Phillies Trade #3 Prospect 12/22/2024

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The Phillies acquired Miami Marlins LHP Jesus Luzardo for #3 prospect SS Starlyn Caba and OF prospect Emaarion Boyd.

This news comes close on the heels of the Phillies admitting to reporters that they were essentially backing out of the race for the top-end free agents still on the market.  This move may close the book on the Phillies offseason.  However, I expect they will be still on the lookout for any trade or free agent signing that may improve their roster and/or depth.

Caba was signed during 2023 International Signing Period.  He is a promising shortstop with excellent defensive skills and a very good approach at the plate.  Baseball America recently named him the Phillies’ prospect with the best Plate Discipline.  He played all of 2023 in the Dominican Summer League where he slashed .301/.423/.346/.769.  He moved stateside last season where his youth and a longer season likely affected his offense.  Still, he stole 50 bases between the FCL and Clearwater while drawing 67 walks and striking out only 49 times in 340 plate appearances.

Boyd was the Phillies’ 11th round draft pick out of high school in 2022.  He advanced to Clearwater for a couple games his first season and played full seasons with Clearwater and Jersey Shore in “23 and ’24.  He is an excellent outfielder committing just 7 errors in his career.  He has played all 3 outfield positions.  He was recently named the best Defensive Outfielder among Phillies’ prospects by Baseball America and the Phillies prospect with the best Baserunning Skills.  He has 91 career stolen bases, 56 with Clearwater in 2023.

Luzardo is coming off a 2024 season dominated by injuries.  However, he had a career year in 2023 making 32 starts, pitching 178.2 innings, striking out 208 batters walking 55, with a 3.58 ERA.  His 22 HRs that year are a little worrisome, though.  He is under team control through the 2026 season.  If healthy, and recent reports are that he is, he will likely be slotted into the rotation.  That should generate some interesting discussion as we wonder about Walker’s future role (bullpen?), Painter’s timeline to the majors (I think no effect), Suarez’ future role (trade?).

We all know you can’t have too much pitching.  But the Phillies now have 6 major league starting pitchers and 5 rotation slots with Painter likely to be promoted well before the All-Star break.  Gives us a lot to chat about.

The trade also included a minor league catcher, Paul McIntosh.  He hit 12 HRs in Double-A last season and may be headed to Lehigh Valley this season.

129 thoughts on “Phillies Trade #3 Prospect 12/22/2024”

  1. Dr. Jimmy states that “gives us a lot to chat about”. I think he’s excited again and that he’s all in for the upcoming season! Let’s hope so.

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  3. jim – interested in your thoughts on trade.

    im excited for it. I think it makes ranger expendable. He signed with boras which makes a team friendly extension unlikely.
    I like McIntosh. Was looking at his page and he was drafted 2018, but no stats until 2021, so maybe some fresh legs.

    many will say Walker will get released but I think they wait to see how his training has gone. If he bounces back, there’s some value there.

    this rotation is going to be lethal

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    1. I’ll miss Caba. Aside from his baseball skills, he’s a personable young man who always acknowledged those of us who came to the Complex.

      A healthy Luzardo certainly bolsters the rotation. My first thought was that this makes Suarez more susceptible to a trade. On reflection, I think Marchan is more likely to be affected by the trade,

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  4. Luzardo was good the couple times I saw him pitch. Like all pitchers staying healthy will be the key. If he can go to the mound every 5th day, I think it will be a good deal for the Phillies. Plus 2 years of control is a good deal.

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  5. The 2023 version of Luzardo is an elite SP. he is easily a #2 starter and arguably a #1. I have stated earlier this week the case that Caba is an elite prospect too. But don’t confuse that with a guarantee of production. This is classic trade of a top prospect/lottery pick for an established star coming off an injury year. Zero chance Marlins do this deal after 2023 season. So there is some risk of a return to form. But it feels like a good gamble.

    It is also a great value for an elite SP compared to the package for Crochet. DD’s patience really paid off. Our rotation and bullpen are top 3 in MLB.

    Regarding our lineup, I like the addition of Kepler. Although we are too lefty heavy. I am not convinced that DD is done. Too much smoke on Bohm imo.

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    1. I’d bet the FO would rather have traded Crawford, but the timeframe of their eta, makes Caba go.

