631 thoughts on “Trade Winds (Phillies Discussion)”

1. Jim, I sure hope you are wrong on Rojas. I really like the kid, but I have zero say. I want him to stay here. Muzziotti is having a terrific season. Are scouts interested in him at all?

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   1. If Rojas stays in the system, when is he going to play:

      Marsh, pre-arb
      Castellanos, 3 more years
      Schwarber, 2 more years
      Pache, pre-arb

      Both Marsh and Pache are former top 50 prospects who are still young and they will get a lot of playing time to show that they are for real. This also means that their ceiling is higher than Rojas.

      Rojas is only up because Pache’s injured. And it’s debatable if Rojas would be called up if Guthrie was still in the system.

      Castellanos is not getting traded and I think it’s too early to trade Schwarber.

      So what does that mean? Unless a good offer comes in for Rojas (I doubt it), you keep him as depth for next season just in case Marsh/Pache falters.

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      1. Move Castellanos in a trade this off-season for a mid-rotation arm…his value is higher than Schwarber’s IMO.

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         1. He has more value but he’s a DH playing RF. The Phillies will have to eat some of the remaining money and there’s no way you’re getting a mid-rotation arm for him.

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         2. I don’t think DD will do it, but he needs to trade Schwarber or Castellanos. Having an OF of Marsh, Rojas, Pache would be elite, probably the best defensive OF in baseball. It’s obviously risky because you’re losing some pop, but I think you need to take some risk and see what some of these guys can do.

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            1. Agree that at some point you have to decide either you believe in these kids’ abilities or you don’t.

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   2. I really like Rojas as well!! I hope he stays with the Phillies!!

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   3. Matt, I hope I’m wrong, too. I think both Rojas and Muzziotti can play better in CF than Marsh. I was a little surprised the Phillies recalled Rojas over Muzziotti. Muzziotti is having a strong season at a higher level.

      I don’t think Muzziotti would draw any interest in a trade except as a throw-in. The Phillies used his last option in March. So, as long as he’s on the 40-man roster, any receiving team would have to keep him there or expose him to waivers as they tried to DFA him.

      Once DFA-ed, Muzziotti will be exposed to the Rule 5 draft at the next winter meetings.

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      1. Rojas was called upon over Muzzioti because he hits right handed.

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2. I agree with you on Song, he might get much better next year with more time but he’s not ready now.
   I disagree that everyone is available in a trade. I’m confident that the top 3 pitchers plus Crawford are untouchable. I think there are several guys who look appealing to other teams but I don’t think we’ll trade much for a starting pitcher unless he’s good enough to replace Ranger in a 4 man playoff rotation and has more years left on his contract. They’ll likely look to add another 5th starter for depth but he has to be better than Sanchez who has looked terrific in a small sample. Plus Falter has looked better too. I think Rojas is here until Pache comes back because they’re a copy of each other. The one thing I’m positive they’ll trade for is a starting LF. Cave has not looked great upon his return and I think they need to upgrade his spot. A righty hitting OF would help more but he needs to be able to play every day. I’m not excited about Pham but there are others out there as well. It will cost them a Muzzioti and someone with more upside like Heredia, Boyd, or Rincones.
   I’m not surprised that Morales was released but there was a time the org thought he was their future closer. Maybe another team can unlock him. Did you see what DeLos Santos is doing for Cleveland? It happens.

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   1. Murray…….are Rojas and Crawford the same in abilities, skills and n your evaluation?

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      1. Justin Crawford is 19 and presumably will grow into his 6’1″ frame. Even at this young age, he has demonstrated excellent contact skills. Crawford is thriving at Clearwater. At age 20, Rojas wasn’t performing that well at Clearwater.

         Crawford’s ceiling is higher because of his size (expectation of more power as he grows) and his contact skills.

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      2. Start with the obvious, Rojas hits righty and Crawford lefty. Neither will ever have the power to play a corner. Rojas is a gold glove caliber CF while Crawford is good but younger and could still get better. Crawford seems to have much better bat contact skills at a younger age. Rojas’ bat is still developing although it has really improved in the last year. They’re both super fast. In terms of overall system ranking, Crawford is probably 3 while Rojas is 5 so they’re very close. Crawford is younger and has a higher ceiling.

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3. Nola to Atlanta in the off-season.
   Interesting…..I would have thought Max Fried would be the one they would try to ink LTC prior to this season….but that did not happen.
   For them to sign Nola and at the AAV AND length of contract he is asking, is out of character for them.
   That would surprise me.
   I can see Crane, Dana Brown and the Astros doing it, or maybe even Chris Young and the Rangers.

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   1. I seriously doubt that happens. Nola is going to get at least $180M and let’s face it, he has regressed. The Braves are not big FA spenders, that’s not their MO.

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      1. For a plane ride from Atlanta to Louisiana compared to a ride from Philly isn’t enough to sign with the Braves for Nola.

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      2. Yes, the greatest decision DD may ever make in his time here in Philly is not extending Nola. Nola is an innings eater but all those miles are starting to show. He will get a monster deal and we will miss those innings, but that $$$ can be wisely spent elsewhere. I do not see Atlanta bidding for Aaron.

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4. Is it wrong to want Vierling back?

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   1. No. It is not wrong to want Matt Vierling back. I liked him as well. I wish he never left the Phillies! I also miss Nick Maton!

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   2. No. It is not wrong to want Matt Vierling back. I also miss Nick Maton!

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   3. No. It is not wrong to want Matt Vierling back. I would also like Nick Maton back with the Phillies.

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      1. Maton has been awful at the plate, Vierling picked it up in the beginning of the summer but I think he is hurt now.

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         1. What do you think the Phillies will do at the Trade Deadline this year?

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5. The big questions that I have are…
   1. What are the Phillies going to do at the Trade Deadline?
   2. Are they sellers, buyers, or both?
   3. Who goes and who stays with the Phillies?
   4. Who is available at the Trade Deadline?
   5. If the Phillies are buyers How much are they willing to spend?
   6. How will the moves they make impact the Phillies?

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   1. 1&2. They should be buyers.

      3. Everyone is available in the right deal. Realistically though, the players who would require top prospects in exchange aren’t going to be available. So, we don’t have to worry about trades involving our best prospects.

      4. The consensus is that the Phillies need/want a right-handed bat. Pham and Duvall meet that requirement. Truth be told, the Phillies would trade for ANY productive bat regardless of handedness. Bellinger was a target until the Cubs took him off the market.

      5. Recent history indicates they will overpay to get the guy(s) they want. But, it is only prospect capital.

      6. Frankly, I see little impact. The shakiest performers are also big contracts who aren’t going anywhere (Realmuto, Harper, Turner, Schwarber, Castellanos, Nola, Wheeler, Walker). The young guys are playing well enough, and are not the problem, but probably aren’t going to draw much trade interest (Stott, Bohm, Marsh, Suarez). The 5th starter and bullpen are doing well. The type of starter that the Phillies would be interested in is one that they could start in a playoff game but Snell and Stroman aren’t available (watch them in the offseason). They have pitchers at Lehigh Valley who could step in if Sanchez or the bullpen faltered. The bench could use some improvement. Stubbs is fine. Sosa should improve now that his exposure should be lessened with Harper at first base. I wouldn’t mind an improvement over Harrison. I don’t have a problem with Cave/Rojas. So, how much impact can a bench bat have on game outcomes? Especially the right-handed side of a platoon? If the big boys don’t carry the team these next two months, it won’t matter what was done on August 1st.

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6. I have been extremely happy with Harper’s defense at 1B. From my early looks he seems like he could be an exceptional defensive 1B. I love him there long term.

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   1. Yes, he’s show good instincts for the position. Still needs some work on his footwork, etc. but he’s long-term future is not in RF.

      Harper playing 1b opens up many more options for the team over the next few years and makes trading for an OF with some power and years of control a viable option.

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      1. I figured over the off-season they would make it permanent for Harper at first.
         Question….can they ..Dombrowski and Fuld….convince Middleton to NOT offer a QO to Rhys……loyalty can sometimes be detrimental when running a business, and baseball is all business..

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   2. Amazing actually. The guy learned how to play 1b in two months while relearning how to throw and he looks really good already.

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7. I was not a big fan of bringing up Rojas but I’m growing to like him.

   If DD is going to trade CF prospects, I’d prefer Muzziotti at this point.

   I’m still not sure about Crawford and would like the opinions of those who have seen him more often than my twice.

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   1. I just get flashbacks when it comes to Crawford of ALL the failed toolsy outfield prospects the Phillies started this century. It’s a graveyard of names that never amounted to much in the majors.

      I wish him the best and hope he proves me wrong.

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      1. Those guys were athletes they hoped to make into ballplayers, Reggie Taylor, Greg Golson, etc. Crawford is already a ballplayer.

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   2. Crawford is an athlete but he’s also a baseball player with pedigree. He’s very tall and still very thin but still young. He’s hitting 330 with little power but that will come as he gets stronger and older. He’s a legit solid prospect at this time.

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8. Look no further than LHV to find a RB hitter. Wendell Wilson.
   He is a home run bitter, batting. 265 and versatile. Plays all IF and IF positions. Drop Ellis off 40 man and bring up Wilson.

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   1. Weston …..he may have turned the corner at 28 years old…29 in Sep….Brewers never got him to the majors to see what he could do, but his metrics were not great when he was in their system so that probably is the reason. Late bloomers do come around it seems every year for some team.
      The probably have given it some thought, wh knows he could be added to the 40 and see where it goes from there……a Chris Coste guy perhaps

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      1. Yes, Weston. Don’t know why I keep wanting to call him Wendell.
         Remember we won a World Series with Chris Coste.

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         1. Well, it could be because you’re old enough to remember Wendell Wilkie, but I doubt it.

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            1. Yeah thanks, my older brother was in his class.

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      2. If Weston could play some LF at a high level that would be interesting. 466 innings at SS 61 in LF and 9 in RF. Don’t know how well he did in the OF but if he can play SS at AAA he should be able to handle a corner OF spot.

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         1. DMAR ….yes I can see that…best atheletes are usually at shorstop thru HS and for the most part in college.

            I know it will not happen this season, but the philies and managment should think about switching Stott and Turner for the future.
            Turner is aging poorly as a defensive shortstop…he could be above average at second base…and Stott can handle shortstop wold think better than Turner.

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9. Regarding a 5th starter, we gave up the former 1.1 for a washed up Thor; no one will perform better than Sanchez, not to mention we don’t have to use up our sparse resources. How well Sanchez has pitched is the under-reported story of the 2023 season. For 3 years all anyone heard is how Klentak got screwed by Tampa for giving up on a 19 year Aussie. Mead has regressed at AAA and been hurt, while Sanchez is pitching as well as #3 starter with a WHIP<1.00 and ERA<3.00

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   1. Also regarding a 5th starter, I was really hoping that Andrew Painter would have the 5th starter for the Phillies but now since he is out till 2026 someone else is going to have to step it up for the Phillies. Just the question is… Who is going to step up for the Phillies and be that 5th starter?

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10. BTW how much are Nola & Hoskins making this year? Trying to figure out what comes off the books. I know Kimbrel is $10 million and I think we have 1 more year of Kingery at $6 million.

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    1. You could check Cot’s contracts. It’ll tell you all you need to know.

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    2. Why are the Phillies still paying Scott Kingery? He is never up in the Major Leagues?

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       1. He signed a major league contract, which are fully guaranteed in MLB. He’d be getting paid even if they cut him entirely.

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11. Song will either replace Covey on the roster or will be used in a trade to a team that would be willing to give him a roster spot for the rest of season. I have doubts that he would stay on Phils roster the rest of the way.

    Pache will likely replace Rojas once he returns which looks like about a week or so away.

    The area where upgrades could be had are Harrison and/or Sosa’s spots. Sosa has been ok this year but if someone better is available then go for it. Harrison is well below average so far and the best spot to upgrade. A right handed hitting utility infield guy would be ideal.

    Starting pitching depth or a top end starter would be good.

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    1. Upgrading Harrison or Sosa will help, but it’s not going to be huge difference (especially with 51 games left) because they don’t play enough to matter. And bench players are just like relievers, they vary year to year.

       The Phillies won’t be trading for a top end starter. The Phillies had starting pitching depth, their names were Cristopher Sanchez and Andrew Painter. And Sanchez is doing his job when Falter was demoted. Also, looks like the Phillies are trying to stretch out Nick Nelson at Lehigh (with mixed results).

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12. I’m surprised there is no mention of Mitch McGarry. I don’t see why he isn’t an option if Sanchez falls back or someone gets injured. Sure, his lack of command is a worry but look at what the Braves have done. They don’t hesitate to bring up their pitching prospects to see what they can do.

    I absolutely wouldn’t trade Rojas, McGarry, or Abel. With Painter’s setback, you need one of McGarry or Abel to come through as a solid rotation piece and having both increases your odds instead of hoping you choose right. Next year, Schwarber should only play LF once a week at the most and I would sacrifice power potential for stronger defense. Either Pache or Rojas should be the CF next year with Marsh in LF. We have plenty of thump in the lineup if everyone produces to their career norms.

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    1. Griff. And there hasn’t been mention of him because he has a 5.32 BB/9 in AA. His stuff will play in the major leagues, but big league hitters will literally just wait until he leaves one in the zone and tee off on it. If he doesn’t leave one in the zone, he’ll probably walk them. So yeah. He’s still working on some things.

       It’s all good and well to say we need Abel and/or McGarry to step up in place of Painter. But the fact of the matter is, they aren’t in the same universe as Painter right now. They’re all tremendously talented, but Painter is light years ahead when it comes to control/command. Painter is a phenom straight up. It’s not fair to expect other prospects to be on his level.

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       1. DanK…Dave D did briefly mention McGarry yesterday as an option when asked about the 5th spot.
          But, also stated Sanchez has been doing well and lets see how it plays out for him.
          So he may not be high on the list to step in there right now.

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          1. I mean yeah, he’s an option in that he’s in our org and has the ability to pitch. But you gotta figure he’s very low on that depth chart. Unless I’m forgetting a move, he’s not even currently on the 40 man. So that combined with the fact that he’s not exactly knocking down the door tells me he’s behind Sanchez, Falter, Strahm, and Nelson at least.

             It’s not a knock on McGarry at all. He still has a good chance at being a solid contributor in the majors in the future. We just got spoiled by Painter’s meteoric rise, and Griff and Abel on are on a relatively slower trajectory.

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13. Romus saw your post on the other thread about those 3 pitchers. Pretty incredible all those kids were on 1 HS team. Fact is though while they all made the MLB and flashed some greatness it never really sustained itself.

    Fried and Gio will probably be good solid pitchers for years to come. Jack’s injury probably doesn’t allow for the same success.

    Saw a good bit of Bohm negativity. I’m not in that camp. Not yet. He’s always reminded me of Jayson Werth as a hitter. Werth at 26 over 400 PAs in the MLB OPSd 711 with 7 HRs.

    Werth didn’t even play in the MLB at age 27. He came to the Phillies at age 28 and hit 8 HRs over 304 PAs but had a really nice 863 OPS.

    Werth really came into his own at age 29 and continued that to age 35 averaging 20 HRs and an 856 OPS over that span. Who knows what Alec can do in the next several seasons. This far though he is not the problem.

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    1. Let’s try letting him play 3b every day…. He’s looked so much better, it’s obvious he’s worked very hard at it. He’d been a solid rbi guy, clearly not the problem.

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       1. If Miller is the real deal and hits like all the scouts claim, he could be in AA ball in 2025….then who knows where he goes from there.
          I can certainly see physical similarities between Miller and Braves Austin Riley…both big strong guys. Riley was in AA ball at age 20 and after a slight injury delay at age 21, took off and was on the Braves at age 22.
          I hope Miller has the same career progression…also think he can stay at third.
          Bottom line…….where that leaves Bohm is anyone’s guess if Miller pushes his way to the majors faster than they expect.

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    2. Werth isn’t a great comparison. For one, he was WAY more athletically gifted than Bohm is. Nothing against Bohm, but Werth was a 5 tool player. He was even initially a catcher before moving to the OF (which was only possible because of his speed).

       But more importantly, he had already started to break out with the Dodgers. He had 115 OPS+ and 3 bWAR for the Dodgers as a 25 year old in 2004. His down season in 2005, as well as his lost season in 2006, were because he was hit by a pitch in spring training and had a unique type of fracture that was (is still?) hard to diagnose. The Phillies lucked out that the Dodgers just couldn’t figure it out soon enough. And then he went to the Mayo clinic, signed with the Phillies, and got back on track.

       I agree that Bohm has another level (offensively) that he’s capable of reaching. But unless Alec has some chronic pain that I’m unaware of, Werth isn’t the guy to make a comparison to. If anything, it may be a swing change that unlocks Bohm. I just don’t know if he’ll be able to find the instruction he needs for that in Philadelphia.

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14. If I was GM, I would try to bring in Bellinger and at the same time flip Schwarber. Then add another player for Harrison’s spot

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    1. If I was GM I would go out and see if Bobby Miller of the Los Angeles Dodgers is available. If he is, that’s who I would go after. I really like him and his stuff. He is a rookie pitcher too!!

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    2. Trading Schwarber only makes sense if it is a fantasy baseball team. In real life, he is the heart and soul of that dugout. Like it or not, he isn’t going anywhere.

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       1. As critical as I’ve been of Schwarber, personally I don’t even WANT him gone. He’s a great guy, supposedly a good mentor, and an absolute threat any time he steps to the plate. Regardless of his batting average, no pitcher takes him lightly. One mistake and the ball is getting deposited into the upper deck.

          The only movement I want for him is down in the lineup (let him hit homers with people on base finally. PLEASE) and off of the field.

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          1. Yeah I have to agree there actually, my issue is him leading off when he is a prototypical #5 hitter (Lots of BB, HR, and K’s with low BA). So that is an issue with the manager not the player.

             The correct fix would likely mean Stott should be hitting 1 or 2 with possibly Turner despite his poor showing for him.

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          2. Shwarber has a .194 BABIP. Second worst in baseball and 65 points lower than his career average. Really strange since they got rid of the shift this year.

             His walk rate is up and his k rate is at his career level. His batted ball metrics all look in line with his career number. No idea why his babip is so absurdly low.

