this is as good a way as any.

  19. I was actually a big proponent of him becoming a starter again last year, if nothing else to just get him more repetitions and work, since he hasn’t pitched a lot since being drafted, and because he didn’t pitch a ton in high school. I think the Phillies biggest error was starting him at AA. Given his age, his lack of experience, and the project of making him a starter, they could have sent him to Lakewood. He got his brains beat in at Reading, and I think it just shattered his confidence. The year is over, so he can start fresh next year. He still has the ultimate upside of being a late inning, dominant reliever, but hes got a long way to go now.

  20. To understand what has happened to Aumont, you have to go back a ways. He was drafted by Seattle as a starter. They changed his motion and moved him to the bullpen. In 2009 they promoted him rather quickly. Then he was traded to the Phillies where they converted him back to a starter, changed his motion yet again and then kept him at AA, where he was probably not ready to pitch. So they had to demote him, which, combined with all the other changes, could not have helped his confidence.

    Honestly, although this is a faster route to the majors for him, it still might not have been the right move. They should have worked with him and brought him along slowly at Clearwater as a starter and middle relief guy. Now they’ve got another relief pitcher – a potentially dominant one, but, still just a relief pitcher.

    Hardly a shining moment for the player development team.

  21. Kissock & Diekman you serious Chuck?

    Those guys are stiffs who probably will never see a MLB game in their careers.

  22. NEPP, I think this was originally mentioned in the chat on Baseball America when the Phillies top 10 was released… That’s where I remember first seeing it.

  23. I had Aumont at #19 because I was sure he’d end up in the pen. On a MLB roster, you need more relievers than starters so his path the Majors is a more probable now. DeFratus is the only reliever I rated ahead of Phillippe but Mathieson, Schwim and Stutes aren’t far behind. To be a reliever, he’s got to eliminate walks. When that happens, I’ll be singing his praises.

  24. Anonymous, that’s correct. Baseball America reported that Aumont was going back to the bullpen (and no more jockeying back and forth between the rotation and the bullpen) back in December in the Phillies prospects chat. This was interesting, as he pitched well as a starter in the Pan Am qualifiers in Puerto Rico in October.

  25. I’m glad for Philippe if this is what he wants. Hopefully he can harness his potential if he’s in a role he is more comfortable with.

    I feel pretty dumb for ranking him as high as I did due to: 1) the hope he could still be a starter; and 2) his potential upside from a power sinker and the best curveball in the system. I was aware of the BA chat comment, too, yet still I held out hope. I was wrong on that one, sorry if my comments swayed others to vote for him that high too.

  26. **Starter, reliever it makes little difference unless he improves.***

    this is the big point. look if he truly has two plus pitches and gets his command under control, then he can be a dominate late inning reliever. those are highly valuable. much more valuable than a #5 starter, which is Worley’s upside and you guys rated Worley our #7 prospect.

    But as noted above, it all depends on his command. this move does little to change his value in my mind. he was a longshot before this move and is still a long shot until he dominates in the minors.

  27. PPFan, nice to hear from you. I wish you would post more, like back in the day!

    I agree with you on everything except value as a starter vs. a reliever. #5 starters are more valuable than almost all relievers. Just to cherry pick an example, over the past five years Mariano Rivera has a cumulative WAR of 11.4. Joe Blanton has a cumulative WAR of 14.9. If you take the past three years, Rivera comes out ahead 6.9 to 6.0. So the most dominant reliever in the game has been slightly more valuable than Joe Blanton over the past three years. Lidge has a cumulative WAR of 1.8 over the past three years.

    There are non-WAR variables to consider, but this is a pretty good way to get a feel for how valuable starters are.

  28. WAR duh duh duh duh duh, what is it good for!

    “Their are lies, damm lies and statistics” (Mark Twain I think)

    Anyway, consider how the Phillies are set up for the next two years makes having assigned rolls in the 7th, 8th and 9 th inning and a left hand specialist. Those 4 guys have an outsided importance – but not statistically – to someone who pitches 5 innings as a starter.
    If Aumont becomes a shutdown 8th or 9th inning guy he becomes an integral prt of the team. Statistically, not so much. And I’d rather have Mariano than Blanton.

  29. I heard before that Aumont has a degenerative bone disease , which is why he prefers to be in the bullpen. Anyone else?

  30. I feel like everyone posting on this site has very little idea about the way the minor league system works an especially with the Phillies coordinators..I played in the system for 3 years an understood the way things worked with this particular organization..feel free to ask me about any prospect who you’d like to know more about

  31. Very cool Mos Def–What position did you play? I mentioned Galvis in another thread and feel that he has become lost at the plate because of too many changes to his approach. What are your thoughts?

  32. I was a pitcher..Freddy like everyone knows is one of the sickest people to every play SS n you’d hear that from pretty much everyone…his range,footwork,glove, an especially arm are all superb

  33. So who are the starters at Reading…with Aumont now in the pen and Sanchez gone. I see Hyatt, Ramirez, Cisco, Zeid (like him in the BP better), Matt Way? Please no Correia. He was awful. Garcia? Do we try to jump Shreve because of his age? May? Nick Hernandez? Or maybe some minor league FA

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