      In a funny twist, DD just gave the middle digit to the CWS FO. They tried to clear out our cupboard for Crochet. This is a great counter, and still gives the more chess moves

      I’m not sold on the BP. I like Romano, but if Alvarado does regain form, it gets thin imo. Probably being greedy but I’d definitely like one more piece there … to go super heavy on pitching this year. I’m sure Ranger is not going back to the pen sooo.

      I’d This definitely shuts the door on Hoffman if he is looking to be a starter

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      1. Tac. I mentioned to oldruff that Luzardo and Crochet are good comps. High risk and high reward for both. As v1 mentioned this would not have happened after his 23 season. Things can change for the better or for the worse. They just have to play out.

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        1. I hear ya, from the rumored haul it was for Crochet, Luzardo is a great counter. Plus, it weakens the Marlins. Doesn’t seem like much, but not facing him should give some buffer if the WC is needed. It might be with this offense.

          it’s a bit interesting that this move also happened once Sasaki told them PHI is not on their list. DD had this lined up imo. DD gonna start feeling the love again he’s making good moves imo. He got good value imo & he still has moves for the deadline.

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          1. Given their money restrictions and the fact that they really do need to feed younger players into the majors to have age and payroll balance, I think they’ve done a good job this off season. We will have to see how it plays out, but so far, I’ve been favorably impressed.

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            1. “Given their money restrictions and the fact that they really do need to feed younger players into the majors to have age and payroll balance” << this is a great point and one that doesn’t really get focused on enough. Our salary is over $300mil. We really need cheap young guys to come up and perform. We can’t buy top FAs at these prices.

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      2. I don’t agree that DD wanted to trade Crawford over Caba.

        We only signed Kepler to a 1 year deal. That means we will definitely need a corner OF next year. Keeping Crawford gives the possibility that he is our CF next t year and we can slide Marsh where he belongs on LF.

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  6. what rotation is better?

    Halladay,Lee, Hamels, Oswalt, Blanton

    or

    Wheeler, Luzardo,Nola,Ranger, Sanchez … with Painter waiting in the wings…

    Does this push Painter to the BP? Or is he still possibly an opener?

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    1. Halladay, Lee, Hamels, Oswalt and Blanton is still better (on paper anyway), but this is a very strong rotation.

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      1. The strength is in the depth not on the opening day roster with Painter, Abel, Chace, Johnson, Cabrera, and others.

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    2. Whatever happens, there’s no rush with Painter. They can let him start at AAA and limit his innings there.

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      1. I do believe the thinking is to limit Painters innings early on and have him ready to contribute in the majors (if the need arises) during the later half.

        Walker right now is the long man in bullpen/first up in case of injury. If he rebounds then this is a deep rotation.

        Also in the mix are Able, Chace, Johnson, and Philips.

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    3. Good question but Halladay, Lee, Hamels and Oswalt are at least 2 Hall of Famers and 2 others really really close. That’s a better rotation for sure.

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  7. I’m thinking this makes it pretty likely that they move Ranger or Sanchez (most likely, Ranger) and sign another arm (Turnbull?) to keep things warm for Painter. But it’s always possible they will just double down, keep all of these guys and try to overwhelm the NL East with great pitching – there are worse strategies – and let things just play out with Painter. To be clear, however, this was a fair price for a pitcher as talented as Luzardo with 2 years of control. I like Caba a lot – but this was fair value and I’m glad they didn’t move Tait, who I think has as good a chance of any of our prospects of becoming a true star.

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      1. I’m not sure, but I’m pretty confident he wouldn’t sign here if he couldn’t compete for a rotation spot out of ST. Man, that guy really knows how to pitch – but he’s an injury waiting to happen.

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        1. I think Jim posted a few weeks ago that he had surgery but I never scored very high on my reading comprehension tests so I could be wrong…

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    2. I will stop spamming the board… but I’m wondering if Painter might be the final BP piece for this year. It depends on the medical team views BP work vs SP. Will see, would be interesting if they did:

      Wheeler, Luzardo, Nola, Suarez,Sanchez

      Romano, Painter, Strahm, Alvarado, Kerkering, Banks

      Again, imo without another arm the BP feels underwhelming to me for the post season

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      1. I would doubt it. His arm is too big I don’t think they want him on a static schedule as he comes back from injury.