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             1. Bring back the shift 🙂

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15. Nola to Braves?
    Possibly, they will sign either Fried or Nola, whichever one is cheaper
    For the record, I still believe in Nola. Rough patch, but he is coming into his wheel house. Setting on fire for this second half run, will see
    Boy, did Phillies pitching needs change in a hurry. Nola was almost expendable if Painter would’ve emerged, now you gotta sign him imo. Let him be an overpriced #4 or 5 it’s not our money
    Harper it 1st is interesting. Really interesting. I would think you could put Pache, Rojas, and Marsh in the OF for playoff defense when up in the 8th/9th. Have Hoskins come off the bench for PH if he recovers in time
    If the bullpen performs like last year, great plan. We won’t get to hold our breath on castellanos sliding catches but hey .. I’ll
    Take a routine out in the 9th any day on defense

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    1. Tac…Nola’s has already rejectd the Phillies initial offer earlier in the year…..my guess 5 yrs plus an option year at $26M AAV…..probably close to in line with Rodon’s contract with the Yankees…6 yrs/$162M.
       So Nola may be wanting the extended length and also an AAV of $28M.
       I do not see the Braves working that contract…like I mentioned earlier the Astros and Rangers will do it.
       Braves have an issue keeping their yuong arms healthy…Soroka, Anderson, Wright et al…..Fried is now showing signs of health issues…they may pass on him also.
       They are not afraid of letting their stars go….Freeman for one.

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       1. Yeah, I’m sure If they do decide to let him walk, a slightly worse player will emerge for the league minimum, seems to happen all the time. I have a Braves fan I talk to frequently, friendly rivalry, the braves have a lot of money …they may, so don’t be surprised if they start spending like they should. The stadium has produced a lot of revenue mainly do the the hotels/restaurants they built up around it. Will see, but I will say I’m a bit worried. They stole Acuna & albies with those contracts, hopefully the others make them pay.
          FWIW, I’d rather have Nola over
          fried. I think we underestimate Nola as a phan base, and possibly even on this site.. yes even this Year. I sign him, let him regress into an overpaid 4th then and an overpaid 5th starter. he’s good, keep’em.
          Middleton is willing to spend, let’em 🙂

          The only good part about painter getting injured is that at least he is likely protected from being traded before he makes it or breaks it in a Phillies uniform. Wishing Abel or McGarry could’ve filled the 5th starter spot, little worrisome that they couldn’t _ I don’t want another morales or kilome to flame out

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    2. Why do we “have” to sign Nola?

       I was a big fan for a long time, but I think it gets harder and harder for a pitcher to thrive with his profile. I mean he is good and he gives you innings but he’s not a shut-down post season player and he’s going to get huge money.

       I have grown a little tired of watching Nola pitch well for 4 or 5 innings and then get blown up.

       I would tender him a contract and then be in the market to see what the most cost effective options might be. Maybe it will be Nola, but maybe not.

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       1. Same on Nola. Been a fan for many years but he’s at a point now where age and innings are going to become a factor quickly.

          His performance is extremely impacted by his velocity. When he’s 93-94 the rest of his stuff plays very well and he’s a top of the rotation pitcher. When he’s 90-91 he becomes very average.

          I would not be in a rush to offer him a long-term deal but would instead give him the QO and then see what the market says to his value vs. other options that are out there.

          At his point, is Nola really much better than a guy like Walker who’s making $18m per year?

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       2. I don’t know if even giving Aaron Nola another contract is a good option. I would try to go out and get someone who is better than Nola. Nola has been up and down all year.

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       3. He’s good, very good. Under appreciated by most phans, but with Painter going down, and providing what could’ve been similar production for the league minimum… and saving the 16mil +
          For other areas… I’d of let him
          Go but now painter is on day 1 of recovering from TJ, Abel has not emerged either, and McGarry is walking too many batters.

          What are we saying the window is?
          Everyone is aging, and teams like Baltimore are emerging, so …3-4 yrs? Need to sign Nola, as not a lot of pitchers out there like him. Let him slide into the 4th or 5th SR role … and one of the young guys push him out

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       4. They will tender Nola a QO first I assume

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          1. Whether the Phillies sign Aaron Nola or not depends on Aaron Nola. I’ve given my opinion on this numerous times over the past year.
             It’s reasonable to assume this spring, Dave Dombrowski made Aaron a going rate offer for a SP2 a season prior to free agency. The Padres gave 29 YO Joe Musgrove 5/100M in the summer of 2022. Musgrove was set to hit the open market 3 months later. I’d guess the Phillies POBO offered something like 5/110M. Nola and his agent said “no thanks” and bet on himself. The good news for Aaron: he’s stayed healthy. The bad news: he’s regressed. Now on the wrong side of 30, his velo is down and his HRs allowed are up. Kevin Gausman got 5/110M as a 30 YO FA in 2022. IMO, a fair deal for Nola on the open market is 5/125M. Is Aaron (and his agent) ok with a fair deal, or does he want to break the bank and sign with highest bidder? Normally, if a guy makes it to free agency, he’s signing with the club who is offering the most money.

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             1. 5/140

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                1. 6 years, $175M.

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             2. Kevin Gausman was barely league average most of his career before he broke out at age 30 with 5.2 WAR. He only got $110M because his track record is very spotty. Aaron Nola has a history of performance and health. He’s going to get more than $125M. Yes, he has underperformed this season so he won’t get crazy money, but he’s still going to get significantly paid.

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                1. Aaron Nola 3 years prior to free agency (2021-23): 103 ERA+ & 3.28 FIP

                   Kevin Gausman 3 yrs prior to free agency (2019-21): 113 ERA+ & 3.30 FIP

                   Look like similar pitchers to me.

                   Nola had a bonkers season 5 years ago (2018), and you constantly compute that outlier into this career WAR argument. Smart clubs aren’t going to do that.
                   I’ve been down the Aaron Nola “next contract” road with you plenty of times. You advocated for a 5/140M deal a year before Aaron was even eligible for free agency. Those were/are numbers no pitcher (I can think of) has ever gotten in an extension a season prior to reaching the open market. What makes you more sold on Aaron nine months after you first banged the table for a 5/140M early extension? Is it the drop in velo, the decline in command, or the amount of HRs he’s coughed up?
                   You’ve been throwing out SP1 numbers. IMO, Nola is a SP2. Is it possible Aaron finds a team willing to shell out the 6/180M figure you once predicted? It’s possible, though unlikely. Would that kind of deal be smart? IMO … no.

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                2. But Gausman and Nola are very different pitchers, even if the peripherals for the last few years seem similar (which I accept).

                   Gausman is and was a power pitcher who was coming into his own, much like Wheeler did at a similar age. Nola is a movement and command guy, even though he’s not a soft tosser.

                   The question isn’t his performance to date but, rather, what you project him to do over the next 5-6 years. Look, Nola is a good pitcher, there’s no question about that. But when I watch him, I wonder if we are seeing a player who is trending down. My view is that hitters on the whole have improved dramatically over the last 10-15 years and even a lot over the last 5 years. I think this has made it harder for a command and control pitcher like Nola to dominate and, on top of that, Nola has only been so-so at best in big games/situations.

                   So I, for one, would let this play out. Obviously, tender him a contract so you get compensation if you lose him – that’s a no brainer and he’s not taking the tender. See what’s on the market and see what Nola asks and make a cost-benefit decision at the time. If he’s too expensive, find someone else. He’s a very good pitcher, but he’s not irreplaceable.

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                3. I agree Hinkie when that Gausman contract happened I thought wow the jays stole him.

                   But then you look at Rodon and think the Yankees way overpaid at $175 a year later.

                   Personally I wouldn’t pay Nola more than 5/$125. The FA class is going to be headed by Ohtani but a number of other guys will be out there including: Stroman if he opts out, Giolito, Montgomery, Urias, Snell amongst some other opt options and veterans.

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                4. @Hinkie, when Nola was 1 year away from free agency, there was always a risk for Nola to get hurt and him (and his agent) knows that. I believe they were willing to give a discount, but not much of a discount. So 5/145 I thought was fair, and 5/110 was in my opinion too light. Then the market for top end FA starters exploded:

                   Carlos Rodon 6/162
                   Jacob deGrom 5/185
                   Justin Verlander 2/86

                   Even Chris Bassit somehow got 3/63.

                   Just because I think Nola is going to get 6/175 doesn’t mean I want to give him that. I don’t think the Phillies want to give him that either. All it takes is 1 team to think that 2023 was a blip and there it goes. Nola doesn’t have the injury history as Rodon or deGrom and he’s younger than the 4 mentioned above.

                   Scanning the list of FA pitchers, obviously the #1 pitcher is Ohtani. But Nola is in the mix for the second pitcher with Stroman, Urias, Giolito, Snell. 5/125 is too light for Nola.

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          2. Absolutely tender him the QO

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    3. I don’t see the Braves wanting Aaron Nola. They already have a good rotation and if they want more players they are going to get others who are not up and down like Nola. I don’t know where I see Nola going but I just can’t see him going to the Braves and I can’t see the Braves wanting him.

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16. Not sure if he has a no-trade option but an idea to get rid of Schwarber in a way that keeps him happy. The Yankees would take him I’m sure and I’ll bet he’d be attracted to the Yankee mystique. That short left field would have Cashman thinking of Schwarber & Judge as another Mantle & Maris. Dombrowski is smarter than Cashman and he’d probably be able to talk him into taking no salary help. I don’t know much about the Yankee farm but I’d settle for prospects.

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    1. I meant short right field.

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17. Former prospect update.
    Former Phillies’ prospect, SS Luis Garcia, was released on July 20th by the West Michigan Whitecaps, Detroit’s Advanced-A affiliate.

    Garcia was never able to live up to the hype generated by his 2018 GCL season when he posted a .369/.433/.488/.921 as a 17-year-old.

    Garcia advanced to Double Reading for the Phillies in 2022 and was traded after 6 games there. He played in 4 Double-A games at Erie after the trade but was demoted to High-A at the start of the 2023 season. He played in 44 games this season and slashed .171/.340/.244/.584 and was striking out in 33% of his plate appearances. Probably out of baseball at age 22.

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    1. Phillies have whiffed on quite a few 7 figure international kids…..Garcia just joins the list…….waiting for the anvil to fall with Jhailyn.
       Last 12 years,since Tocci’s signing in 2011, mostly all the high bonus $$$ kids have come up short.
       Phillies seem to do better with the inexpensive low bonus offerings to the Latin kids.

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       1. Plus high 6 figure LA signings, yet someone never loses his job……

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          1. Maybe just letting him play it out until retirement now that he is in his 60s.

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    2. I’ll never forget being excited about that GCL season and hearing you say don’t get too excited….I’ve seen him play its not as impressive in person as it is in a box score.

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18. I meant short right field

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19. Turner has been awful. Pretty sure he’d have a 1.000 OBP if he didn’t swing. They don’t throw him strikes bc he only swings if it’s a slider way outside or in the dirt.

    He’s killing this team. Virtually an automatic out at the top of the order. Reminds me a lot of castellanos last year. Needs to hit 7 or so. So frustrating to see him come up with people on and strike out.

    Also wasn’t he supposed to be fast. When he gets on base he either gets picked off or doesn’t steal. Not even a threat. To say he’s been underwhelming is a huge understatement. Would love to see him sit a little.

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    1. “Also wasn’t he supposed to be fast. When he gets on base he either gets picked off or doesn’t steal. Not even a threat.”

       This can’t be a real post. For all of his struggles, his speed can’t be questioned. He’s not a threat? He’s 10th in MLB in steals. And that’s in spite of the fact that not a single other person in the top 15 has a sub-300 OBP like he does. There’s a reason he’s 4th in baseball in BsR (fangraph’s metric for valuing base running).

       21-0 in SB attempts and he’s not a threat. Unreal.

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       1. DanK…agree.
          Turner obviuosly has been having his struggles this season…at the play and in the field…but when on base his base running has been plus.
          Defensively, after this season the Phillies need to seriusly think about switching Stott and Turner….I do not see Turned improving in the field as he ages. I can remember how poor Derek Jeter’s DRS got after his age31 season.

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          1. Not trying to be a smart a$$ but if you’re not very good at SS how can you be good at 2B? Generally speaking the only difference between the 2 positions was arm strength IMO…

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             1. Nah, in addition to needing a better arm, SS generally needs to be faster/have better reflexes/have better range too. In part because there are more RHH in baseball (hitters tend to pull the ball, plus balls that are pulled are typically faster than balls that are hit the opposite way). And also because the extra distance to 1B means you have less time to get to the ball, and get yourself ready to throw.

                So basically it’s not just that the throw is longer, but that everything happens just a little bit faster at SS.

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                1. The typical concern for second basemen….is how they turn the pivot for the double play and their subsequent throw to first base.
                   That is the one area that is more difficult then the shortstop position has for the double play.

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       2. Danny. 21 stolen bases 100+ games in and you’re excited. Gtfoh. On pace for 30 steals from one of fastest guys in baseball and you’re excited!? And with new rules to make base stealing easier. Wow. Shocking

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          1. “from one of fastest guys in baseball”

             “Also wasn’t he supposed to be fast.”

             Pick a stance. And context matters. I noticed you conveniently left out the fact that 1) he’s still top 10 in ALL OF BASEBALL in steals despite how much less he gets on base and 2) he’s literally perfect at picking his spots.

             You think he couldn’t have more steals if he just ran every time? Dude would be at 50 by now if he didn’t care about getting caught. But 50 steals isn’t worth it if you’re getting caught 30 times, too.

             Turner is an incredible base runner and absolutely a base stealing threat. If you can’t see that, you’re not paying attention.

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20. Damm Jim I just checked back in and I’m so happy you and the bride are healthy!!! To hell with our club. God Bless

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21. Not only has the Angels decided to pull Ohtani from the trade market, they dove right in and traded for Lucas Giolito (rental) and Reynaldo López (rental) and gave up Edgar Quero and Ky Bush. Quero is a top 100 prospect and Bush was the Angels #3 prospect. Now Quero was a catcher and presumably blocked by O’Hoppe, but still, a heavy price for 2 rentals.

    The price has just went up for Bellinger and Stroman and the Cubs have to be giddy with this development.

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    1. Can you trust Moreno on what he says,
       …..’I am selling the team , on second thought, now I am not’
       Moreno could turn his team around, with a trade to the Dodgers and their offering….but he says anyone but the Dodgers
       I will believe Ohtani is off the market come August 2nd.

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       1. LOL I hear you Romus but Moreno is not trading Ohtani. He’s the only owner I’ve ever come across that managed to have the 2 best players in the sport and not be able to reach the playoffs on the regular let alone win a division.

          The Angels are 4th in team OPS and 20th in Pitching 4 back from a WC. They gotta chance

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          1. DMAR …Yankees are in last place…and they have a better record than the Angels…..three teams in the AL East will be in the [;layoffs…..Twins or Cleveland, or one team, from the Central……I cannot see the Rangers or Astros falling out of it.

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22. I don’t see us really needing pitching this time around.

    Castellanos really needs to be dropped to around 7 in the LU. Kyle to 5 and Stott to LO would be ideal. I like Bohm 4 he has a knack for driving in runs even if the power isn’t there.

    I like the idea of Cave/Rojas or Cave/Pache in the 9 hole. Cave’s CF days are probably behind him.

    Weston Wilson hit his 25th HR for the Pigs last night. I’d drop Harrison or move him and add Wilson as the backup. It be fun to see if he could add some punch. At 28 maybe he is our Max Muncy.

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    1. Yes, Wilson can do everything that Harrison can do and more. Also, Kingery could too.

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    2. I’m confused why you want Castellanos lower in the order than Schwarber. Nicky hits for a higher average, gets on base more, and has just been the better offensive player this year than Kyle. Pretty much the only thing Schwarber is doing better right now is hitting HRs. And we benefit more from those by having people on base when it happens. So we should want the guy who gets on base but is less likely to homer up before the one who is more likely to produce an out, but also more likely to put one in the stands.

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       1. Nick is no longer the hitter that I used to enjoy. If you watch his ABs he’s always cheating (leaking out) to get to velocity. He pretty much tries to pull everything these days.

          A few years ago when he was really raking he was a right center gap hitter with power. That seems to be gone. He has 0 opposite field HRs this year.

          As of Saturday, he ranks in the 32nd percentile in MLB in average exit velocity (88.2 mph) and in the 23rd percentile in hard-hit percentage (35.3%). It’s not what you want from a player making $100 million over five years.

          Kyle OTOH is in the 76 percentile on Hard Hit Balls. Neither is exceptional but is my reasoning for having Kyle ahead of Nick.

          And I really like Nick as a player. I think he gives you everything he has in the field. He just has a horrible swing right now.

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          1. Found this really cool video of Nick’s 2019 HRs. You can pretty easily see the difference

             https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1GCEU_enUS920US920&q=2019+nick+castellanos+hrs&tbm=vid&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjI1bT9tq-AAxV5EGIAHXvPD_IQ0pQJegQICRAB&biw=1807&bih=887&dpr=1#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:f0f5c4e8,vid:Xp1MjhWrQ8A

             Would love for Long to get him back to this. Even close would be nice.

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          2. might want to look at this video. At the 1:17 mark it certainly looks like he’s hit an opposite field HR..

             https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27H88CueInA

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             1. Did I miss one?

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                1. Think so.

                   Castellanos’s performance is down from his peak years in Detroit but not as bad as it would appear.

                   As you note his hard hit % is down about 7% from his peak years but his soft hit % is the same. He’s also hitting to all fields at about the same percentages as he always has.

                   He’s not having the season he had in 2021 in Cincy but that season appears to be an outlier within the last 5 years.

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                2. The genesis of the conversation was where should he hit in the LU. I don’t like him at 3 or 4 at the moment.

                   Physically he is a specimen. He can hit the ball out of any park any field in the league. He should be barreling up more balls than he is.

                   He’s only 31. As I said I begged for us to get him for years but something is off and its frustrating me watching him flail away at off speed and be late on the FB.

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23. The last 3 weeks of the season are going to be very interesting with 6 against the Braves and 7 against the Mets.

    The Mets seemingly will be out of it but I don’t doubt for a minute they will play us tough if we’re not prepared.

    And today we’re only 10 back from the division so we could easily find ourselves within striking distance of winning the division.

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    1. If I’m being honest, I think I’d prefer the Braves go on (another) tear so we’re NOT close to the division lead. The most likely way we’d be close to them is if they slump while we play about as well as we have been since June. But if that happens, and the NL West keeps up what they’re doing, there’s a solid chance the only representative the east has this year will be the winner of the division. So if it’s a dog fight between us and the Braves at the end of the year, I don’t trust that we win that.

       On the other hand, if they’re cruising into the playoffs, they probably rest some people at the end of the year and get their bench/young guys some game time to see who they want for the postseason. We might be able to steal a couple more wins from them if they’re not full throttle, which would help us in securing a WC.

       But if we’re in a fight for the division and the loser likely gets a WC, yeah that would be a fun time.

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    2. And the Braves are 3-7 last ten games….this is their slump…they have the Brew Crew and Angels up next.
       Their overall starting pitcher showing chinks in the armor.

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24. The Phillies just came off of a difficult 13 game stretch where they went 7-6. They played SD (3-1), MIL (1-2), CLV (1-2), and BAL (2-1).