        Maybe Abel would be a good candidate if he doesn’t regain his success.

        I think if anything maybe they go six man when everyone is healthy and ready. Unless you get your socks knocked off I don’t think you can trade Ranger. Can never have too many pitchers.

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        1. Ranger’s value is high……make the trade and get something other than draft comp in 2026. He is not going to sign now with Boras as his agent. Dombrowski needs to be aggressive. He needs to pull a Roseman off-season retooling, the team has regressed.

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          1. he’s not going to sign but Jim Salisbury mentioned on his podcast how Boras will keep him motivated and focused in his walk year. They would need a massive package to move Ranger.

            Ranger also never pitched a full season & Luzardo and Painter are coming off injured seasons. Not sure it’s the greatest idea to sacrifice depth unless, like I said they got a haul back.

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  8. we ain’t moving Sanchez, that deal looks phenomenal now. Ranger signed with Boras, that tells you the $ he is looking for. Tie bell is not an option since he had surgery again. I don’t think DD is done trading, gotta do something with starting lineup.

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    1. I agree. Chris Sanchez has a great contract. He is coming off a 4.7 WAR year and is signed through his age 33 season for a $5.6m AAV. Amazing deal. Illogical to move him.

      I think they keep Ranger too. Good problem to have if Painter is ready and we have 6 healthy great starting pitchers.

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  9. With Luzardo, Suarez, and Painter you really have 1 1/2 pitchers given none will likely exceed 150 innings ; Painter may not even see 90 innings. I think the 5th, 6th, or 7th starter will be one of the depth minor league signings or another young prospect pitcher (Seth Johnson). I think these first 3 will be mixed and matched depending on health.

    I would still like to see them get either Hoffman or another experienced high pressure innings pitcher – even a Kenly Jansen late in the free agent season for a “below market” one year deal. I think they are one RP pitcher short – still.

    While DD appears to be doing very little other than trading around the edges I still think he is waiting for prices to fall before committing more. After all, there are still a lot of free agents left – and teams who have to cut payroll – Cardinals, Padres, Twins, Rays etc. freeing up even more seasoned players for trade.

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  11. The other part of the deal….Paul McIntosh:

    Fangraphs from last year: “……. a bat-first catcher with rare contact ability for the position. McIntosh …. his offense is rooted in pull power”

    Assume McIntosh will be augmented at LHV.

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  12. I have to say, given where they are with salary and how Ranger retained Boras, I am not sure they could have pivoted much better. That doesn’t mean it will all work out, but it does mean that all of the moves they’ve made are sensible, reasonable in cost and all have some very clear upside. Just like with the Soto trade, I often think DD does his best work with one hand tied behind his back. Give him a huge piggy bank and he can get the team in trouble.

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    1. very well put…….”…..give him a huge piggy bank and he can get the team in trouble”. It seem that was the way it was in Detroit then with the Sox. Hopefully Middleton’s mantra about the 5 years down the road plan, concurrent with present plans, may have reigned him in a bit. Though one can make the exception with Walker and Castellanos contracts.

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    2. Catch – its a good example for us to remember to be patient as “Phans.” Not saying you aren’t, just in general. The fanbase got used to the big splashy FA signings, and when they didn’t happen… negadelphia come out in full force. After watching ATL & how they handled their offseasons over the years, multiple smaller to mid range moves can add up for a great offseason, especially when they add one of the best FA values towards the end of the offseason ….

      With the money constraints, I’m thinking Ranger could easily be traded. Same with Sosa. It cuts off double money. They seem like sensible moves, but will see how Middleton really wants to handle the perceived money constraints. I say that knowing they are pretty real. I’m sensing he may hold onto Ranger/Sosa and just pay the luxury tax fees until 2027… 2 years of pain, and 2 more WS chances… before they can really reset and get under the penalty threshold with players like Crawford,MIller, Painter and others graduated. That is starting to look like the plan to me. 2 more swings with this group … before they get a bunch of new FA signings to mix with 2 cores .. thats going to elevate them to Dodgerville. Will all shall see

      Have a great holiday all if I don’t spam the board before then!

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  13. Dave Dombrowski is proving himself as the guy not only willing to risk the future to acquire the big fish, but now, when those fish are caught, he shrewdly turns to perhaps even better bargains with high upside. Romano and Luzardo are prime examples, and Kepler for one year may be a key piece to the veteran mix already here.

    Now…what becomes of Bohm? That’ll be an interesting finale to off season activity.

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      1. They now don’t “need” Ranger, but he sure is helpful. So if someone wants him, the asking price would have to be really high because, after Ranger (or Luzardo or Sanchez – whoever you call your #4 guy), the dropoff in the rotation is enormous. The Phillies have an ace as their #1 and then a bunch of guys that are 2s and 3s . . . but if you trade Ranger, that last starter is a AAAA pitcher (I’m not including Painter – who knows what he can contribute this year).

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      2. Would be great to get a legit CF (not a stud, per se, if Crawford is imminent) and if Ranger can get us one, let’s do it…if only for a couple years.

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    2. Mark8…if Bohm is moved , I originally thought Bregman would in their cross-hairs, but seems Cohen and the Mets are going hard for him. Maybe Bohm in a package to the Cardinals for Arenado and Helsley.

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      1. Please – no Arenado – that’s a millstone acquisition – not a keystone, a millstone that hangs around your neck and drags you down until you can’t move anymore – a declining player who will be expensive and taxed. Enough of the bad contracts. No mas.

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  14. Bohm and Casty to NYY for Jasson Dominguez and Spencer Jones.

    Trade Walker, Jean Cabrera, and Seth Johnson for Arrenado

    Sign Profar to one year $15 million and sign Tanner Scott to three years $50 million.

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    1. No Arenado for me, thanks. Helsey? Yes. Or sign Tanner Scott. Release Walker when it’s time to cut bait. Bohm will taste like re-heated meatloaf if he’s not traded, but there’s no viable replacement 3b on the market, trade or free agent. I maintain Ranger is your most valuable trade chip, albeit a one year rental to a contender. See Baltimore as a for instance.

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    1. I think you got some bad info RU. He’s a “swingman”! I’m pretty sure it’s Diana Ross that he’s related too.

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  18. Theory, the Marlins asked for Crawford for Luzardo at the winter meetings and DD countered with Caba. The Marlins initially passed but ended up calling back to take it. DD sees Crawford as our CF of the near future and realizes how hard it is to get a true CF. Logic behind this theory:
    1. After winter meetings DD said they have ongoing discussions.
    2. He signed Kepler to a 1 year deal. Next year Marsh moves back to LF
    3. Marsh is clearly not a CF and DD knows that. They are hoping Rojas learns to hit but I don’t think they see him as a starting CF. He has said that he wanted to get a CF but ended up signing Kepler.
    4. We really need a RH bat in our lineup. Kepler makes us way to LH heavy.

    So I think DD only would part with Crawford for a premium talent. But I think he really wants to hold on to him.

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  19. Food for thought. Team splits last year:

    vs RHP AB 3825 .251/.318/.417/.735 tied for 8th best OPS with the Brewers

    vs LHP AB 1709 .270/.342/.441/.783 3rd best

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  20. Kepler move was just OK, all other moves fantastic. I would not trade Ranger unless blown away. He could move to pen in playoffs to push over top. I still have hope for Rojas. People seem to forget how young he is.

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  21. Here’s my forecast, not for opening day of 2025, but following the trade deadline…

    Bryce Harper 1b

    Bryson Stott 2b

    Trea Turner ss

    Xander Bogaerts 3b (acquired for Ranger Suarez)

    Max Kepler lf

    Justin Crawford cf

    Nick Castellanos rf

    Kyle Schwarber dh

    SR: Zack Wheeler, Jesus Luzardo, Aaron Nola, Luis Castillo (acquired for Alec Bohm), Cristopher Sanchez and Andrew Painter

    Merry Christmas to all, and a very happy 2025!

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    1. Merry Christmas to you also,

      …….Bogaerts better also come with plenty $$$$$$ from the Padres since he is signed for another 9 more years, and he is a replacement player these days.

      Ranger gives them one very good year, and then they will be able to QO him and get draft compensation.

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      1. I like the idea of Bogaerts in the line-up but they are not adding another big contract. It’s just not happening, especially since, as it turns out, the Bogaerts contract is a very bad contract.