    Things get a little better for the next 14 game stretch. They play PIT, KC, MIA, and WS. They really need to go 10-4 or 9-5 and win the Marlins series.

    That stretch is followed by 3 with the Twins and 2 with Toronto. This is the opportunity to create a little distance with the playoff teams.

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    1. I concur Ciada

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    2. As frustrating as the team has been (and, let’s face it, they are), I think what this reveals is that this team has a pretty deep pitching staff both on the starting end and the bullpen. As much as any team I can remember, things rarely unravel with the pitching (lately, they basically almost never get blown out) and the team is always in the hunt in the last few innings, even when they are behind. And, similarly, even though the line-up isn’t great – it’s pretty darned deep. The performance difference between the top and bottom of the line-up is negligible which, again, means they can always hang around, string together some hits and score some runs – and they often do.

       Ultimately, however, for them to go far in the playoffs they are going to need more star performance from star players.

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       1. catch … I think your last point ▶ “for them to go far in the playoffs they are going to need more star performance from star players” is right on.

          I think Dombrowski can/should do a couple of things this week.

          1️⃣ Sure up the back end of the BP. Kimbrel failed in his two outings prior to throwing in the 8th inning last night. Ser-Ant’ny and Jose Alvarado have both bounced between healthy-and-hurt. Jordan Hicks, as a rental, makes sense to me.

          2️⃣ Improve the bench with a RHH OFer who doesn’t suck defensively. This is where Dombrowski should (IMO) use his best resources to go after Dylan Carlson. The Cardinals have screwed with his head, but Carlson is still young (24 YO), comes w/3.5 years of team control, is an abv avg defender (in every OF spot) w/a big arm, and is a switch-hitter who excels from the right side (.309/.380/.475 career slasher vs LHP). Like Brandon Marsh and Cristan Pache, Carlson is a former top 50 prospect who could benefit from Kevin Long’s tutoring. As a mater of fact, Carlson has been a lot more productive as a Cardinal than Marsh or Pache were as Angels/Braves/A’s.

          St. Louis needs pitching. Dombrowski has arms to deal. He can put together a deal for Carlson and Hicks with a package headlined by Griff McGarry. Add Noah Song, who isn’t ready to be on the Phillies roster, but could be hid in the Cardinals’ BP for 3 months. Then sweeten the deal with a lottery ticket or two.

          Your game plan is to get a lead early (gotta count on Harper/Turner/Schwarber/Castellanos/Realmuto to pick it up), and protect with a dominant BP, and strong late inning OF defense (Pache/Rojas in CF, Marsh in LF, Carlson in RF).

          The other thing Dombrowski could do is go hunting for a rental hitter (to save the club’s best prospects) who he feels has the ability to catch fire and carry the team. Something the Giants found when they picked up Cody Ross in the summer of 2010 (sorry to even bring that up, Phillies fans). This year, that could be another dude named Cody: Cody Bellinger has regained his mojo in Chicago. He not only gives you plus D in every OF spot, but he’s also a GG caliber defender at 1B. Not sure what it might take to land the former MVP, and I don’t even care that he’s a LHH. He’s the kind of player who could finally light a match under this offense.

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          1. Don’t think the Cards are trading either guy. I would talk to the Mets about a deal for Pham and David Robertson who I’m sure would love to come back. It would probably cost Rojas (I hope not) or maybe two lesser names like Muzzioti and Rincones with a throw in pitcher.

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             1. Please, no more David Robertson – for the Phillies he’s like bad luck Schleprock (wozee wozee woo woo).

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                1. I hear you but he’s had a great year (2.05) and won’t cost too much. Healthy, he’d be a big help.

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25. Also, Hinkie, Bellinger hits Lefthanded Pitchers very well. He would be a great addition, but I think the cost to acquire him will be very high.

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26. Aidan Miller played his first FCL game and went 3 for 4. Time to promote him! Haha, keep it up young man.

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    1. Actually, a bunch of 2023 draft picks played in the FCL game. Has there been any promotions?

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    2. He’s going to be really fun to watch. He just turned 19 in June which means he’ll be 20 (LOL Duh) half way through the CLW season next year.

       Maybe he gets promoted to LKW by mid 2024 to catch him up with Crawford.

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27. I see Noah Song got hit around yesterday… 3 walks and a HR. He was supposed to throw 2 innings but only made 1.1… allowing 3 hits and 5 runs. Not good.
    I was pulling for him to make the club for the next month. I thought he might be able to take Covey’s spot. I don’t like to say any ML ball player sucks but when Covey comes into the game, I generally have no reason to continue watching.

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    1. “I don’t like to say any ML ball player sucks but when Covey comes into the game, I generally have no reason to continue watching.”,
       ….you can’t take one for the team!

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       1. I know Brogdon can be hit or miss but does anyone think he’s worse than Covey or Bellatti

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          1. Covey, no. Bellatti, Yes.

             Brogdon has some of the worst body language of any pitcher I’ve ever seen. Drive me nuts watching him mope around the mound every time he misses on a pitch.

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             1. LOl that didn’t come out right. I meant Bellatti and or Brogdon have to be better than Covey

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             2. He really does. For him, I think it’s a lot more mental. Although he sometimes loses his command with his changeup.

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                1. I think for Brogdon it’s almost all mental. For a guy who throws in the mid to upper 90’s with a great change-up he acts like he as zero confidence that he can get hitters out and is afraid of the strike zone.

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    2. Noah is clearly not ready to get MLB hitters out. I don’t think anyone thinks that he is. The question is projecting him next year. With a full year of development and strength training. I agree on Covey. He is not an MLB level pitcher either. But the bigger question is would they want to add depth to the pen and that Noah would take up a spot.

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28. Romus… Haaaa… I get your point. But I’ve been watching this team since before Harry Kalas came to Philly. Loved listening to By Saam and Bill Campbell (whom I met a few times and was a true gentleman) on my transistor radio. As such I’ve lived through a lot of frustrating times. But when Covey comes in and consistently throws ball 1 and ball 2, I feel my head will explode and I need to remove myself from the room!

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    1. I know…was only jokin with you.
       Actually I feel the same way and have done the same….after the Connie Mack Stadium days of watching them lose , thru the Vet and now CBP, especially from 2012 for almost another decade….I served my punishment.

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29. Emaarion Boyd is quietly having a really good age 19 season. Here’s a cool stat, he has more stolen bases than strikeouts. He has a BB% over 10 and a K% under 15%. That’s awesome. zero power but that will come. He hits lefties well. Really fun prospect. Clearwater box score is my favorite one to check. Him and Crawford make a great top of the order duo.

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30. Those who wanted David Roberston….he went to the Marlins last night.

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31. Coming into the season I believed this kid was our best position prospect. Maybe it would have been more accurate to say he is our best hitting prospect. He was hampered by injuries to start the season but is coming on now.

    https://www.mlb.com/video/hao-yu-lee-s-four-hit-game

    In the last month he’s batting 313/375/825 OPS and he’s only 20 at LKW

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    1. DMAR….unfortunantely , there are probably only two viable positions for him….2B or 3B….maybe 1B.
       And the way he is progressing, at some point in 2025, be it April or August, could be the time for him to make his move to the majors.
       Where does he go?

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       1. 1B I would say is out of the question he’s too short. You could always move Trea to LF, Stott to SS and Lee to Second. Or Bohm to 1B and Lee to 3B.

          Or he may never play a game in the MLB for us but he is good enough to net you something of value.

          Klentak didn’t view Mead as much of anything (heck I don’t remember us viewing Mead as a top prospect) however he did net us Sanchez who as it turns out is serviceable.

          Mead is still only 22 so I believe he will end up the much better big leaguer.

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          1. Actually….maybe the Phillies ought to ask Lee if he be willing to try catching this FIL.
             He has the physique for a catcher…..and his hit tool would play really high ceiling for the position.

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       2. Lee is still only at JS, a lot can still happen. I think the Phillies will have him go station to station because there’s no need to promote him fast. And if he ends up at Lehigh and he’s still ripping it, the Phillies will find a spot for him.

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32. Did anyone watch the Cubs Cardinals game last night? I did and Miles Mikolas might be the dumbest pitcher in league. That or he has no desire to pitch for them any more and that was the easiest way to get out of the heat.

    The Cardinals have clearly dusted off their golf clubs. Marmol lost that team months ago. Actually Marmol lost that team when he was named manager.

    When the FO hands the manager the LU card every night the players have no respect for them.

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    1. I don’t have a problem with that. It’s not like the Cardinals are going anywhere. Happ knocked Contreras out of the game. I would have drilled him. And Happ took it, put his head down, and walked to 1B without incident.

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    2. It seemed like a typical send a message that we are unhappy your backswing hit our catcher. I think Marmol, Mikolas and the announcers all thought it would end up with a warning. It isn’t even like he beamed him. It was a pretty soft toss. Even Happ seemed like he understood what was going on and made little attempt to actually get out of the way because they would just keep throwing at him.

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33. I have no doubt that DD does something. I don’t want to give up too much. I have always been a believer that you need to make a move at the deadline if you are a serious Playoff contender. It not just generates entusiasm and excitement among the fanbase, but I believe for the team as well. This season, what we need most, and what will make all the difference, is for the 4 of Schwarber, turner, Castellanos and JTR to get hot. If they were playing to their career averages, just average for them, we would have at least 6 more Ws, and our spot in the Playoffs would be secure. Unfortunately, all are under, and except for a hot start by Castellanos, and a few June HRs for Schwarber, they have not done much. I leave Harper off this list because of the injury, and because I have the most faith in him. We will still make a move, and even having said all that, I would love Bellinger, but think what ends up happening is a much lesser move.

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    1. I’m not sure the Cubs throw in the towel on their season thus you better be prepared to pay up big time for Bellinger and/or Stroman.

       The only opinion that matters is in the club house. So by not doing anything you are giving those guys a vote of confidence that we have all we need right here now go perform.

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       1. But, DMAR, Harper has said he expects DD to add at the deadline. Giving up prospects, IMO, is a vote of confidence to the guys. He isn’t bringing anyone in to replace any of the guys we are counting on. Sorry to disagree, but not doing anything, I think, sends the opposite message.

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          1. Ok I forgot Harper is the GM. Whatever Bryce wants he gets…

             Not for nothing and I love him but maybe we should stop listening to BH on roster construction.

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             1. That’s a whole different argument. And, you may be correct. But, my point is still that doing something at the deadline is a boost to the team, and doing nothing has the opposite effect. Just my opinion and respect that yours is different.

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             2. Not sure the Cubs should make any movers as sellers…..they have raked against bottom teams and their schedule has almost two dozen games vs bottom teams in August and Sept…..why throw in the towel now!

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34. I think there is no doubt DD will do something. But I think it is to add around the edges – nothing too dramatic. I also believe he is waiting till the last minute to spring a deal or deals. Team still needs a RH OF hitter and help in the bullpen (rather than another starter – because they will be cheaper). I also don’t expect him to give up a player(s) with multiple year control for a rental.

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35. I have faith that Pache is that RHH OF! I mean small sample but he’s got an OPS+ of 158 with us. Perhaps if you thought his injury is going to linger on for a while longer. He’s 24 and under control through 2028.

    I hear a lot go get this guy and KLong will fix him. You either believe that or you don’t with Christian.

    Marsh IMO and I never thought I would say this has earned the right to play everyday. Maybe not in CF but that kid has moxie I want him on the field.

    And then there is this Wilson guy in AAA with 25 dingers. Killed it in Spring Training and just continued on with the season of his career. How do you not give a guy like that a try.

    He’s played most of his innings with us at SS but he has 61 in LF and 9 in RF with no errors. I think he could handle LF no worse than Kyle. Easy decision to drop Harrison and replace him with Weston for a while. At least until Pache comes back.

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36. Great players have a degree of toughness that borders on ruthlessness and it drives them. You could see it in Rose, Carleton, Schmidt, and Utley. Harper has the same quality. He was far from satisfied with just winning the NL or even getting the MVP for the series. Harper wanted it all and demands it of himself. The only other Phillies who could have those same steely qualities is Stott. Turner, talented as he may be, lacks that toughness and beats up on himself instead of driving himself. He is paid to be a a great player and a tough player who pushes himself beyond the age of 30. Have the Phillies miscalculated? So far it looks that way.

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    1. I disagree. I believe he is just pressing versus buckling under the pressure to be the man. I say that because of his pitch selection. He is swinging at back pitches vs having at bats like Stott. He was arguably the best player on team USA for the majority of the tourney, that was high stakes. He has a clutch factor to him but he’s definitely pressing. I see him having a decent 2nd half, with one of the 3 months being a big month. Also, he is a career .300 hitter, you don’t just drop to where he is at without pressing. That’s my take, I have a lot of faith in him, that he’ll turn it on, figure it out in time for the playoffs. The rest I don’t really care about, this team is built for the playoffs. Get it, they’ll make a run because of it… especially if they trade for another strong bullpen arm

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       1. Tac3, I hope you’re right.

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    2. At the plate IMO Turner can turn it around……not so sure about in the field.
       No one is ever going to confuse him with Ozzie Smith or Omar Vizquel right now…..and as they aged they also loss something.

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       1. I think sone the defense is spillover from the frustration. He’s not a gg caliber shortstop but he typically makes the routine plays.

          He’s booting easy stuff this year.

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          1. His last three years….’21, ’22 and now ’23, he has been poor DRS as a shortstop. His positive 3DRS was as a 2B in LA with Seager at shortstop in 2021 after the trade from the Nats. I am sure the Phuilies realize, In the long run he probably slides over to 2B…..that may be his best defensive outcome.
             Whether it is next season or in 2/3 years from now.

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37. These are the little things that annoy me about Thomson. Why wouldn’t you pinch hit Rojas for Cave to lead off the 7th against a lefty pitcher.

    Those are no brainer types of moves.

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    1. Since he did it recently, I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt on this one by saying he might want Rojas for a defensive replacement of Castellanos in the next couple of innings.

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38. So much for the Noah Song saga. It was a risk worth taking, but we couldn’t keep him on the roster. Now, we need to upgrade Dylan Covey.

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    1. It was an easy decision. He’s just not ready to compete at the ML level right now.

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39. I re-read DD’s comments from this time last year talking about asking other teams for a utility guy or back of the BP guy, and the other teams wanting your top prospects. “On August 1, that all changes.”, he said. So I don’t expect anything until Tuesday. I think it will be a BP arm and a utility type player.

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40. MLB batting average for hitters swinging outside the zone (o-zone) is .151
    Luis Arraez’s o-zone BA is .330
    https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/a/arraelu01.shtml
    Phillies would be wise to just walk him when they face him.

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41. See your guys/gals thoughts on Reynolds – would you still trade for him, willing to trade the same number of top prospects for him?

    At 1st glands, Doesn’t look like he’s doing much better then Turner

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    1. What a difference a year makes. Last season, the Phillies traded for Marsh, Pache was in Oakland, and Rojas was struggling. The Phillies were searching for a viable CF and Reynolds was an obvious option.

       Now the Phillies have OF depth, Reynolds got his money but he’s playing like a league average starter.

       So pass on Reynolds.

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42. Phillies have no chance tonight, Cy Young pitching against them and Babe Ruth just homered.

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    1. Not sure why but the Phillies always seem to struggle at PNC Park.

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       1. Because the Phillies have an annoying habit of playing down to their competition and the Pirates have been bad since the LAST time Cutch played for them.

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43. How much are we supposed to pay Nola? Every time he pitches I think he should get less and less. Tonight he can’t throw the curve ball but keeps trying to. And I love Harper but that play was in front of him and he can’t keep getting thrown out!

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    1. That was a brutal start by Nola. The Pirates started teeing off on the knuckle curve and Nola totally lost his confidence.

       It didn’t help that Castellanos butchered a catchable ball, Harper booted a groundout, and Marsh was way too aggressive.

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44. You gotta give Thomson credit for his trust. He sees his guys struggling and still just leaves them out there. Consequences be damned.

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    1. I love that he finally took Turner out of the 2 hole and replaced him with the one other RH hitter that is also totally lost at the plate right now.

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45. Having Rojas hit for Cave was the right move, but Rojas looked way overmatched by a veteran pitcher. When is Pache coming back?

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    1. I watch Rojas against curve balls , that is his weakness, imo, Pache never hit if i am correct, why are people thinking he will now? I hope they dont extend Nola, i have never been a fan, especially when people say he is a ace, far from that, a 500 pitcher, With low velo and doesn’t command strike zone,

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       1. The thought process with Pache is that he’s a former top prospect that’s still only 24 and that hit well as a 20 year old in AA. So they’re thinking he can take a step forward like Marsh did. Plus, with how good he is defensively, he doesn’t actually need to hit all that much to be valuable.

          That said, I don’t think anyone expects him to keep even remotely the same pace he’s been at (when healthy). But a .260 hitter with a little pop and good speed is definitely possible.

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46. How about Castellanos? Fouled off 2 pitches he should have been on. My Wife says “ this next pitch won’t be close and he will swing”! It was 20 feet outside! It was impossible to hit that far off the plate! And Rojas is a legit elite CF and needs to play.

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47. I’d love to see Thomson give Castellanos an “Allstar break” and play an outfield of Marsh, Cave and Rojas for 4 or 5 games in a row. Stott and Marsh are becoming my favorite players.

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48. Castellanos neeeds to sit out a game or two as former Phillies pitcher and post-game analyst suggested….try to clear his head.
    In the old days, that terminolgy translated to being ‘benched’

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    1. Completely agree and it shouldn’t be considered a slight to any of the players. It’s a long season and you should take advantage when players are hot. Rojas should be starting in center and Marsh in left or right field most games until Rojas shows he may need some time.

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49. Don’t think that is happening, Romus. Thomson thinks Castellanos will get better pitches hitting 2d. Why? He gets himself out. Why throw strikes if he just swings at the low and away breaking pitch? Throw it off the plate them keep throwing it further off the plate. That pitch last night he was swinging before he saw the pitch. It’s impossible to not see that it started way off the plate. He hasn’t been giving himself a chance to hit for a month. I think he is barely above .100 in the last 20 or so games.

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50. Nola’s start yesterday showed me something, and it was all negative. He’s costing himself some serious money.

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51. Why does Bryson Stott sit against lefties??! He has great splits and should be in the lineup everyday. I just don’t get the lineup construction. Turner is struggling so let’s replace him with someone who is in a horrendous slump in the 2 spot..Rojas is the best CF, by far, and should be playing more than 50% of the time regardless of pitching matchup. The problem is never sitting the veterans who are underperforming. Why does Schwarber and Castellanos have to play every game? Just blatant stubbornness my management…

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    1. And Stubs in against a lefty. Why not JT today and Stubbs last night against a righty?
       Also Harrison for Stott is like pitching Wayne Twitchell for Steve Carlton.