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    2. My question …why would a team deep in the play-off race, wehich I assume the Phillies will be come next July, want to subtract from the pitching rotation, namely Ranger, and disrupt the chemistry of the team, then adding a replacement player. If Ranger is to be moved….now would be the time to do it. You will get more return value.

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  22. With the passage of time and reading trade suggestions posted here, I’m thinking Alec Bohm is increasingly entrenched in the Phil’s lineup for 2025, for lack of viable alternatives.

    Merry Christmas/Happy Hanukkah, all.

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    1. I always find it interesting how, in my view, we misperceive the team’s problems.

      Is Alec Bohm a superstar or even a star? No, but he’s a good and very affordable player. Until he becomes a FA, he’s really just fine at third base, although I’m not objecting if a cheaper but better option came along (such as Aidan Miller). Bohm may not be a huge difference-maker but he is not the problem. Centerfield is a problem. Left field (when Marsh isn’t playing in his platoon there) is a problem. Right field is a problem because, no, Castellanos isn’t good. Back of the bullpen consistency is a problem. Bohm is not a problem.

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        1. I’m not saying he isn’t tradeable – he is and is one of their better assets because they have Miller waiting in the wings. As for not starting him – he was just cold at the time. I don’t read anything more into it than that.

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            1. Yeah, maybe. Like I said, he’s no star, but he’s made himself into an average-ish third baseman (which took a ton of work) and was a 117 OPS+ hitter, which is quite good. He’s a good player and, knowing they had a big bat coming behind him (as long as Turner is a SS, Miller is the third baseman of the future), they were trying to use him as trade bait. Nothing wrong with that under the circumstances.

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            2. I agree. I don’t think that we need to move him. I am just saying that it is pretty strange to bench an Allstar during the playoffs and then openly shop him that following offseason.

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      2. Very true. They keep saying there is too much swing and miss in lineup and Bohm is not the problem there. Swapping him out for Bregman or Arenaldo are the only two whom I could see improving the spot.

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        1. IMO Bohm is just as much of a problem in the line up as Turner/Castellanos/Marsh. He doesn’t like to strike out so he doesn’t really let himself get to two strikes and he gets himself out early in the count. He just makes contact with the pitches these guys are flailing at.

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          1. You have a point…..he does not want to work the count to get to two strikes…..thus his BB rate is less than 7%, whereas league average is somewhere between 8% and 8.3%. But as you mention, his K rate last season of 14%, is well below the 22% league average. However, I think there may be more to the fact that they have put him on the market trade block, then what his on the field production want you to believe.

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            1. Rhys sits near the top @ 4.34…with a little over 10% BB rate. Not sure Bohm could be as a patient at the plate like Hoskins….I would think be would be uncomfortable at the plate with two strikes on him

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            2. Imo the more important metrics are: Z-swing %
              Z-contact
              Swinging strike %
              O-swing %

              I don’t care if a batter takes a lot of walks as much as if he swings at strikes and makes contact on strikes. And takes balls.

              It’s hard because good pitchers throw strikes that start as balls out of the hand and balls that start as strikes out of the hand.

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  23. How great would it be if the current 5 all performed to their abilities and Painter stays on track for earthy summer. Imagine the trade equity they would have if they are comfortable swapping one of the current five for Painter. A top starting pitcher would be a huge asset to add offense at the deadline.

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  24. Just FYI: There are enough free agent outfielders that each team will likely sign one. And there are enough relievers that each team should sign at least one more if not two. Now some of them will likely be minor league contracts with spring invites.

    With that said I would expect the Phils will bring in another OF and RP still.

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    1. I agree on RP. I think they are waiting it out and hope to sign top FA RP on a 1/$10m deal. I think they will not sign an RP to a 3 year deal.

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  25. Why are we pushing Miller to be a 3b? Jim mentioned before he’s a SS until he’s not. If Bohm gets traded they will still need a 3b. At this point hold onto Bohm and hope he keeps improving. I kind of like the idea of having a Seager/Ripken lite potentially.

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    1. Because some guy with a $300 million contract probably does not want to move off of SS (at least yet) and we want Miller’s bat in the line-up. That’s why. But it’s always possible he moves back there at some point – that’s how Ripken moved to short (he started as a third baseman).

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      1. Bingo….he said last year he was signed as a shortstop and that is where he will stay. Until he embarrasses himself and/or hurts the team, he probably will not budge. Hope he can see that when it happens.

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        1. Good points on both comments. Honestly, I think he embarrassed himself a good amount of times at SS, but that’s without looking at his fielding stats.

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    1. Would have been nice. Bit of a head scratcher to me that he ONLY signed for 3 years with 1 option year? If those rumors are true. Does that help set the market for Schwarber? Going from 20mil to 20mil a year? Does then Realmuto’s market drop back down to 20mil or below?

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      1. Autocorrect … my arch nemesis. 20 to 27mil should be his market then… 25mil is probably reasonable if you believe he is the best 1 or 2 DH in the league.

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        1. A curse, I turned mine off, will find out whether I regret it or not. 50/50 right now.

          I’d have liked Hernandez or Santander. See what else DD has his sights set-on.

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            1. I’m weary of Profar. He finally found a spot where he clicked… pretty hard to imagine he would leave. Thats said, SD is in a weird spot with their owner dying in the last few years. The money flow is different. I personally see Sasaki signing with SD. I can’t see the MLB having him go to LAD. I know the player is supposed to be able to sign where he wants… but I’d bet there is some collusion there for sure. It’s not good for the game for him to go to LAD. Once that happens, SD will likely trade Cease to upgrade the offense. Which might mean the end of Profar in SD.Profar seems like the perfect ATL signing … or they sign Hays and He turns into an All Star again. Seems to happen way too much

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  27. Kind of hard for me to think the Phillies will open the season with an outfield of Kepler-Marsh/Rojas-Castellanos. Gotta think Dombrowski will acquire another legit player before camp.

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    1. …and if they don’t move Castellanos, it would most likely be a CF. See Bader is available but he would be a redundant option. Good glove but…

      And Robert would likely be an overpay in prospects.

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  28. I’m at the point where i think it would be fun to offer Alonso a 1/$45M deal to just DH and stick Schwarber back out in LF. Do whatever it takes to sell Walker or Castellanos, attaching Bohm, Marsh or Ranger to the deal to not eat money.

    Screw it. Let’s be stupid for a year and get a RH power bat to protect Harper. LOL

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          1. Sure did…also had Skates Smith and Greg Gross playing out there for over 100 games that season subbing for the Bull…who only started an played out there in 105 games and only lasted to the 9th for 56 games.

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  29. it probably is. Kepler was the move. He’s what they are looking for, and either an improved Rojas or Crawford is the CF. The only other move is to replace Castellanos. The lineup is the team’s weakness, in terms of extending innings, contact, being able to play small ball when needed. Too much swing & miss, not just SO. Essentially this team has been looking to replace Hoskins and Stott since 2022. I expect Stott to return to form, heard he was fighting an injury all year. Hope that was the case. Hoskins is not the ideal batter, but close to what they are looking for now, just with a slightly better walk/so ratio. Profar maybe the closest to that with less power. I’d be weary of Profar though. He seems to need SD. Batting coach,.environment etc. Roberts has massive power numbers with massive SO numbers. No thanks unless you can trade Castellanos. That would be a recipe for going cold in the playoffs. I’d revisit the Brent Rooker trade… to upgrade over Castellanos.

    Castellanos, Ricones, Ricketts for Rooker… ? Probably too much. I’d obviously love to get Miller, but I’m sure it’d take Miller/Crawford+ Tait to do it…. What’s a slight overpay that the A’s would want for Rooker and Rooker & Miller? It will probably hurt… but then I would trade Ranger to regain some of the prospect capital lost in this trade, either now or at the deadline.

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  30. Turner, Harper,Schwarber,Rooker,Bohm, Kepler, Stott, Realmuto, Marsh/Rojas/Crawford…. with SR Wheeler, Luzardo, Nola, Sanchez, Painter/Ross … BP Romano, Miller, Strahm, Alvarado, Kerkering, Banks …

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  31. I think any discussion with the A’s for Rooker/Miller begins with Painter. And the discussion ends.

    A’s ask for Painter, Suarez, Schwarber Crawford and Tait. I think Castellanos isa deal breaker in this type of discussion.

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    1. If he is strictly DH only, then … im out. A lot of people complain about Castellano but… there are not clear upgrades for him… at least in terms of his production vs the cost it will take to upgrade. Rooker could be.. if he played the field but he doesnt so its Rooker vs Schwarber.