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       1. Thomson hasn’t said that Stubbs is Sanchez’s personal catcher, but he’s caught him the last few times. And you can’t really argue with the results, Sanchez is arguably the Phillies’ most consistent starter the last 5 starts.

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    2. Stott doesn’t sit against lefties. Just a day off for him. He’s played in 98 out of 104 games.

       But yes, the lineup construction has been suspect all year long.

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52. No way do I trade McGarry unless a star is coming back. They made a mistake with Brown last year. Painter isn’t coming back until 2025 and he may need a year to get acclimated. If they don’t re-sign Nola they need somebody on the mound. This team needs starting pitching for the future. Maybe even this year. Not relievers, not utility guys, not role players, not platoon guys.

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    1. Been Brown is 6-6 5.10 ERA with a 1.4 WHIP in AAA. 9 homers in 60 innings. Averaging 4 1/3 innings per start. Just going by stats, not sure what the actual looks like.

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       1. Denny…he probaly will adjust…his stuff is too good, not for that to happen.
          That trade, in the long run, could haunt the Phillies for awhile.
          Cubs knew what they wanted in Brown.
          https://www.marqueesportsnetwork.com/cubs-prospect-ben-browns-performances-dont-capture-full-story-of-successful-start-to-year/

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          1. Unfortunately you are probably correct. Such a bad trade.

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          2. Still think that Brown ends up as a relief pitcher which limits his value. He’s also already on the 40-man roster and was optioned so the clock has started ticking on his options as well.

             People like to forget that the Phillies probably don’t make the WS without the trade for Robertson and his performance early from the trade. He faded at the end but he bridged a gap they had in the pen.

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             1. I see your point with Robertson and his contributions last year.
                IMO, Dombrowski should have bargained harder for the rental David Robertson and offered up lower tier prospects

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                1. I would have preferred lesser prospects had been traded too but I also don’t know if that deal happens without Brown being the player that ended up being traded. Would the Cubs have just gone elsewhere for the deal?

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53. There will be some good starters —some back end guys however—out there this off-season in free agency.
    Some have opt-out clauses in their current contract, others for sure will be QO (there goes another 2nd round pick!). Phillies will get one…they always do it seems.
    An abbreiviated list who may help(age)….Mike Clevinger (33) …Alex Cobb (36) …..
    Zach Davies (31)….Jack Flaherty (28)…..Lucas Giolito (29)….Sonny Gray (34)
    Michael Lorenzen (32)……Seth Lugo (34)…..Lance Lynn (37) ….Kenta Maeda (35)….Tyler Mahle (29)….Sean Manaea (32) …German Marquez (29) ..Jordan Montgomery (31)…Shohei Ohtani (29)…Martin Perez (33)…..Eduardo Rodriguez (31) ..Blake Snell (31)….Julio Urias (27)

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54. This makes no sense, the Phillies won’t have a day off for a while, Sánchez is cruising (but he has hit a few hitters) and Thomson takes him out because he’s going to go through the lineup a 3rd time. Seriously? We’re talking about the Pirates, not the Dodgers or Braves. And Seranthony gives up the ghost. This is infuriating to watch.

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    1. Exactly.
       I wanted to cut the grass and if they won I would watch the highlights.
       But unluckily my grandson called and wanted to come over and watch the game together, love being with him but stuck watching this game.

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    2. Sanchez absolutely was not cruising. You glossed over the fact he’s hit batters like it’s nothing. He hit THREE batters in 5 innings. One of those hit batters was just the previous innings. Plus he had two other walks. AND a wild pitch.

       He did not have control and he was a ticking time bomb. You can take exception with who he brought in, but taking Sanchez out was the right call. It’s miraculous they couldn’t score off him, let alone manage a hit.

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       1. I disagree that he was a ticking time bomb. I still would have given him another inning.

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          1. He literally put a man on 2nd with no outs in the 4th inning. Note that he didn’t give up a double, which is not great but happens. He walked the batter and then immediately threw a wild pitch.

             If a reliever did that, you’d be racing to get him out of the game. It’s genuinely amazing that they didn’t score with that gifted to them. And then he hit a batter the next inning, so it’s not like it was a blip and then he found his rhythm. He literally handed them a base runner for each inning pitched. I don’t know how you describe that as anything other than a disaster waiting to happen.

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          2. Didn’t agree with taking Sanchez out of the game but apparently he was not feeling well (stomach issue) so I suspect that was the main reason for making the decision.

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    3. One day its defense, another no bats, another the manager, just a lost team and lost yr, So inconsistent, They blew it with this guy Thompson, he wont last another yr, if he keeps up his bad moves,

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55. It frightens me anymore when Harper is on the base paths….same feeling I use to have when Cesar H. was out there in his early days as a Phillie.

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    1. Yeah, his pressing the envelope looks great when it works, but lately his antics are annoying. His golden Sombrero with 1 oak leaf cluster, an error and his base running gaffe yesterday must have been his worst game ever played. Today’s game poorly played by the team and again the money players performance very disappointing. Hope we don’t get mopped up in Miami.

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56. Well I guess we need bullpen help, again. You can’t use Kimbrel every game ?

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    1. You got that right, RU. Jordan Hicks was #1 on my Phillies To Do List. Dombrowski should have beaten the Blue Jays’ offer.

       Ser-Ant’ny ERA over his last 5 appearances: 16.88
       Alvarado’s spent 2 stints on the IL. He ‘may’ be back in a couple weeks.
       And Kimbrel is losing steam.
       Vasquez & Straham are also trending 🔽

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       1. And Rob Thomson continues to be just awful. The BP decisions have been very questionable. He caters waaay too much to the veterans. This season would have died months ago if not for Phillies Day Care.

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       2. Hinkie – I don’t know if the Phillies could have matched that offer. If the Cards wanted controllable pitching then it would have been 1 of McGarry/Abel + another prospect.

          The way this team has been playing I don’t know if it would be worth it
          We hope this offense just clicks any day now but it might not.

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57. It’s too bad the Phillies can’t acquire the following on the trade market: baseball IQ, baserunning skills, infielders who know how to yell ‘I got it!’, opposing pitchers who hit players with RISP so we can get runs.

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58. Thoughts?

    Crawford + Lee + Falter
    For
    Bednar + McCutchen

    Too much?

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    1. I wouldn’t give up Crawford for Bednar. Yes, too much imo.

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59. I don’t understand the Rob Thompson bashing. And I really don’t understand the KLong bashing.
    1. They made the World Series last year. Last year. Far surpassing our expectations.
    2. They are currently 0.5 games out of the playoffs.
    3. Harper and Turner are having the worst years of their careers. Turner’s OPS is sub .700 and he has 13 errors. How is that RT’s or KL’s fault? How is it KL’s fault that Harper forgot how to hit homers?
    4. According to Fangraphs, the Phillies Pitching staff leads the majors in WAR. Their bullpen is 5th in WAR. So how is that mismanagement by RT?
    5. Schwarber has the 2nd lowest BABIP in MLB. 60+ points lower than his career babip. How is that KL’s fault?
    6. Meanwhile, we are just going to ignore the tremendous progress that Marsh, Stott and Pache are having? KL doesn’t get credit for fixing young players who had struggled but gets blamed for veteran players performing well below career numbers? I don’t think so.
    7. How about the rebound for Castellanos? KL gets no credit for helping him? Just blame for Harper and Turner?
    8. We lost a very productive 1B in spring training due to injury and have had below replacement level options. How is that KL’s or RT’s fault?

    I think that some of you guys are over reacting to small sample of regular season games. Baseball season is a marathon. All that matters is if we get into the playoffs and then get hot. We are currently in position for that. Relax. A lot of baseball left to play. The veteran players are likely to turn it around. Harper and Turner can get hot at any point and when they do, the Phillies will go on a run. If Turner and Harper don’t turn it around we won’t go anywhere. And it will be the player’s fault. Not the coach’s. I am sure that Bryce and Trea would say the same thing.

    I feel like we are in a good spot. Have not played our best baseball yet. And DD will do something today to improve the team. I am very confident in this club.

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    1. I get substitute teacher vibes from Thomson. His success last season stems from one thing…he was not Girardi. We’re now seeing why he was passed over for managerial jobs for two decades. He has no feel for lineups, substitutions, and bullpen management. I’ve read people say that he’s stubborn but I think he’s just not very bright. Upper management was out in an impossible situation last year when the team made their improbable run. They had to offer him the job. My guess is that they make changes this offseason if the team continues to play inconsistent baseball and display poor fundamentals.

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       1. I really don’t understand this take. Nothing you said makes sense to me.

          “His success last season stems from one thing…he was not Girardi.” << there is no evidence that this is true or that this works for other teams.

          "He has no feel for lineups, substitutions, and bullpen management." << He managed the team to game 6 of the World Series, far surpassing all expectations. The locker room culture was the envy of every team. We are currently 0.5 out of a playoff spot while our two mega stars are having the worst seasons of their careers and we lost our starting 1B. Our bullpen has the 5th highest WAR in baseball.

          "but I think he’s just not very bright." < candidly, the data/facts say that you are wrong. so maybe provide evidence.

          "They had to offer him the job." << no they didn't. DD doesn't do things because he "has to". if DD wanted him out, he would have hired another manager.

          "if the team continues to play inconsistent baseball and display poor fundamentals." << again, the team is a strong playoff contender. this statement is not grounded in facts.

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          1. v1 … Once upon a time, we agreed on Gabe Kapler. However, I couldn’t see the Rob Thomson issue more differently. One of the reasons he succeeded last season was because he (unlike Girardi) showed faith in the Phillies Day Care. This season, he has become an arm of the club’s veterans. Schwarber/Turner/Harper/Castellanos/Realmuto are having pretty miserable campaigns, yet they (for the most part) own the first 5 spots in the lineup.
             He let Johan Rojas sit the bench for over a week recently. Didn’t even use him to pinch run or for D late in contests. Does that make any sense for either the young player or the team?
             The in-game decisions have not been smart either. I know all about the “third time thru the order” argument, but what about having a feel for the game yesterday? Cristopher Sanchez (another young player) had held the Pirates in check (no hits) thru 5 innings and 73 pitches. He replaced him with a guy sporting a 16.88 ERA over his last 5 trips to the mound.
             The previous game, Thomson watched Aaron Nola give up 9 H & 3 BB, and saw 4-1 lead turn into a 7-4 deficit. Thomson was asleep at the wheel in the 5th inning. He had nobody up in the BP as Nola was melting down (again).

             The truth of the matter is (as catch pointed out recently) … this team is only going to go as far as their big money veterans take them, but that doesn’t mean the young players can’t take more prominent roles.

             BTW … this team has all kinds of problems stringing together multiple hits. Aside from Schwarber, the team is also lacking long ball threats this year. How about more stolen bases?

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             1. how could he bat 5 veterans making $20+ mil per year in the first 5 spots?

                you/Catch gave the answer:

                “this team is only going to go as far as their big money veterans take them”

                it is a marathon, not a sprint. those 5 are the core of this team. keep them in their spot until they produce.

                Stott has hit more at the 1 hole than any other spot in the lineup, but there is a lot of lefty hitters that creates problems

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                1. Gotta keep RT. I get it, he’s had a few blunders, but I think we are hyper focusing due to the tight WC race.

                   Here’s why I say you are overrating – and I get it is not a one off of questionable calls –

                   RT is a players manager, helps keep the guys loose

                   He really got the Phillies to the WS last year. How he unleashed the bullpen, put moneyball in its place. What a great strategy, something Kapler & Giradi did not do.. heck even Manuel, Franconia, & Fergosi didn’t do it.

                   Top stars are playing like crap, it’s going make a lot look bad. The Phillies are good at the helm, and in the FO.

                   Remember – success is usually not linear, because of that I would have like them to have an Astros style bullpen, just an embarrassment of riches coming out of the pen. Go to battle with the 4, and the lineup gets some
                   Clutch hits … let it ride!

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60. We need the Big 5, and yes, I am now looking for much more from Bryce, to be average. Not have career years, just average. And, I have knocked the Sosa, Stubbs, Harrison lineup, but in fact it is our 5 gig $ guys who are hurting us. And I ama Harper fan, and like him to be aggressive. But yesyerday was not aggressive, it was dumb. Either tag and go on the fly ball or stay at 3rd. The whole stay put until they threw th 2B was dumb. The throw from 2d is a lot shorter than from RF. He should have been tagged up and ready. What he did was the worse choice of the 3 choices. And, he is on a mistake on the basepaths streak lately. Yesterday was not a one off.

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    1. And also Bohm……he also was reckless coming off the bag at second.

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61. Lovely to read from u guys again.

    Do you think that the pitch clock is bothering our hitters, it certainly bothers Harper and it shows, he was used to taking his time.

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    1. glan…….hitters are allowed one time out…most take it after two strikes….he does it also. Some hittrs want to swing early, some will work the count more than others, like Stott for the most part….Harper tends to swing early.
       I guess it bothers him……the young players are use to it from the minor leagues that started it a few years ago, the vets probably need to have more of an adjustment.

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    2. I think it’s bothering the pitchers more, Nola and Dominguez in particular.

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62. I hate the three batter rule

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63. Golden sombrero from Sosa yesterday. His defense is average at best. I realize that he’s a shortstop by trade. It would not hurt this club if both he and Harrison were replaced.

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64. I would replace Harrison with Kingery. SK might not hit much better but at least he can play defense and adds some speed on the bases. Harrison is just not that good anymore.

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65. Harrison was like the Familia signing, hated it as soon as it happened(I realize its $4 million less than Familia) but Harrison was washed up 2 years ago. What purpose does he serve?

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    1. There have been some Dave D. acquisitions, more than others, that have me scratching my head….Harrison’s signing is one of them.

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66. In case anyone is still against the MLB rule changes…

    From MLB: Attendance is up 9.2% from this time last year, which would represent greatest year-to-year gain in average attendance since the last expansion (1998).

    Last week's average attendance of 34,432 was the best weekly average of any week since 2012.

    — Bill Shaikin (@BillShaikin) July 31, 2023

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    1. But in order to achieve that attendance teams have introduced non-baseball-watching activities at the stadiums.

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       1. In an age where every concert is $300 a $40 baseball ticket and a chance to be seen on the jumbo-tron ain’t too bad regardless sof what’s going on in the field.

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       2. Great great point

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       3. You are in the minority on those views

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          1. Agreed. I was clamoring for all or most of these changes for several years. Baseball had become tedious, extraordinarily long and nearly unwatchable – even for diehards like me. The 2 hour and 30-40 minute game is an immeasurably better product and just as basketball players adjusted to the 24 second clock, pitchers and hitters adjusted to the time clock.

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             1. Yeah, you almost never see a pitch clock violation anymore. Players adjust.

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67. The Angels drafted Nolan Schanuel at #11 and they bumped him up to AA already? He’s played a total of 7 minor league games.

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    1. I guess they feel they can force feed him, being a college guy.
       Have to assume he stays there for the remainder of this season, thru hell or high water, and probably starts there again at AA level next season.

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68. Jim again; so happy on the cancer challenge.

    As for Song; I told the group this was DD hubris and I didn’t understand it especially in light that it crowded out more deserving candidates for the 40-man. DD has been a great GM but this one was classic screw-up..

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69. DD is sure waiting until the last second. Canha to the Brewers. Any guesses on who we get? I think an OF and a BP arm, but no clue as to which ones.

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70. The Brewers sent their #30 prospect for Canha. That’s for nothing. We couldn’t have beaten that offer? We didn’t want Canha? The Mets won’t trade with us? He could have helped.

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    1. Honestly I just want Vierling back.

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71. 3 innings, 5 BBs, 1 hit, 6 LOB. The inability to hit with RISP is comical. Maybe DD does nothing tomorrow because this team isn’t good enough? We get 2d and 3rd with 1 out, and I wanted to have JTR bunt, that’s how depressing this is.

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72. I thought it would be good to start a pool when Schwarber finally goes over the Mendoza line. The date I’ve chosen is opening day 2024. I feel it gives him the most advantageous opportunity to do so. Feel free to give your projected dates.

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    1. My bet is when he joins the softball beer league post MLB retirement.

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73. Amazing how a productive 2-hole hitter helps the offense.

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74. Congratulations to Rob Thomson, who tonite discovered the baseball world will not end if the top 5 spots in the lineup are not filled by anyone other than the team’s highest paid players.

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    1. Hinkie I though i was only one, who thinks Thompson is lost, some of the worst moves this year, I am a big horse nut, Horses bring a ton of money at the sales in Kentucky, two yr old sell for Millions in some cases, Its based on blood lines, That being said, i hate to see Crawford moved in any trade, he is doing great and has strong blood lines, not a sure thing, but a nice prospect to have,

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75. Well roster construction certainly contributed heavily to the win tonight, maybe the butt chewing last night also contributed. It was still the Daycare that did the damage and you actually should score runs when the opposition gives you 10 walks. Notwithstanding, Walker did a really good job and the bullpen too.

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76. Tommy Phan okay. Teoscar please no.

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    1. Agree on Teoscar. They don’t need more swing/miss in the line-up.

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77. Phillies mentioned on Teosscar H. or Ty France from the Mariners in a trade today.
    Teoscar has pop….BUT 143 Ks leads MLB , even best Schwarber’s 140 Ks.
    And a rental at that…….my offering would be one or two of Muzziotti, Kingery or Jhailyn…..no one else.

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78. Agree. I’m visiting my son in Seattle and watched Ms play last night. He’s not an upgrade.

    And the Ms park is fantastic. Better overall experience than CBP and way way way better food.

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    1. Wait a minute…better food!
       Better cheesesteaks?

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    2. I live in Portland and get up to Seattle for a game once every year or so. Always when the Phillies play (which unfortunately is rare). Have to respectfully disagree about your food and park opinion. It is a very nice ballpark with some decent food offerings, but it does not come close to what the Bank offers (esp food-wise) in my opinion. Maybe its a product of growing up in Philadelphia and attending games on the east coast, but you also definitely do not get good “baseball vibes” there as well. Always seem to be surrounded by tech people that are disinterested in the actual game. Enjoy your time in Seattle – the PNW is amazing this time of year.

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79. Well we will find out later today who the team adds. Wishing they could somehow pry Helsey from Cards along with one of their many outfielders (Carlson ?) – likely for a package of McGarry and 2 other young pitchers. Team desperately needs more high leverage bullpen arm – the miracle of Kimbrel is going to end as they are burning him out. Pham is somewhat of a team problem child – hope they miss him.