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  33. Three way trade:

    Cardinals get Rincones Jr., Jean Cabrera, Seth Johnson, T. Walker from the Phillies and Cole Young as well Cole Evans from the Mariners.

    Phillies get Arenado, Helsley from the Cardinals and Harry Ford from the Mariners.

    Mariners get Bohm and Casty as well as Jose Ruiz.

    Use 2025 cost savings to sign Tanner Scott.

    This gives the Phillies the best bullpen and rotation in baseball.

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  34. casty/bohm Ruiz would net an ok player or 2 back of top 10 prospect. unless you eat part of the contract that’s almost 70 million over 2 years for the team acquiring them. Bohm by himself actually nets you more.

    The mariners would be giving up almost the equivalent of our top 3 players for bohm casty, Ruiz (if you meant colten Emerson) Think about how we’d feel if that trade was the other way around.

    In this trade, we only give up bohm, a low leverage reliever 1 player who has negative value and one player who’s completely untradable along with 3 guys not in out top 10 prospects. that sounds like a great deal for us but that phone call doesn’t last long before a laugh and a click.

    I also have very little interest in arenado and wouldn’t need helsey if were going to get tanner Scott. probably better spent on profar since we’d have 2 or 3 closer types already-romano, Scott, Alvarado?

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  35. Not sure what some of you guys are smoking.

    Jim advised us not to take much of what is said by some reporters.

    Case in point – Jackson Roberts (?) throws out an idea for the Cardinals to send Arenado and $25M to the Phillies for INFIELDER Gabriel Roncones. Come on!

    Wade Miley wants to pitch again for the Brewers this coming season following TJ surgery. Last year he made $7M and pitched SEVEN INNINGS! That’s a million dollars an inning.

    How much do you think he wants to come back to the Brewers? Just once I’d like to see a guy say, “I made a ton of money last time and only gave you 7 innings so I’ll pitch this year at the minimum pay level”.

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    1. I loved Cliff Lee as a pitcher (I still think he was perhaps the most entertaining pitcher I’ve ever seen) but I’m still pretty mad at him for how he mailed in the end of his tenure as a Phillie. He refused to get surgery but could justify it on the ground that, by the time he recovered his contract would be over knowing that he delayed that decision in the first instance. I get it, but there was zero caring or effort there. I’m injured. Not pitching anymore. Contract runs through 2015. Oh well. Pay me.

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        1. He is nowhere to be found. No reunion. No old boys club. Nothing. It’s like he’s in the witness protection program. He’s a peculiar guy. But a very rich peculiar guy. But, wow, what a pitcher. Could throw any pitch, anywhere he wanted, in any count, for 9 innings. And they were generally plus pitches and he and Chooch knew exactly when he should throw which pitch.

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            2. And Nolan Ryan blew a 5-2 lead in the 8th inning of the deciding game five of the 1980 NLCS against the Phillies giving up 4 runs. So, what’s your point. Even the best pitchers can blow a lead once in a while.

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    2. Ciada … in turn … id like to see the owners give free beers to patron … and make dollar dog day … for all playoff home games

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        1. Ha, I was thinking more a “free” beer … not beer(s) 🙂 Those college kids are pretty rich these days if they can afford these stub hub ticket prices!

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  36. You guys are going to be unhappy because I don’t think more moves are likely. I think it’s still possible they sign a right handed hitting LF on a cheap one year deal plus they hope Walker pitches well enough in spring training that they can eat lots of his contract but still save money by trading him. Another reliever? Doubtful money wise.

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    1. Next week after the holiday break there could be some action. Usually the holiday week/10 days they have an unofficial ‘quasi’ dead period. Just prior to Christmas the Phillies and Marlins completed their Luzardo/Caba trade. But I think starting Monday things will re-heat up.

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    2. I can see not much happening. But….., there still seems to be a few teams in need of a 3B with much fewer options now. The price of starting pitching is high. I think Ranger could be a guy we make available.

      I really believe there are a couple of big moves to be made. What if we attach Ranger to Nick Castellanos and can almost get off the hook with him? That moves Kepler to RF, Marsh into a LF/CF platoon with Rojas and a Griuchuck-type? Those moves would make us better defensively, and get us under the $301M penalty mark.