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80. Dylan Carlson or bust IMO.
    Carlson is perfect for the Phillies:

    * switch hitter, but excells from right side (.310/.380/.476 career slasher as a RHH)
    * plays abv avg defense in all 3 OF spots (strong arm too)
    * just 24 YO & under team control for 3.5 years
    * similar profile as Marsh & Pache (former top 50 MiLB prospect mishandled by former organization)

    I would 100% include Griff McGarry in a deal for Carlson. I’ve liked McGarry since UVA, but the reliever risk is real. Griff is running a 5.5 BB/9 in AA and 5.4/9 in MiLB. The list of MLB SPs with BB rates that high is next to none.

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    1. Hinkie…Pache was as high as 12….MLB.com in the spring of 2021…and Marsh at 53 in the sprig of 2021 with MLB.com and BA had him at 38.

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    2. Carlson should not cost you McGarry and I’d be really slow to move Griff. While McGarry has a bunch of risk for sure, the upside is a dominant starter – his stuff is truly elite. I would start the trade with Kerkering and then try to add either Pache or Rojas – long term, you don’t need both of those guys, especially with Marsh in the outfield. You might need to throw in a lottery ticket from A ball.

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       1. Orion > Griff in the long term.

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    3. If you are getting a young OF, why not send Rojas back in the package?

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       1. That said, I have long thought that McGarry is very overrated by people on this board. If you can’t throw strikes to minor leaguers, then you are really going to struggle in the majors. He has great stuff, but it really is a big open question of whether he can throw enough strikes at the MLB level.

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          1. Rojas and Pache are redundant, but the Cardinals are seeking pitching. They already have a surplus of OFers. That’s why they’re dealing from them.

             BTW … I love Rojas. I’ve had him rated higher than McGarry for a while. Wouldnt be surprised if DD used him in a deal for a SP w/some team control this winter.

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             1. Pache 24 controllable through 2027 but no options. Rojas no exact contract status that I could find but I imagine he is controllable for the next 6-7 years with a handful of options.

                Therefore IMO Rojas is more valuable today. I would hold onto him.

                I would hold them both actually. Carlson doesn’t (again just MO) bring anything to the table that either of the aforementioned don’t he just ends up costing you prospects and the state of this franchise dictates you hold all of them and keep adding.

                These high priced veterans are either going to get the ring on their own or whoever is running this thing at the time is going to have to start selling off.

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          2. That’s true – but he has had some really great starts this year and seems to be progressing. His upside-downside delta is about as great as anyone’s in the farm system.

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81. By the way, now that we’ve seen the entire year play out, how much do we miss Rhys Hoskins? In saying that, I am not overvaluing Hoskins, but the absence of a true righty power hitting threat is significant and undeniable. It’s hard scoring runs every time by piecing together several walks and hits. The sad thing is that there’s no ready replacement for him in the system.

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    1. catch, I was always a Hoskins fan, and was never on the “let him go” side and “use his $ elsewhere.” Fully understand his flaws, but believed he was more valuable to us than trading and replacing him. Having said that, there is still no excuse for the poor seasons for JTR and Treat Turner, and the collapse of Castellanos since the All Star Break. ALso power hitting, right handed hitters, who have each come up way short.

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       1. There is an excuse for JT, it’s called catchers don’t age well. When JT signed that 5 year deal, I was expecting 2 good years, 2 average years, and 1 bad year. JT already gave his 2 good years, and this year will probably be slightly above average which is what I had expected. I’m just hoping he doesn’t collapse his final 2 years.

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82. Romus – And Teoscar has 25 walks to go along with his 143 Ks. He’s not a very good defensive outfielder to boot. At least Schwarber has a good number of BBs. I’d easily take Duval if he’s healthy.

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    1. Right.
       Duvall makes a lot of sense.
       In Teoscar, you are hoping to catch a genie in the bottle for two months.
       The team as it stands now has too much swing and miss…24.2% …7th i all MLB.

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83. What about a trade for Lane Thomas and a reliever from Washington?

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84. Good question, Michael Jack! I really don’t want Teoscar. The last thing we need is the guy with more Ks than Schwarber. ciada is correct about Duval’s health being an unknown, but we were scouting him over the weekend. I had heard Thomas’ name a week ago but nothing latley. Maybe that is where the deal is going to be. DD plays his cards very close to the vest.

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    1. Of what is left Duval brings the most upside to our current mess that said dealing with Bloom and a Red Sox team that is still in it for a playoff spot is scary.

       Again I fear giving up anything solid for a rental for a team that is bloated with salary and 11 back from their division.

       And if you were watching last night Bichette may have seriously injured his right knee. If he is out for any length of time they can kiss their season good bye!

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85. I found it interesting how similar Muncy and Schwarber are offensively yet Muncy only costs $13 million. Also the Dodgers would never think of having a sub 200 hitter bat LO.

    I appreciate JM’s willingness to spend but at some point you have to ask why the Braves are consistently eating our lunch at a much lower cost. Not to mention even after allowing guys like Freeman and Swanson walk.

    They simply have better baseball people running that franchise top to bottom. And that can be said for a number of franchises throughout the league.

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    1. One of the reasons Atlanta’s payroll doesn’t match its talent is because Alex Anthopolis took advantage of situation where Acuna Jr and Albies were represented by an agency who recommended those star players sign early for ridiculously team friendly salaries before those players switched to more powerful agencies as they got closer to free agency.

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       1. Agree that Atlanta benefited greatly from getting Albies/Acuna to sign low-ball offers early in their careers. Overall, their payroll is not much less than the Phillies. Phillies are #5 in MLB and the Braves are #7.

          Their biggest advantage is that their core is generally young and are signed for extended periods which allows them to spend $$$ to target specific needs.

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       2. Wow that is an uncharacteristically ugly statement Hinkie as it assumes both Albies and Acuna are dumb and didn’t know the advantages and disadvantages of doing their deals when they did in the spring of 2019.

          Both players would have also been advised by the MLBPA. I’m sure they had their reasons for inking their contracts.

          Or maybe your intention was to reflect a tinge of pain that Alex and his team is superior to anything we have/had in our FO for quite some time.

          Make no mistake I hate the Braves but I can acknowledge competence when I see it.

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          1. DMAR…there were risks absorbed on both sides.
             Case in point, Albies and Acuna could have went the Kingery route on their careers. And remember when the Braves were delusioned in believing future stardom with both Jason Heyward and Frenchy Francouer.
             So they rolled the dice with Acuna/Albies and came up snake eyes.

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86. To Anthopolis’ further credit – he was among the first to sign young players to longer term contracts – so he got them on the cheap. Moreover, now that he has absolutely stolen the careers of Acuna, Albies, and others (Riley, Olson, M Harris, and Strider) he can argue to other pending free agents – see Murphy C – they should sign with Braves because the team is composed of mostly all young players who have long term under the market contracts and they will be “here” for awhile. That team should cost upwards of $275 million but has a $203 salary structure ($245 with all benefits). The Braves have been incredibly lucky with their young position players’ health – not so much with their pitching as witness this year. But when you have this kind of offense anybody can pitch.

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87. I would give a Cliff Lee type package for Cease. What a home run that would be for our team. Nola as the #3 starter. amazing.

    Strange things certainly happen on Trade Deadline day, but the White Sox are talking to teams about Dylan Cease. One executive said Chicago was "looking for the moon" for Cease, who is controllable through 2025.

    — Mark Feinsand (@Feinsand) August 1, 2023

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    1. Cease certainly strikes out a ton of batters but he also gives up almost a hit per inning. I never saw him pitch but he doesn’t seem to be quite the level of Cliff Lee. But he would definitely step right into the rotation and, if we are fortunate enough to make the playoffs, he would be one of the starters for sure. I also like that he is not a free agent until 2026.

       I’d much rather see the team make a splash like this instead of just another “proven veteran” who is not really any better than some of the kids we already have.

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       1. Which one of the 3 is your preference:

          Cease for Abel, McGarry, and Crawford as an overpay

          Cease for Abel, McGarry, and Lee as a fair

          Or

          Cease for Painter straight up, maybe a lotto player

          I’d do either trade 2
          Cease looks like a other wheeler in the making
          Leaves a few position players for us and allows painter to recover or traded for more top pieces

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    2. I would not. That was 2009 we had just won the WS and had been dominating the division with a core of home grown talent and a moderate payroll. We also held a 7 game lead in the division.

       Then we had given up Triple-A right-hander Carlos Carrasco, Class A righty Jason Knapp, catcher Lou Marson and shortstop Jason Donald were sent to Cleveland. Ben Francisco was a throw in back to us.

       Not sure who in todays players constitutes a similar package for Cease. Cease is controllable through 2025 that is a plus

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    3. 100% would give up a solid package to get him. Would then let Nola walk in FA and acquire someone more in the Walker mold.

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       1. Is Dylan Cease a really good pitcher? Absolutely! Will he make a difference for a team 11 back from the division lead? No!

          This snake oil (“all you have to do is get in”) I’m not buying it. You sold me on it last season and it was fun I admit. I firmly believe that was a complete anomaly though.

          And our team last year was actually better than this seasons group…Sadly considering what we’ve added in FA.

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          1. Well, if you think that you might have a chance, Cease is the guy to acquire because, with him, this team can hang with anyone due to their pitching. The price might be too steep, but he’s the biggest difference-maker I am aware of. So what does it cost? Start with Abel and Crawford (and maybe Christopher Sanchez) and go from there. Is it worth it? The hell if I know.

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88. Astros land Verlander so our games with the Mets should be much easier

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    1. Mets’ Stevee Cohen not a half-measure guy,
       …..all in this past off-season, all out come July.
       Kind of reminds me of the Daniel Synder of the Washington football team.

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       1. Hedge fund guys realize their losses quick, cut bait and learn from their mistakes. They generally don’t double down on them. Smart business.

          He’s certainly not the first new owner that wanted to make a splash with his $$$. This is professional sports though. It doesn’t work that way.

          Deploy the life boats, get in one and watch that expensive vessel sink to the bottom. Live to build another one.

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       2. Honestly, while I thought this year’s signings by Cohen were, on the whole, pretty stupid, he’s doing now exactly what he should do. Cut his losses, get back prospects and get ready to retool for next year. It’s the right thing to do in this situation.

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          1. Must be nice to have other teams bail you out.

             Verlander is having a good enough year that I was expecting some decent prospect capital in return for his services, but he’s still a 40 year old pitcher making $43M. I find it absurd that the Astros are sending their two best prospects for that (one top 50 in MLB, the other towards the back end of top 100).

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             1. See my comment below. For teams desperate to win, these elite free agents have a lot of value, even when they are old and already overpaid.

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          2. The Verlander trade is an interesting lesson. The fact that the Mets paid for 2/3 of a year and were able to trade him and his salary for two top 5 prospects is pretty amazing and instructive. If you get a free agent, overpay for the best players – they are the most likely to have residual value if you ever want to change course. When you’re dealing an okay talent, like at a Schwarber or Castellanos level, it’s not as easy.

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             1. They didn’t trade his salary. They are eating somewhere between $35 million and $52.5 million based on his option vesting. That’s an expensive 2/3 of a season.

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       3. Gotta worry he might get othani – if you ever were going to be throw money at a player … it’s probably othani. 2 players for the price of 1 , it essentially adds 1 extra player to the roster for 27 players … of course if he gets injured then it takes 2 away as well, for 25. Worth the gamble Thougg

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          1. I would bet Cohen offers the most money – start at $60m and go up from there.

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             1. Definitely. He has to at this point after last year

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          2. If you believe Ken Rosenthal and Schertzer, the Mets do not plan to be big shoppers in 2024. They are looking at 2024 as a transitional year and will not be major players.

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89. Morosi: Lorenzen to Phillies close. Lee going to Tigers

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90. Looks like Hao Lee is gone. He’s blocked big time anyway.

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91. DD is going after a rental pitcher Michael Lorenzen and it looks like Hao Yu Lee is one of the players going to Detroit.

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92. Sounds like we’re getting Lorenzen for Lee and maybe something else.

    Dumb because Lorenzen is another rental. I’m fine with trading Lee but at least give me a player with some years of control for him.

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    1. DMAR…agree.
       Lee probably is blocked with the Phillies in a few years with Stott and Turner entrenched for the next 5 plus years…..but he is a decent prospect and wish the return was more of a controlled pitcher.

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       1. As much as we all like to think that Lee has a lot of value, he doesn’t. Yes, he’s only 20 at JS, but he’s not top 100, he’s not hitting like crazy and he’s limited to middle IF. And he’s only 5’9″, compared to Stott who’s 6’3″.

          If Lee can only get you a rental, imagine how little value Muzziotti and De La Cruz have.

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          1. Remember Luis Garcia, Scott Kingery, and a myriad of IFers that had potential and never made it or even sniffed the MLB. Why not?

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          2. I may be wrong, but I believe the thought then, with Curtis Mead, was similar to the Lee evaluation today.
             Lee, approx same age as Mead when traded, is ranked higher in the organization than Mead was in Nov 2019..
             Preston Mattingly has raved about Lee’s hit tool on more than one occassion.
             Granted he is limited in the field, but players that hit, can find a place to play.

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93. It was originally reported as Lee was among the players going to Setroit but just updated to be 1 for 1. Lorenzen helps. Lee wasn’t replacing Stott or Turner, and if Lorenzen helps down the stretch and in the Playoffs then it was a good move. Of course, that is assuming that DMAR is not correct, and it does matter “just to get in” and last season was not an anamoly. I agree that it was a lot of fun, and I want to experience that again, with a better finish, but I cannot say that DMAR is wrong. I am just hoping he is.

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94. Trading Lee was the right move because he’s blocked by Turner and Stott, and there were concerns that he couldn’t play 3B. Lorenzon is an upgrade over Sanchez but it won’t matter much if we can’t score.

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95. Ok then… Let’s hope Michael Lorenzen does well and likes it here enough to sign an extension. I hope he’s the WS MVP!!!

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    1. One thing he is not a soft tosser…sits normally @ 92-94T-95…throwing mostly 4Smr FB and sliders with the occasional change-up
       And yes…could sign an extension.

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    2. Michael Lorenzon will be a FA at age 32. His highest WAR season will likely be this season, hopefully close to 3 at season’s end. He’s looking to get paid. The Phillies gave Taijuan Walker 4/72 and he’s 30. Really early to speculate, but I think 3/45 is fair.

       Starting pitchers still under contract for 2024: Wheeler, Suarez, Walker, Sanchez. I think we can safely say that Falter is out of the mix.

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       1. I think 3/45M is a good number….one where he will accept it.
          I remember he said he was thrilled last year going to the Angels becasue he grew up in SoCal and family was all there…..I think now, at this point in his career, he just wants to get to the play-offs and win…since he has only tasted it one time and the Braves beat him three years ago.

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       2. You experts keep putting Falter away but he keeps proving you wrong. You forget 2022 6-2 3.68 era, you don’t make playoffs without him. 2023 DD puts him #3 SP . Always labels Backend SP but DD destroys young arms. Howard, Sixto, De Los Enyos, Medina

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          1. wasn’t Sixto gone before DD?

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          2. What? DD didn’t destroy ANY of those arms. And as nice as it was that Falter helped this team last year he was dreadful this year and is a soft tosser with limited upside. What on earth are you talking about?

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          3. Here’s hoping he has great success in Pittsburgh.

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          4. Of all the weak opinions presented as facts, this may be the weakest I’ve read here in a while. Did you even bother to check a single fact?

             Now, I am a big fan of Bailey Falter. He has been up to 94 since returning to Lehigh Valley. And, while I feel he was misused the past couple of years, I don’t think Dombrowski is to credit or blame for Falter’s successes or failures.

             Regarding the 4 pitchers that you claim Dombrowski ruined.

             Spencer Howard was drafted in 2017. He popped up on everyone’s radar when he struck out 40 in 28.1 innings at Williamsport. He was on an upward trajectory thru his 2019 assignment to Clearwater. He posted solid numbers at Reading, the AFL, and Lehigh Valley around a couple of so-so visits to the big club in 2020 and 2021. Dombrowski wasn’t hired until December 11, 2020. So, how did he destroy Howard’s arm?

             Sixto Sanchez was signed in March of 2015. He was traded to Miami for Realmuto in February of 2019, two years before Dombrowski was hired. So, how did he destroy Sanchez’arm?

             Enyel De Los Santos was signed in by Arizona in 2014. We acquired him in the Freddy Galvis deal on December 15, 2017. He was assigned to Lehigh Valley in March 2018. He was selected a couple of months later in July 2018 and pitched for the World Futures that All-Star break. He was recalled and optioned repeatedly over the next 25 months until he was DFAed in August 2020. He was selected again on May 4, 2021, and optioned and recalled until he DFA-ed again in September when he was claimed by Pittsburgh. He was last seen pitching against us for Cleveland this season. So, how did Dombrowski destroy his arm in the 9 months they overlapped in Philadelphia?

             Adonis Medina was signed in May of 2014. He progressed through the organization posting pretty decent seasons in 2017 and 2018 when he struck out 256 batters in 231 innings. He was briefly called up during the 2020 season from the Alternate Site. He yoyo-ed between Lehigh Valley and the big club in 2021. He was DFAed late on the day the commissioner locked out the players and remained in limbo until he was claimed off waivers in March of 2022 by the Pirates. He went on to make 14 appearances out of the bullpen for the Mets in 2022. So, how did Dombrowski destroy his arm in the 12 months they overlapped in Philadelphia?

             You’ve got to be better. The community here is too baseball savvy to slip a comment like yours past without being called out.

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             1. Fantastic response Jim. Great to have someone so knowledgeable leading this site.

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             2. Spencer Howard is now a Yankee.
                If he ever regains the magic….he could live up to the expectations of 4 years ago.

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             3. I don’t think we’ll be hearing from Harvey again LOL

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96. I like Lee, but I like winning right now more. I believe Lee will be a big league player, but he was expendable here with Stott in front of him and Aidan Miller behind him. It’s all about pitching in the postseason. It remains to be seen if Lorenzen will most help in the playoff rotation or the playoff BP. Either way … it upgrades the team for the rest of this season. Also gives the club an “up close and personal” look & relationship to maybe help Dombrowski sign Lorenzen this winter if they like what they see in the RHP.

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97. Reminds me of the 2010 Roy Oswalt trade. Offense declining, clearly need a bat, but instead trade for a solid starting pitcher. Would have loved to see Lee progress as a high OBP prospect at a premium position because it feels like we never have those types of prospects.

    Help me understand what the playoff rotation looks like now that we have 5 quality starters. Playoff Ranger takes over as the closer again?

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    1. Joe …….Michael Lorenzen is one of the better hitting pitchers….though he has not swung a bat in a few years in a game….but if all RHBs position players have been exhausted……send Lorenzen up there to pitch-hit..

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98. I think Ranger will be a starter. He was in the bullpen last year mostly because he was coming off injury and hadn’t been stretched out to start when the post season started.

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99. I’ve been a big fan of Lee and don’t like giving him up for a rental. But I also like Lorenzen.

    We may regret losing Lee but hopefully it’s with similar understanding as Ben Brown. In Lorenzen, I believe we’re adding a valuable, live arm for the stretch run and hopefully deep playoff run!

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100. As I said ealier, I loved the fun of the run last season, and I hope Lorenzen can help us get to the Playoffs again. I like Lee also. But, I also loved Scott Kingery. I really believed that he was our Dustin Pedroia. Clearly, I was wrong. In Lee’s case we have Stott and Turner for quite some time. The idea of a good hitter in the Minors sounds good, but I am trying to win now.

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101. Good move. Lee has no power, no range as a fielder and hasn’t exactly bee tearing it up at JS. Josh Harrison Dfa’s to make room fir Lorenzen

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102. Lorentzen can pinch hit and play the outfield in an emergency. And if Nola walks and Lorentzen pitches well, he may be a replacement for Nola. I think he’d take 2 years at 10 each year.

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103. With Harrison gone, I say put Weston Wilson on the 40 and bring him up to replace him.

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104. Why do we want Rodolfo Castro?

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105. Phillies trade Falter to pirates for Rodolfo Castro,

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     1. The Castro trade is a real head scratcher. I’m not the biggest Bailey Falter believer (lacks a put away pitch), but an avg innings eating BOR SP is more valuable than an avg utility guy. Castro owns a career .226/.299/.396 line and is a below avg defender at multi positions.

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        1. Dombrowski does have some stranger than life trades.
           I guess I miss the details.

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106. Just find that to be a real zero move. Castro may be less valuable than Harrison, and this clearly is a move to replace Harrison. Improving on him, I thought, was a low bar to clear, but this seems to have fallen short.

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107. So, Marlins trade for Josh Bell and trade Jean Segura, our old friend. Guardians waiving him. He will pass through waivers, and be eligible to sign for the league minimum. He’s getting $17M over this year and next from Florida. Wouldn’t he be a much better pick up than Rodolfo Castro? And, we didn’t get the OF we were looking for. We couldn’t have outbid the Brewers for Canha? They gave up their #30 prospect. He wouldn’t be a better help down the stretch than Castro?

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108. Dave Dombrowski says Phillies believe Johan Rojas has star potential, and despite teams asking about him, he wasn't someone they considered moving to acquire a veteran.

     — Tim Kelly (@TimKellySports) August 1, 2023

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     1. Meet your new CF for the playoff run. Moves Marsh to LF

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        1. Agree with Dombrowski. Both Rojas’ floor and ceiling are incredibly high. I knew he had plus wheels and a plus-plus glove, but I’m surprised at how quick his bat has been.
           He and Pache are redundant so it’s not out of the question Dombrowski does deal one this winter. Rojas could bring back a SP with multiple years of team control. Having said that … I’m hoping to see Rojas in red pinstripes for the next few years (at least).

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           1. I would rather eat half of Castellanos’ remaining $60M contract and trade him away to a team that needs a DH, then install Pache in RF.

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              1. Not a chance. Can’t trust Pache yet

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           2. I think personally I’d rather try to move Pache if a GM wants to buy in to his small sample size. I think he is fine but not as good as he has played this year and could give them a sell high opportunity, even if it is for a player not as good as what you could get for Rojas

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              1. I don’t disagree that it’s a SSS, but Marsh did a lot better after getting traded to the Phillies at age 24. This season, we can safely say that Marsh will be a mainstay in the OF at age 25.

                 Pache has performed out of his mind at age 24. He’s probably not as good as his current .957 OPS but with his elite glove, he doesn’t have to be. Pache’s ceiling is very high, as he was a former top 25 prospect. I would rather keep Pache and see what happens. He seems very comfortable in Philadelphia.

                 Rojas will be 23 in a few weeks, and even though he has looked good, he’s 1 year removed from a sub .700 OPS at A+/AA. The jury is still out on Rojas.

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     2. Tells me they think Rojas/Pache are better RH bat options in the OF vs. what they could get in a trade.

        Guess we will see.

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     3. Very interesting…

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     4. It’s curious that DD would say that considering that just last year, Rojas posted a combined .663 OPS across A+/AA at age 21. Marsh, at age 21, posted an OPS of .776, mostly at AA.

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109. At first glance, the Falter trade seems odd, but the reality is, he wasn’t in the Phillies plans anymore. Falter had a golden opportunity when he was gifted a spot in the rotation when Painter went down. Then he proceeded to have 7 starts (8 appearances) and gave the Phillies 7 losses, 5.13 ERA and -0.4 WAR. Not only that, Falter has no more options left after this season, which means if he doesn’t make the opening day roster in 2024, he would have to be subject to waivers. I guess the Pirates knew about this because they gave up Rodolfo Castro who is also in his last option year. They both needed a change of scenery, let’s see what happens.

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     1. It’s also worth noting that he has a .277/.341/.559 (142 wRC+) career slash against lefties. So he’s actually a good option for a RHH, which is what their goal was.

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110. Do Hall/Cave/Marchan/Clemens have any more options after this year?

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     1. As far as I remember, Cave and Marchan are in their last option year, and Hall and Clemens have one more next year.

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        1. I have confirmed that Marchan will be out of options in 2024. Would the Phillies keep Marchan as the backup C and DFA Stubbs? Stubbs has been a reliable backup and he seems to be a popular guy in the clubhouse.

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111. Two years in a row David Robertson trade deadline deal helps the Phillies! (;

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     1. Nice one!

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112. Great win!

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113. Never in doubt!

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114. Thank you David Robertson, for hanging that slider!

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115. With Hao Yu Lee getting traded, he has been removed from MLB Pipeline for the Phillies. Wen Hui Pan has slipped in at #20.

     I believe the lists will be updated in mid-August.

     I would slot Aidan Miller at #6, behind Painter, Abel, Crawford, McGarry, Rojas. I’m also expecting Raylin Heredia and maybe Eduardo Tait making the list.

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     1. Agreed plus Caba possibly

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        1. I think I’d slot Miller #4.

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116. Wow i keep looking at Crawford and boyds, numbers, cause i never saw them in person, Very impressive , He could be a untouchable imo, based on only stats, I hope they give him some time in Jersey shore, but i think romus is right, Clearwater is in playoffs, and most likely wont move him

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117. Last night was great for Nicky Sticks. I hope he can build off of that. We’ll need him and Trea to get themselves right to have any chance of going beyond where we went last season.

     Ranger is simply a winner…

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118. It was also nice to see Ser’A come in and close the game. We have 2 months to go before the Playoffs and cannot burn out Kimbrel. And, Guru, I am not so sure Abel is still #2 on my lost. I expected a much better season from him. Rojas and Crawford may have jumped ahead. I need much more from Abel.

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119. Anyone have an opinion on 26 yr old Podkul who is at LHV. Currently on 7 day IL. I saw him a few times at Reading and he looked good. SSS at LHV, but he seemed to be holding with his Reading success of this year.
     Hall is back so, it’s getting crowded at 1B. If you have seen him play, comment.

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120. With 26 games remaining in Aug.: 2 with Mia, 7 Wash, 3 KC, 3 Min, 2 Tor, 3 SF, 3 StL & 3 LAA, I could see us going 19-7. 21 games over. 500 going into Sept.

     Sept has 27 games:
     7-Mets
     6- Atl
     3- Milwaukee
     3- SD
     3- StL
     3- Mia
     3- Pit

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121. Rodolfo Castro has and OPS around .700, but the splits tell you why we traded for him. .450 vs RHP and over .900 vs LHP. Not bad for the cost of someone with no obvious role.

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     1. Good insight. He is a bench bat that hits LHP well and can play defense. Good addition.

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        1. FYI: Scott Kingery hit a grand slam last night. 12-38-.267 with an OPS close to. 800. Better stats in MLB than Castro. Faster and plays many positions.

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           1. I’ve seen that movie so I know how it ends…

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              1. Angels in the Outfield?

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              2. At least it was a movie on the circuit and can be re-released, The Rudolpho Film went right to video.

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           2. ……..and you are already paying him major league money anyway.

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122. I read he has 23 HRs with about 550ish ABs, which I think is pretty good for a utility IF. Yesterday, I thought that stat was a Minor League one, but it’s the Majors. So much higher on the trade. Also, got a chance to hear DD and how high he is on Rojas. I thought they were targeting Duvall, and maybe the cost was too high? Anyway, very pleased with Lorenzen.

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123. I’d like to ask someone in the FO what is wrong with Weston Wilson. He looked really good in ST has 25 HRs and a 902 OPS in AAA, can play multiple positions including SS which in my mind means he can probably handle some LF.

     I mean yeah I get it he’s 28 but if he’s figured something out this is the perfect time to bring him up and see if it translates.

     Especially for a team really lacking in RH power. He has to be better than Harrison was and probably anything Castro would bring to the party.

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     1. Wilson’s splits 860 OPS against righties 982 against lefties; 16 HRs against righties 9 against lefties…

        Sorry I know I won’t shut up about it but its really bothering me

        and as far as a 40 man spot I can see any number of guys I wouldn’t hesitate to drop: Vasquez, Covey, Moore, Uelman, this Castro guy, Ellis and even Hall at this point.

        Any number of those guys could be dropped from the 40 and we wouldn’t feel it even if they miraculously were claimed.

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        1. This season is K rate is a notch below 27% @ LHV….so there is that swing and miss aspect of his game.

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           1. Which doesn’t disqualify others in MLB.

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        2. I continue to agree about WILSON. Wendell, I mean Weston is my choice.

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     2. DMAR…..his overall minor league peripherals are alright, not great.
        ….slash-.257/.334/.774…23% Krate….9% BB rate.
        Not sure why Brewers really did not give him an opportunity back in 2019 or post Covid-2021.

        OTOH, people could say he could be another Justin Turner….that could be hard to envision, Turner had a plus slash 307/.372/.812-…… and only 12% K rate

        Still I see your point…why not try him out and see what happens.

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        1. This season his BB rate is up to 14%. And yes the K rate has ticked up but so has the power.

           What I am saying is that something may have clicked for him this season. I want to find out if that is real.

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           1. Yes I see…….there are also others there , like Muzziotti and even Kingery or new guy Nick Podkul, that are also having good seasons.
              Nick Podkul played three seasons with Mattt Vierling at Notre Dame
              Cave also…but he has been called up a few times already.

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124. How good is Johan Rojas defensively?

     In only 80 innings played, he already is a +3 DRS. He also materially upgrades our defense by sliding Marsh to left. Last night Marsh made two catches in left that I doubt Schwarber makes. Was a huge difference.

     For years I have been saying on this blog that the Phillies need to upgrade their defense. We finally have a good defensive OF with Rojas and Mash. Castellanos is not good in RF but at least we have other OFs that can cover for him.

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     1. Remember when our only defensive liabilities were at 1B (howard) and LF (burrell, ibanez)? Everybody else was pretty darn solid. I hate that we’ve gotten so far away from that.

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        1. Are we talking about the 2008 team? A lot of stuff went right on that team:

           Rule 5 Victorino was able to hit enough to complement his glove
           Jayson Werth got healthy and he didn’t decline defensively until he was 30
           Jimmy Rollins was an all time draft pick
           Chase Utley was an all time draft pick
           Signed Pedro Feliz mainly for his glove
           Carlos Ruiz was a late bloomer

           DD knew what he was getting into when he signed Schwarber and Castellanos. And who knew that Bohm was going to be this bad with the glove. And Bryce Harper declined defensively a lot faster than anybody had anticipated.

           But it’s not all negative. Realmuto is still holding up defensively. Rojas and Pache are elite gloves. Marsh is above average as a corner OF. And Stott is above average.

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           1. Thru July 9, 2023…SDI Metrics…..Marsh (18th in NL) and Stott (21st in the NL) only positives.
              As expected negatives for Bohm, Castellanos , Schwardber……and surprisingly JTR and Turner.
              https://sabr.org/sdi/2023-07-09#NLP

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125. Phillies designated LHP Andrew Vasquez for assignment. I thought for sure they would lose B. Covey

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     1. Maybe the Phillies feel that Covey would be a better long man? Not sure why they kept Covey, especially when the Phillies will be doing a 6 man rotation until Aug. 14 minimum.

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        1. Vasquez hasn’t been great lately, I think Gelb has mentioned the Phillies believe they can work with Covey.

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126. It was 14 months ago when the Angels came to CBP for a three game series that the Phillies swept. Michael Lorentzen pitched the middle game. It was one of the few games that I got to watch them play.

     The Phils got five runs in the first inning because Lorentzen walked, I think, four batters and gave up a couple of fluke hits. He went on to pitch 5.2 innings and not give up another run. He struck out nine.

     I think (and hope) that he will really fit in with this team. He’s only 31 years old and seems to know how to pitch. In any event, I think he’ll add more to the squad than Thor did and Thor wasn’t all that bad.

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127. I was at that game, wanted to see Ohtani. I remember being mesmerized watching Ohtani run 1b-3b, someone that big and powerful just picking up speed with every stride. Schwaber led off 1st with a HR(this was during his record June tear).

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     1. I don’t know what to do about Turner. Again, I am a fan a d hope he gets it together but his D is much worse than I thought. He lost last night’s game, and DCovey’s 1st ML save. Don’t care if it was ruled a hit, it was an error. What is going on with Kimbrel tipping his pitches? In a season of a lot of bad losses, this was near the top. Cannot blow a 5 run lead with Wheeler on the mound. And was anyone else wishing we had added another RP at the deadline?

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        1. Phillies should switch Turner and Stott next season.
           Stott is close to a Gold Glove now at 2B….his SDI is excellent.
           The UNLV scouting report on him 4 years ago was his arm strength for shortstop, whether or not it was strong enough….I think he has prove that he is more than capable.

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128. I don’t want to hear any defense of Thomson tonight. There is no thought process going on. Literally just going off his gut.

     How do you not walk Berti to get to Stallings when you need two outs and first is open?

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     1. The main thing is that you don’t want to face Arraez with men on base. So you get Berti and Stallings and you don’t have to face Arraez. You walk Berti, there’s no guarantee that Stallings hits into a double play. If Stallings strikes out, you’re in a bind facing Arraez. I don’t have an issue going after Berti.

        Now bringing in Soto in the 9th because of matchups blew up in the Phillies face. But Kimbrel got another chance and couldn’t nail it down either so it’s a wash. And perhaps Thomson wanted to get away with not using Kimbrel. This is what happens when you only have 7 relievers, you have to pick and choose who to save for another day.

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        1. That explanation literally makes no sense because they still have a near 90% chance to have Arraez come up with men on base.

           Even if Stallings strikes out, that still leaves the bases loaded with two outs when the man on first doesn’t matter AT ALL. Having a man on first is literally only a detriment to the Fish because it sets up force outs everywhere instead of only at first.

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           1. So you would rather face Stallings (with the bases loaded) and likely Arraez instead of Berti (no possibility of a double play) and Stallings?

              My main goal is not facing the guy that’s hitting .378. Kimbrel is a strikeout pitcher, not a ground ball guy. If he can’t get Berti and Stallings, that’s on Kimbrel.

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              1. Stop using logic to dispute Dan’s narrative.

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                 1. Subtle. I made a response that went more in depth, but it got lost in the ether.

                    The numbers say that Stallings was always more likely to hit a ground ball than strike out.

                    The numbers also say that Berti was MASSIVELY more likely to drive in a run than not.

                    But that’s just a narrative.

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                 2. I assume that you are talking about the 10th inning. Berti came up with men on 2nd and 3rd and 1 out. Berti hit a sac fly.

                    If you walk Berti to load the bases, to pitch to Stallings, then Stallings who hit a line drive to CF which also would have been a Sac Fly. That brings up the best hitter in baseball with a man in scoring position.

                    The decision is to pitch to Berti who has a 54% ground ball rate against LHP or Arraez who leads the majors in BA.

                    It is illogical to walk Berti to get to Arraez. No one with any common sense would make that decision. RT made the right call. It didn’t work. That’s how baseball works. Not everything goes perfectly. There was nothing wrong with that decision.

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129. Turner is an absolute mess right now. Hitting nothing and somehow completely whiffed a ground ball that would have ended game.

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     1. I didn’t watch Turner’s brutal error because I was busy, and that’s a good thing because I think I would have thrown my remote at the tv AND yelled a string of obscenities to wake up the neighbourhood. It just doesn’t get any worse than that. This is as low as it gets for Turner.

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130. Well thank goodness it’s over. When these guys play ugly they are second to none.

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131. Danielle K to turners rescue. Let’s hear it. Give me the stats why this guy is doing so well? He’s 21 for 21 in stolen bases in 100+ games in a year where it’s easier to steal stolen bases. Gtfoh. I don’t want to hear you defend the way this clown has played this year.

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     1. I didn’t defend his year. I’m sorry your reading comprehension is lower than a 5 year old’s. But just because you’re ignorant, it doesn’t change the fact that context matters. And the context is that Turner is still an excellent base runner and a threat to steal when he’s on.

        Just so you know, he can be fast AND be having a bad year. Turns out even bad players can still have good attributes. Or do I need to explain this slower for you?

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        1. He’s a threat on the basepaths as schwarber is. Last night he led off extra innings on the base paths multiple times. The leagues “best base stealer and fastest guy” was no threat at all to steal. Zero.

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           1. You should see a doctor to make sure you’re getting enough oxygen. Did you have Covid? You might be suffering long-term effects.

              He didn’t steal 3rd because it was an unnecessary risk. He was ALREADY IN SCORING POSITION. Any ball out of the infield is already going to advance him, and any base hit out of the infield is going to score him. Because he’s fast.

              It’s literally baseball 101 to not make the first or third out at third base. But I guess you aren’t really that versed in baseball, so I’ll forgive you for not knowing that.

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              1. Danielle the dope. Come on. He was stranded on second. Fastest guy in baseball and best base stealer didn’t score but would have if he got to third where a sac fly scores him. You’re like RT. Don’t take unnecessary risks. Follow the rules. You get pegged too is my guess.

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                 1. This applies to Chris M and Dan K, let’s keep it civil here. People will have different opinions, and that’s ok. We’re all here to talk Phillies and to learn. No need for name calling and personal attacks.

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132. Bad loss, but not as gut wrenching as some. They battled, and didn’t have their normal bullets – SIr A and Alvarado. It’s sucks because they have the fish dead to rights on the season, in what should’ve been going for a sweep with their new deadline acquisition

     I had to turn it off after the 8-8 play, couldn’t take it anymore, need to save those heart pounders for the playoffs. Turner should lose 1.0 war for that game. 110% on him

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133. When the Phillies gave Turner 11/300, I was easily the most vocal in hating that contract. I mean, we already gave Harper 13/330. There’s no margin of error for contracts like that and most of them end badly i.e. Albert Pujols, Miguel Cabrera. But even I didn’t anticipate this type of season from Turner. He essentially went from a 4 WAR player to 1.5 WAR. He’s playing at a replacement level and he’s doing this at age 29/30. The honeymoon is definitely over.