      Middleton did say that he would break the $301M mark “for the right player.” I cannot believe Max Kepler and Joe Ross are “the right players.”

      I think Oakland and Florida have to add payroll and I believe Dave might have a trick or two up his sleeve.

      And Bohm? Who knows. The guy has been in the league for 5 years. This was his first good season. Do we really think he is going to be a 3-win player going forward as a singles hitter? There’s no guarantee he smashes 40 doubles again.

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      1. Bohm is probably going somewhere….I’d say a mid-western team, but who knows. Then again, Seattle was rumored a few weeks ago. One telling aspect…..he has not made any public statements since rumors surfaced about his trade availability. At least I have not seen anything from him. Maybe he already knows something is in the works and he is keeping mum.

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        1. Right. It’s when things are quietest is when to be on your toes. Arenado looks almost untradeable at this point and Bregman can only play for one team. Someone will bite.

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        2. I don’t see Bohm going anywhere to start the season unless, for some crazy reason, Bregman wants to do a one-year pillow contract, which I highly doubt. Aside from that, I think he’s in the line-up to start the year because there are no other reasonable cost alternatives.

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        3. Shortly after the season, Bohm told media he was confident he’d be back in Philly. It had no impact and a flood of rumors came out in the ensuing weeks. Unless you have a no-trade-clause like Arrenado, a player’s thoughts on being traded are mildly interesting at best.

          What hasn’t changed is that the Phils seem intent not to play in the high end of the 3B market and have no in-house replacement for Bohm. It would take Aidan Miller playing 3B in spring training for me to think Bohm’s future in Philly is time-stamped.

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          1. I don’t think the 3B market is limited to Bregman or bust. Trades happen. Nobody saw Luzardo coming. Nobody saw Brandon Marsh coming either. Sometimes, teams make trades that are not on our collective radars.

            Let’s just wait and see how the team shapes up at the end of March.

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            1. That’s true – but the reason I said that is that there aren’t a lot of obvious candidates out there and I do not see them picking up any long-term contracts or signing someone to a long-term contract. But if something it happens, I believe it will be an out of left field kind of deal like the other ones that have happened this year and not a move for a high profile name (not that mind those other deals – as a whole, I think the team did a great job with their financial restrictions).

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  37. Phillies trade DFA’ed Tyler Gilbert to CWS for Aaron Combs- a 2024 draftee with some impressive- but very limited- stats. Not a bad outcome for a DFA.

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  38. Hope you all had a Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah and Happy New Year celebration. I was pretty much unplugged for most of it but I did keep an eye on these moves as they went down.

    I really like the Luzardo move in the sense of what we gave up to get him.

    I still think a trade is coming. I don’t think the Payroll sits where it is for 2025. I think I read somewhere we are about to go into a really steep penalty for being over again…

    Ranger seems the logical move but I’m usually wrong on such things…

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    1. There is absolutely at least one more move coming. They are not going into the 2025 season without a solid right platoon bat for the outfield. They are probably going to add more bullpen help. Ranger could definitely be dealt but I think they will keep him for this year for a WS push and will tender him and let him walk next year. I love Ranger, but all signs are pointing to him not being on the team by 2026. Oh well, you can’t sign everyone.

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      1. I think they already have that platoon bat. Wes Wilson performed fairly well last season and can stand in LF. Not sure who else out there would be a good fit unless they can get Hays back for cheap.

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      2. If he’s still here (and I expect he will be) Castellanos is the only everyday outfielder currently on the big league roster. Which tells me Dombrowski will indeed acquire another OF, and a RH bat at that.

        I think Ranger gets dealt. For who? Who knows, buy the additional OF makes sense if he moves the needle.

        Bohm? No clue at this point. If anything I can see an out of nowhere trade for value at maybe 2 positions, but then who plays 3b?

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        1. Who plays third….IMO, leaning Arenado. When it seems so quiet, then Phillies are probably involved with the Cardinals.. Just a matter of how much the Cards will pick up of the remaining contract..

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  39. With the Astros in a little bit of a crunch, does anyone think it’s possible to deal Marsh to them for Presley and a prospect or two? Maybe Jose Ruiz goes back in the deal to help offset some of Presley’s $14M. That would really help solidify the bullpen, but then perhaps we have to explore a signing of Grichuck/Profar on short term deals.

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