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     1. Was a big fan of the Turner signing and overall, I still am. He’s having an absolutely terrible season, much worse than anything he’s done in his career.

        At this point, the frustration seems to be spiraling out of control with his play and he looks completely demoralized. Just not sure what the solution is and the Phillies don’t seem to know either.

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        1. 3up….it happens…look at Lindor the season after he signed.
           I liked the Turner signing….but also would not have minded a Swanson inking becasue of the glove aspect and a lower AAV.

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           1. Not only was Swanson’s contract much smaller Swanson was a year younger. C’est La Vie he was BH’s favorite guy in the sport…

              A great lesson for owners and GMs. Don’t fall in love with players to the extent that you might cripple your franchise. Sure fans will b!tch and moan for a short period but winning is all they care about in the end.

              And what is worse a $300 million dollar player fans might turn on or an average/so so guy that is easily upgraded through a trade or home grown product through the system.

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              1. I did not want to say the BH influence on that deal.
                 Oh well….Philies will hope Turner can make a turn around.

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134. I’m thankful that DD didn’t trade Justin Crawford. He really has elite bat to ball skills at such a young age. I think the Phillies could promote him to JS right now and he wouldn’t skip a beat. He could be a top 50 prospect by the end of this season.

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135. Blowing multiple leads late in the game, just handed MoJo back to the Marlins….bet on the Marlins today for a split in the series.

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     1. As bad as it was and I’ve nothing to add I think we take the get away game and come home 4-6 on the trip.

        I wish we had more bad baseball players like Bohm though.

        Not sure its allowed but when I a guy is going like Turner I wish we could IL him and let him get away from baseball for a week and try to clear his head on a few rehab games in CLW.

        On the prospect front it was the Bergolla Crawford show last night. Add in Boyd and those kids are going to be fun to watch in LKW next season. I will actually be making a few trips out there for that.

        As for Rincones JR I was very intrigued when we drafted him but it looks like he can’t hit LH Pitching. I mean he hasn’t hit much of any pitching since his promotion. He did just hit his 5th HR but the bat to ball skills don’t appear to be there.

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        1. DMAR….yuo could be right on Rincones….but his raw tools, strength and size is intriguing.
           Check out his splits…….he had one PA against neither a RHP or LHP…but had a hit and a RBI.
           https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=rincon002gab&type=bgl&year=2023

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           1. I’m wrong most of the time about players so that bodes well for Rincones. When we were down I would check out his numbers almost daily and see what video I could find of him.

              I like Gurus comp to Ibanez and if he becomes that player a huge win.

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        2. Rincones is still only 22 at JS and he already got promoted there this season. But he does have some typical splits:

           home OPS .966, away OPS .578
           vs RHP OPS .810, vs LHP OPS .594
           vs younger pitchers OPS .910, vs older pitchers OPS .713

           He does walk a lot (which is good) and he does have a nice swing. His swing reminds me of Raul Ibanez. He’s another OF so the Phillies can give him time to develop.

           Crazy to think that at one time, the Phillies were begging for OFs and now we have enough at the major league level (Marsh, Rojas, Pache) and our share of OF prospects (Crawford, Boyd, Rincones). Even Muzziotti and DLC could probably be stop gap solutions.

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136. Romus, I am going to go the opposite way and count on Lorenzen to give us a great outing, with us hitting 3 HRs. And, I have no data to back up that belief! I just need the sour taste of last night’s game out of my system.

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     1. matt…I tink Lorenzen will do well for 5/6 innings…..but IMO, ain’t going to help. Marlins will pull out another comeback victory.
        I think it is in the Tarot cards.

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     2. matt…good call.

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137. Romus, you are depressing me again! LOL! Wait until we have that insurmountable 8 run lead! I am seriously worried about the BP, and Alvarado, when he comes back, is not guaranteed to be 100%. He has already been shut down twice. Kimbrel was very worrisome with intentionally sending the ghost runner to 3rd because the guy was reading what pitches were coming, we walk too many guys, and we still have 2 months to go. May we see Griff in the BP soon? or, after the 6 man rotation runs for a bit, will Sanchez come out of the BP?

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     1. Griff McGarry is starting for Reading tonight, so he’s not a bullpen guy for now. I seriously doubt he’s in the Phillies plans for the rest of the season, unless injuries go down. And the Phillies still have Brogdon and Bellatti at Lehigh.

        A lot depends on how Lorenzon looks, but I agree that Sanchez is the likely candidate to go to the bullpen.

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     2. matt……Alvarado;s continued elbow inflammation injuries….second time now this season, leaning more and more toward off-season surgery of sorts…could be UCL or loose chips.
        Just saw Liam Hendricks will need TJ, will not pith again until 2025….he will be a free agent next season…..I wonder who will take a chance and sign him up for 2025.

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138. Generally I don’t care for Marcus Hayes but he does a nice job framing the trade deadline here:

     https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/mlb/trea-turner-j-t-realmuto-kyle-schwarber-get-a-message-from-phillies-bosses-earn-your-money/ar-AA1eJgG7?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=ca0600400a3a4f24b11cef2aa86892ac&ei=133

     For me the offseason requires removing JT (yes I love the guy) and replace him with Marchan and then 1 of Schwarber or Castellanos.

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     1. Why would you possibly want to replace JT with Marchan? Marchan has a sub .700 OPS in AAA while Realmuto is over .750 in the majors.

        For a team struggling to get offense, that’s a major downgrade at a position where finding offense is difficult to begin with and it’s not like it’s a defensive upgrade either.

        Just a strange move.

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        1. 3up……$$$$$ saved under the threshold would be the upside.
           Put that money to Ohtani….LOL

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        2. Marchan is never going to wow you offensively he’s also never going to cost you $24 AAV. If you’re wowed by a 756 OPS at that cost we’re good buddies but we’re on different paths.

           The Astros won a couple of WS titles with a catcher that barely hits 200.

           Will Smith is a much better catcher than JT he makes $5.25 million.

           My thesis is we’ve been at this spending spree since we signed Harper in 2019 and then extended JT. We’ve gone no where. We’re always behind the Braves even when the Braves let Freeman and Swanson walk.

           I don’t need Marchan to replace 2.8 WAR. I can try and make that up elsewhere with whatever savings I can generate from some trades.

           Castellanos is 1 WAR Schwarber is -.9 WAR. I’m not much of a WAR guy but if you can’t make up 3.8 WAR or improve it with that kind of dough (assuming its Nick and JT that you move) that’s a real problem.

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           1. I don’t care about the AAV JTR carries since the Phillies have proven to be willing to go over the tax threshold. It’s not a matter of being “wowed” by his production but he is still one of the top-5 overall catchers in the game.

              Will Smith is an odd example to use since he’s just 1st year arbitration eligible so he’s not a valid comparison. IF he was a FA, he’d be making $24 million too.

              Yes, you can live with sub-par offense at the position if you are getting production elsewhere. JTR isn’t the Phillies problem and there’s no reason to create another hole. Replacing a productive catcher with an unproductive one makes no sense.

              If you want to talk about moving Schwarber/Castallanos that’s an entirely separate issue but you’re not going to compete with the Braves by downgrading positions on the field.

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              1. You’re not competing now with a good catcher so….

                 You’re emotional about JT I get it. But if you can’t see that things are really bad considering we are over the LUX TAX and they likely are going to get worse or not any better with the contracts putting us over the tax

                 then you are not seeing the trees from the forest.

                 Ultimately the more I think about my argument vs. yours you might be right. No other club would be dumb enough to take on a catcher with a 24 aav and give us anything of value.

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                 1. That’s why the Phillies will have to eat some of that contract. If the Phillies trade JT (which for the record I doubt), the Phillies will likely have to eat at least $15M of the remaining $47.6M.

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                 2. Well if you don’t consider Jt to still be a good catcher then that explains everything else. It’s one thing to make the argument that’s he’s overpaid at this point which is true. It’s another to believe that he’s no longer a good player who’s production can be replaced by Marchan, a guy who’s never hit in the minors, had zero power and no speed.

                    You can try to patronize me by claiming my argument is emotional but the numbers support that fact that he’s still a top-level player at the position.

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           2. Much like the 2008 Phillies, the Astros had other players to cover their catcher’s WAR. The Phillies depend on JT’s WAR.

              Will Smith is 28 and still under arbitration. JT is 32 and 3 years into a 5 year deal. Will Smith’s current WAR is 3.2. At age 28, JT’s WAR was 4.5 and he was making $5.9M.

              FA means that you’re buying WAR. You’re paying Turner to be close to a 4 WAR player every year. When he doesn’t do that, you need other players to step up. And this is not easy.

              If Marchan can’t cover JT’s WAR, then somebody else has to do it. Now you might depend on Stott to be a 5 WAR player and Marsh to be a 4 WAR player. Is it doable? Yes. Is it guaranteed? No way.

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     2. I get that you want to be proactive in getting rid of JT, and even though he’s declining, he’s still 3rd in WAR out of the hitters. At the end of the season, he’ll be close to 2.8 WAR. Asking that out of Marchan is dicey.

        Now I agree with getting rid of Castellanos. His defense is impacting his value. Schwarber and Castellanos are DHs playing in the OF. We should get rid of 1 of them in the offseason.

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     3. Castellanos may be more tempting to other GMs than Schwarber, who now only appears in his career to be a long term DH.
        Philies can buy back some of the contract which would help in a trade.

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        1. DMAR, Guru and Romus …. you guys all make good points, especially about the DH’s. Unfortunately, the guy you need to get rid of won’t be the guy other teams want. I am anxious to see what the run to the end of September brings. If it doesn’t pan, does Middleton and DD have the courage to go the Cohen route with the big 5? Turner is lost, I actually feel bad for him he is in deep despair. JT out with large chunk of meat missing on palm of throwing hand. Bohm and the Daycare carrying the load.

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           1. Turner is not this bad I know that. It’s quite perplexing though and someone needs to come up with an out of the box idea to get him right again.

              No one seems willing to admit that we’ve been coddling BH since we signed him in the sense that whoever he wants whatever it costs he gets and its not working.

              Is it about winning or is it about something else? Because if its about winning it isn’t working.

              2019-81-81 4th and 16 back of the Braves
              2020-28-32 3rd and 7 back of the Braves
              2021-82-80 2nd place and 6.5 back of the Braves
              2022-87-85 3rd place 14 back of the Braves
              2023-58-50 Currently 2nd and 12 back of the Braves

              LOL

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              1. DMAR…….Harper for Trout……..LOL
                 Moreno wants to resign Ohtani, Harper is almost $10M less AAV than Trout.

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                 1. Yeah I wouldn’t do that Romus…

                    I like Harper the player not Harper the GM

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139. 100% agree with DMAR. Rafael Marchan is the most under-the-radar prospect (even though he’s technically not still a prospect) in the Phillies system. The defense is elite (better than a 32 YO JTR). Yeah … they’d lose some offensively & on the base paths, but Marchan is a switch-hitter and makes more contact the Realmuto. When you compute the difference in salaries, you probably get more bang for your buck with Marchan.
     Having said all this, Dombrowski isn’t going to trade JT Realmuto. He may/probably will swap out Stubbs for Marchan (who has no more options) in 2024.

     On another note … What is Rob Thomson doing with Trea Turner? He’s moved him from 6th to 8th in the LU today. Is that enough? Very unlikely. The guy needs to clear his head.
     Thomson will sit a reliever for two nights if he’s used in back-to-back games. Says he’s protecting them. A player’s mental health is as important as his physical well being. Turner is drowning. The manager needs to throw him a life preserver.

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     1. He needs some time away not to be buried in the LU agree…

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140. Phillies record this year after August 2 is 58-50 , after 8/2/2008 was 60-50.

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141. I just watched the Turner error. Problem there is that he backhands balls unnecessarily instead of getting his body behind. Rollins, the most fundamentally sound SS I’ve had the pleasure of watching every day, ALWAYS was behind the ball.

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     1. Robin, the backhand was/is not the problem. Most coordinators teach shortstops to take balls on the backhand because of a perceived quicker throw/release on throws. I have seen shortstops run around their forehand to field balls on their backhand. I watched JP Crawford take 100 ground balls on his backhand each day of Instructs while other players were playing in afternoon games.

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142. I was surprised DD did not add an RP. Our BP was supposed to be a strength this year but a game like last night (3 blown saves when our O kept trying to win it for us) put an exclamation point on how important our BP will be the rest of the year.
     We either need an addition or we need Alvarado to come back, SerA to recapture his mojo, and Soto to become more consistent. Basically back to how it was drawn up in the offseason. Let’s hope it happens for if it does we’ll make the playoffs!

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     1. With them going to a 6-man rotation they are down a spot in the pen so not sure they are really able to add a RP, especially with Alvarado expected back.

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        1. Lorenzen said he will be willing to go to the pen if need be..he has done it in the past.

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           1. Yes, eventually either Lorenzen or Sanchez will end up in the pen.

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           2. I like this kid….he attacks the zone quite nicely!

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           3. Lorenzon is willing to go to the pen…for the playoffs. He’s looking to start in the regular season.

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              1. Come mid-Sep…and BP arms start breaking down…he will be in the pen.

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                 1. He might, but don’t forget that the rosters will expand to 28 players so another bullpen pitcher will come onboard. So if they go back to a 5 man rotation, there will be 9 relievers for September.

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                 2. The 2023 Eflin role

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                 3. Yeah…have to think more arms will be available from LHV.
                    Brogdon, Bellatti and Nelson should be all candidates for the call-up.

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143. Michael Lorenzon just totally saved the Phillies bullpen. Great job kid.

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144. Great win… Should have been a sweep but 3 of 4 is pretty good against anyone. Yes, Michael Lorenzen had an awesome debut and helped the team a ton today. Not to pick nits but… Curious why the manager would pinch hit Castro for Cave and then replace him with Rojas for defense. Seems like he used 2 players for one move there. Why not just PH with Rojas. Lucky for us we didn’t go extras again and run out of players.

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     1. Yes…..puzzling for sure.
        Castro’s splits vs LHP is excellent, ok I get that….but then again he has not swung a bat in over three weeks prior to today’s pinch hit assignment.

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        1. He had recently hit in the minors, just not in the majors. The Phil’s got him because his numbers against lefty pitchers are pretty good so I guess they wanted to give him an at bat there. It actually was a pretty good at bat although it ended with a questionable strike 3 call after a few good swings resulting in foul balls. Is he better than Kingery? Better than Segura? We’ll see.

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           1. Ok…thanks for that …..he did have a number of ABs at the AAA level in July.

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        2. I’m alright with getting him looks, if only to make sure he doesn’t get rusty. Making him the primary pinch hit option against lefties (with the occasional start so he doesn’t go too long between at bats) seems like the reasonable approach. Rojas will still get his playing time when he starts and gets brought in for defense.

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        3. Brogdon is so inconsistent, i see him helping us,

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           1. LOL that was funny Rocco

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145. It’s really remarkable to me how negative the comments are. The Phillies are a really good baseball team. Currently in the playoffs. 4th best record in the MLB. All with their two biggest stars having the worst seasons of their careers. They have several good young players as well as awesome vets. Their pitching staff has the highest fWAR in baseball. Guys…quit the complaining over every little move you disagree with and enjoy it!

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     1. There’s nothing wrong with pointing out things that can/should be improved. Complacency doesn’t help anyone.

        That said, I’m also happy to give props (like the props that have been given to Lorenzen today, and to Marsh and Stott all year).

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        1. complacency? Dan you are a fan. your mood doesn’t impact the team in any way.

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           1. Neither does your desire for us to only be optimistic and talk about how good the world is.

              Fact of the matter is, the good stuff that the team does well/correctly generates less conversation. Whereas the stuff that is suboptimal or bad allows us to talk about alternative options.

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              1. talk about the bad plays to “generate conversation” << yep, that's how you come across.

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                 1. No point in talking to you about optics. I’ve said plenty of positive or neutral things (most recently defending Turner in regards to his speed/base running). But the only thing you’ve focused on (and the only things you’ve ever responded to me about, as far as I can remember) are the critical things I’ve said.

                    So you’re quite literally proving my point for me.

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     2. Are you sure, you are from Philadelphia?

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        1. lol. fair point.

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146. v1, I have no argument with your sentiments. But some of these losses are so brutal that if we don’t vent we will go crazy. We have a tendency to play some of the worst fundamental Baseball you can see, and that is over a wide sample size. Yes, I believe we make the Playoffs, and yes, I believe we will see some semblance of Trea Turner before the season ends. But, I need to let some of this angst out after a game like last night. Glad we got the W, although we didn’t get the 3 HRs I predicted!

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     1. That’s how baseball works Matt. At every level. It is a game of failure. There will always be bad calls and bad at bats and bad fielding plays. That’s why baseball reports averages. It is fine to vent every now and then, but read the comments above. they are all negative. it’s crazy. we are a playoff team. With a great chemistry. they are really a fun team to watch.

        I have been a fan through some BRUTAL seasons. BRUTAL. This year is a pleasure. Even when they have a bad game.

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        1. I really had a chuckle reading your response, v1. My 1st season as a Phillies fan, when I really started to understand the game, and sit and keep scorecard, and really get invloved in it, was 1961. Talk about brutal! One of the worst teams ever. And, I had the pleasure of hanging on every pitch last off season, and I want that feeling again. So, I totally understand your points, and I vent on here alot because they drive me crazy, and bad fundamentals really gets me going. But, I do not give up on them, and fully expect them to be in the Playoffs.

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           1. matt….from 1918 thru 1943 the Phillies were the worst team in baseball….well under .500 every year except one year…1933…2 games over .500….many years 90 plus losses in 154 game seasons.
              So the Carpenters of Delware bought the teams and decided they are going to try somethign different….they changed the name of the team from the ‘Phillies ‘ to the ‘Blue Jays’ after a name contest was conducted…thats right they are the original Blue Jays team.
              https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/PHI/1944.shtml
              Well that lasted two years…they still stunk…so they went back to the Phillies in ’46….. but in three years under Eddie Sawyer, they started to win….30 years of futility.
              So many have suffered over the decades.

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              1. Well before me, Romus, but yes, historically bad. That ’61 team had some good players, Johnny Callison was my favorite, and Don Demeter, who we traded to get Jim Bunning, and Art Mahaffey, who I asked for an autograph on his way to the locker room, down in that dreary concourse in Connie Mack, and he said “I’ll be right back kid, I am dropping these off,” and then never came back out. My first sports disappointment at 7 years old. That 2011 team I thought was the best team we ever had, and I was at the last game aganst St. Louis sitting behind home plate. That was a crushing loss. I still remember thinking that both Ibanez and Utley’s hits were going to be HRs. Everyone around me jumped out of their seats. Anyway, apologies for the long winded post. You are correct. Many Phils’ fans hve suffered mightily over these decades. I am hoping for more Playoff magic this season.

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147. I’m a car guy more specifically a Mustang guy. In December the wife gave me the go ahead to pull the trigger on a mint condition 2018 Shelby GT350 in Kona Blue.

     A few weeks after my good friend was inspired to get something nice as well so he pulled the trigger on a really nice 2008 911 Turbo Convertible. We spent almost to the penny the same amount.

     Shortly there after he found out his radiator was bad. Turns out a 911 Turbo has 3 radiators and when 1 goes the other 2 are probably going to go as well. They were roughly $1500 a piece plus $1800 labor to replace. so $6300.

     It took over a month to get the parts and then the shop had it for another 3 weeks. When he finally got it back in May he went to put the top down and that seemed to go fine until he needed to put the top up and it wouldn’t go up properly.

     A 911 Convertible has 2 motors. 1 of his was toast. Turns out when 1 is bad you should replace both. Don’t ask me how much I was afraid to ask as I could see the sadness on his face.

     I’m still waiting to go for a drive with him.

     But hey he has a Porsche he should just enjoy it

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     1. Really! What site are you commenting on?

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     2. Sorry for your friend, DMAR, but his mistake was spending whatever he spent and not having the car checked by a professional car guy. Your car, and his, because of the value of them, has created a whole industry of mechanics who specialize in them. They would have known about 3 radiators and 2 convertible top motors. I am assuming you are using this as an analogy with the Phillies. I know you think they have a bad radiator, and 2 more are going to go, or something like that. But, my pleasure was in Rhys Hoskins hitting that HR off Spencer Strider, and Harper’s HR to get us to the WS, and I want that again. So, I will hold on to that hope and not think about trading Realmuto and Bohm and Castellanos and Schwarber, and Turner, and not worry that we won’t catch Atlanta. I will simply wait to beat the Braves in the Playoffs.

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        1. Atta Boy Matt you understood my poor attempt at humor…

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           1. Always appreciate your posts, DMAR. We don’t always have to agree, but I always respect your opinion.

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              1. And I appreciate yours Matt :). We have a great group of guys/characters here and Jimmy creates a great environment for us to express ourselves all things Phillies.

                 Now some take themselves way too seriously

                 For me I would never tell another one of my brethren what to feel or how to feel but that’s just me.

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148. KC, WS, and MN for the ten game homestand. It would be really great if the boys could go 7-3. That would put them 13 games over .500. How nice.

     V1 is correct but so is matt. We tend to harp on a lot of things even when the team is doing well but we get crazy when we know they can be doing better.

     You know what it’s called? Being a die hard Phillies fan. Turner hit the ball hard today and made all the plays. Could be the start to something positive.

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     1. Heard he was in the batting cage with Kevin Long, Thomson and a trainer up until midnight last night after the 12 inning loss.
        Then gets up for a noon game today.
        He is working at it.

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        1. Yeah, I’ve never doubted his work ethic or desire. Also why I don’t harp on his continued struggles, personality. Really I just want him to be given some time off and to not be at the top of the lineup until he gets back on track.

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149. I hate to say this but looking at the KC Royals 3 Startung pitchers this weekend: Lyles, Marsh & Grienke, Phillies batters should feast.
     TOTALS:
     G – 47
     GS – 46
     IP – 241.1
     H – 254
     ER – 158
     HR – 52
     BB – 64
     K – 177
     ERA – 5.89
     WHIP – 1.32
     BATTING AVERAGE AGAINST – .260

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     1. Also a total of 3 wins & 28 losses.

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        1. KC is also 40 games under .500 even after just sweeping the Mets in a 3 game series ending today.

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        2. Denny….Zack Greinke…a 72bWAR pitcher who will get serious consideration for the Hall of Fame after his 5 years into retirement.
           Is now going thru a 1=11 season with a FIP of 5 and ERA of 5.3.
           He has to be thinking retirement after this year.

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           1. Or he’ll take this opportunity to finally switch back to shortstop and follow his true passion, haha.

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           2. As purely a baseball fan I’m looking forward to seeing Witt JR. I was watching one of his games last week on MLB and saw him turn on 100 on his hands and put it over the wall for a walk off win. His first ever.

              As Mark knopfler said the kid can play.

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              1. Royals coming off a three game sweep of the Mets…. 20- 8 in run differential….Phillies better not play down to them.

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150. Phuture Phillies bloggers – negative about the team or not, we can’t lose site of the reality that our team is the losingest franchise in the history of professional sports. Coming from a family of Phillies fans – and i have been following the team for 70 years, yes, I saw Whitey, Granny Hamner, Robin, and Del Ennis in person, on the field – but I am the only one of my extended family to witness the glory of 1980; 1983; 1993; 2007-2011 ; and 2022. The only one. I consider that an extraordinarily fortunate experience – those before me never saw any glory.

     Like many of you I suffer through some of these awful games where our team plays down to the level of lesser competition but i do think that V1 has a very valid point. We are fans of one of the best teams – not always the best, but certainly designed to be the best. Sometimes execution lets us all down. I would submit that baseball transcends time – enjoy it for what it is and take the best from what we are given to witness….yes, we are Phillies fans, no longer down trodden with head hung low, but we ain’t perfect either….and we have had the best and will see it again. V1 – keep that positive flag flying…..thanks.

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     1. yes. there is no doubt that we will have some down years in the future. but for now, this is a really really good team filled with a bunch of fun characters. let’s enjoy it!

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151. Lastly, poor Trea Turner. Talk about lost ? The poor guy needs to go on the DL for about 30 days ++ to get himself back together. Now after every AB he shakes his head in disbelief, as if to say -it happened again – what are you thinking ? Very sad for him and our team. But mostly for him and for us to witness the collapse of one of the best baseball players on the planet is more than disheartening. We are frustrated by his embarrassing play because collectively we had such high hopes.

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152. I was looking at the DSL teams: White and Red. Overall they are both doing well. The White team has the best record in the entire DSL . They are 33-8. I’d call that exceptional but the hitting stats don’t fit record. No one player is in the top 25 in any hitting category… for the White. Eduardo Tait is the only Phillie in the top 25 and he plays for the Red. He’s 18th in BA and no other category. Where the White excels is in Pitching. White is 1st in ERA, by a lot. They are 1st in Whip. Of course 1st in Wins. They’ve given up the fewest runs and ERs. Given up the 2nd fewest HRs and they are tied for the fewest BBs allowed. The individual pitching stats for the White don’t show many or in most cases any top performers.

     Deductions from this might be it’s either all smoke and mirrors or maybe there’s 1 or 2 or maybe 3 guys who could make it to the higher levels of the organization. Tait, Caba, Manrique (maybe) and maybe 1 intriguing guy, Ferrebus. Ferrebus has only 47 PAs and mostly DHs. But he has good size (6’2″ 175) for a 17 yo. He’s hitting .395/.511/.533/1.063. From the pitching side maybe Angel Liranzo and Luis Gonzales.

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     1. You know what they say Bellman grow the arms to buy the bats…

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153. Jimmy I’m guessing I made a bad post with a certain persons videos. My bad I won’t do it again…

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154. DMAR – Love the Dire Straits add on.

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     1. 🙂 a big prize to you Ciada for getting the reference

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155. DMAR – Got to see them in Hartford right after they did “Money For Nothing” with the now deleted line in the song. Check out the Irish movie “Cal” from 1984. It was Knopfler’s soundtrack film. Really great story in the midst of all the Irish disturbance.

     Really happy with Lorentzen’s debut. I know it’s just one game but at 31 this kid is really coming into his own. Get him now for 2 and 25. If Nola walks due to wanting big money after a so-so year, Lorentzen steps in. He even looks a little like Nola.

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     1. If he’d take 2/25, I’d sign him for that right this second. He doesn’t even need to be nearly as good as he has been this year to justify that.

        But you gotta figure he’s gonna test free agency when he’s this close and having a great platform year. And there’s definitely teams who will offer him more than that.

        But hey, maybe the playoff atmosphere of Philly will convince him to give us a discount.

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        1. I think three years will be the offering, if they do ecide to offer him come Nov……maybe $14/15M AAV.

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     2. Agree if you can’t come to terms with Nola you QO him and move on.
        I don’t think its good to have constant turn over on a roster year to year but some pruning is always healthy.

        Lorenzen offers a nice bridge for this club to carry on. At what number and years I’m not sure but good news/bad news he pitches really well for us down the stretch and into the playoffs and his open market figure goes way up.

        Growing up in the 80’s constantly watching MTV (when it was good )that song was always in rotation :). Good Memories and Mark is a very interesting and deep thinking fellow.

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156. So, I’m looking at Matt Winkleman’s site and I see the Phillies signed all of their draft picks and the total bonus amount is slightly over the allotted pool amount (but not more than 5%). By going slightly over, does that penalize the team in any way going forward? If so, is it just financial (it’s not my money) or will it cost them draft capital?

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     1. Under 5% overage is just an extra tax (on the money over their allotment). In other words, not actually a punishment for teams who care about winning.

        No draft picks lost until you go beyond the 5% threshold. I believe you lose 2 first rounders at 15%, but I doubt we’ll ever see that happen (it’s unlikely we even see the 5% penalty, to be honest).

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157. In case anyone here is interested but hasn’t seen it reported elsewhere;

     A section of Phillies fans are donating to the “V Foundation for Cancer Research” in support of Trea Turner. It’s one of his preferred charities and obviously goes to a good cause.

     So if you wanna donate so you can boo without feeling guilty, there ya go haha.

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     1. I am wondering. Turner worst yr. I believe was in 17 284 average . What is happening to him is nuts. This is a stud who can’t field or hit makes no sense. Rojas from little I have seen is a terric center fielder. Hope he hits enough to play

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        1. In my opinion it’s just a slump that turned into him getting in his own head. I think an extended break from baseball would help tremendously. Hard to do during the season, obviously.

           But I don’t think it can be argued that the issue is his desire or work ethic, at least. And he deserves support (not saying you have to want him to be in the lineup or anything, just understanding and not harassing him) for that, at least. Winning is the most important thing for fans, but Philadelphia also loves players that are passionate and work hard. And he certainly does that.

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158. Cole Hanels has retired.
     https://www.cbssports.com/fantasy/baseball/news/cole-hamels-hangs-up-cleats/amp/

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     1. Thank you Cole. Many people were responsible for the 08 title but if one jumps out as being the biggest reason, it would be Cole. What an absolute stud that October….that change up was special

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     2. Cole ended his career with a 58bWAR.

        https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/h/hamelco01.shtml

        Another 10WAR and he would be in good standing for the a Hall of Fame selection…as it stands now, he may fall short of the required votes..

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        1. Dmar I told you to attend Romus class. Bet you didn’t know he was short on War? That man is a walking encyclopedia of use full knowledge

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           1. rocco…LOL…Funk and Wagnalls

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           2. You are wise beyond your years Rocco and no doubt Romus is our greatest resource

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159. I’m a big Cole fan and he was very good but not HOF material. The strikeouts, ERA and WHIP were close but the WAR and the Wins were definitely short. He was very good for a lot of years but just not dominant all that long.

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160. My thinking exactly. Probably 5-10 WAR outside of the window. If he had just stayed healthy a little longer, he would have had a decent shot at the HOF, but, mid-career, he played like a HOFer, just as Cliff Lee did – they just didn’t play long enough.

     I don’t know what to say about Trea Turner. I didn’t like the contract when they signed it because I thought it was about 3-4 years too long, but I loved the player. I feel badly for him (as much as you can feel bad for a guy getting paid $27 million per year). He’s obviously pressing and now panicking. There’s nothing to do but wait and hope at some time – probably next year – but hopefully before the year ends – he snaps out of it. Or just hits okay.

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     1. I just hope he does not have the career turn as Lindor with the Mets is having.

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161. One of the things the Phillies need to start to do this offseason is to start to turn over the roster. I probably wouldn’t sign Nola and I might look to trade someone like Castellanos, put Harper back in right, Marsh in left (Schwarb to DH) and have Rojas and Pache fight for time in center. At first, I’d try to get a one-year deal with Hoskins (they need a righty power bat) or someone else on the market. If this team doesn’t start slowly replacing veterans we are going to have 2014 all over again. But I think they know better now.

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     1. Harp may not want to go out to RF again…he may like the action at first base.
        Plus he gets to talk to all his buds as they get to first base.
        It is probably his call on the matter.
        if he stays there.. Rhys could be gone as a free agent coming off a knee surgery, ouch.

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        1. I’m totally fine with Bryce playing 1B going forward. It keeps Schwarber off the field and improves our overall defense. I know we are missing Rhys’s bat but I think some combination of Rojas/ Pache / Cave will play much better defense and hit enough to score some runs. Improved defense helps our pitching staff and helps keep the bullpen as fresh as possible. I think that’s more important than hitting a few more homers. Plus, those 3 guys combined will make far less that what Rhys will get even coming off his ACL injury.

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           1. Not sure what the Phillies intentions are with Rhys.
              Maybe they will offer him a LTC or maybe even a QO….in either case it is close to $20M per annum….right now he is at $12M on his final arb year.
              I agree with you…might as well let Harper stay at first base.
              But it will be his decision…he seems to be able to ‘call his own plays’ over these last few years.
              I suppose Harper is to the Phillies, what Reggie Jackson was to the Yankees in the late late 70s……’the straw that stirs the drink’

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              1. LTC or QO won’t happen. Maybe a year prove it deal? You’d pay Rhys almost 20 mil a year to get a streaky hitter who plays first base with bricks on his hands? Also, one coming off a year off and a year older? Stick with Bryce to allow a better defensive outfield with two of the three playing(pache,Rojas and marsh)

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                 1. Chances Phillies hit Hoskins w/a QO: near 100%
                    Chances Hoskins/Boras accept: 50% (probably worth 3/51M on open market)

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                 2. Hinkie, you’re usually spot on but missed here. I can’t see the Phillies paying him 20 mil on a QO this offseason. I can’t see anyone paying him 3/50.

                    I don’t think we could have traded him this offseason for more than an average RP at best when he was 1/12m.

                    He’s coming off injury. He’s horrible defensively. .240 hitter. A hitter who goes ice cold for long stretches. Had a really bad postseason minus one home run.

                    Is a good clubhouse guy. I’d be happy to spend his money elsewhere. I see maybe a 2/25m contract. I just can’t imagine any team excited to sign him. He is frustrating to watch. His cold streaks are brutal. His 3-5
                    Game hit streaks are fun. Defensively he’s the worst I’ve seen.

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                 3. Hoskins:
                    Comes down to Middleton.
                    Middleton is very loyal to his players and very generous.
                    If he says offer a QO to Rhys, as a prove it/pillow deal, it gets done….and the GM and manager work around the lineup construction next year
                    Dombrwoski and Fuld could play Devil’s Advocate, but …..

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                 4. Chris … a one year contract is almost never a bad deal for the club. The QO also protects the Phillies from getting nothing if Hoskins walks. In this case, the Phils would get a pick after RD4 (instead of RD2) because they’re over the LTT in 2023. That’s not nothing. It comes w/the slot bonus (almost a half-million dollars), and the Phillies do have a pretty strong history of 5th round selections (Hoskins/Falter/Vierling/McGarry/Kerkering).
                    I think you’re under-rating Hoskins worth. This winter’s FA class is light. Hoskins is the top 1Bman available, and one of the top RHHs (behind Matt Chapman/equal to Jorge Soler) available overall. I think a team like the SFGs (Rhys’ hometown club) would aggressively pursue Hoskins. Just my opinion.

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                 5. Hinkie, I understand the QO system. However, the risk of him taking a 20 mil one year contract is not worth the risk. Borass would understand that he’d have trouble getting more than 1/20m with a draft pick attached to him for the signing team. If he wasn’t coming off a full year out, then I’d probably lean your way.

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                 6. Again … my opinion … but the Phillies lineup is unbalanced (lacks any real RH pop [especially to hit behind/protect Harper]). They were searching for a RH power bat at the deadline. I’m pretty confident Dombrowski wouldn’t mind investing 20M for one more season of Hoskins. It would mean Harper goes back to a COF, but a year-and-a-half post surgery, he should be fine there.

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           2. Same. I like Bryce at 1B going forward.

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162. Griff McGrarry promoted to AAA. Gets to face some AAAA hitters. Still needs to get that walk rate down, if he’s going to pitch in MLB

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     1. Wonder why he is walking a lot of guys.

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163. Well. Nola had an okay game. But knew the lead was gone as soon as they showed Marte coming in.

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     1. Okay? He can’t beat the royals. Hope they let him walk

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        1. Yeah, it was okay. He may have been falling apart at the end, but he also came back and struck out the side the other time he had two men on.

           The homers were both mistakes, but the rest of the game he was excellent. So I figure it averages out to a good start. Then letting two men on brought it down to okay. I won’t ding him for another pitcher serving up batting practice.

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     2. Not sure I would call it an ok game. Was what he’s been doing lately, too many floaters in the middle of the plate that get hammered.

        He’s losing money with each start.

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        1. Gave my reasoning for it being okay above. But I’m basically not assuming both runners score if he stays in. If he gave up one more hit/walk, I would have downgraded it to bad. But I’m not gonna blame him for Marte.

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164. We continue to play down to our opponents. This is awful. Nola had a bunch of Ks but 2 more HRs and 8 hits, Marte lost whatever he had earlier and we kept missing hittable pitches! I know v1 is going to yell at me but how can we watch this and not be pissed off?

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     1. That wasn’t V1 earlier, I don’t know who it was. Either someone masquerading as V1 or he has undergone a religious conversion. If you noticed he didn’t use SSS in his communication, a dead giveaway of an imposter.

        On the subject of Nola I am in the QO camp.

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        1. Lol

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           1. My friend came up with a great analogy with Nola.
              “He throws so many hangers, you could fill up a closet with them. “

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165. Management must see something in Marte and Covey that I don’t see.

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166. I should not comment on Nola, Cause i never liked him, I said it before this yr, He is a mid rotation guy, 500 pitcher , He had two good yrs, out of seven, if i am looking at the right stats, 16 games over five hundred in those two yr, Other five 500 pitcher or less, 5 complete games in nine years, i didnt count 16 only had few starts, If the phillies bring him back pls let it be one yr, make good contract, dont tie up a lot of money on him,

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     1. rocco……you stuck by your guns on Nola.
        I think I’d let him walk at this pioint with a QO, which he will probably refuse.
        You know how Middleton is with his money…I am sure they offered him Rodon money last spring….$27M AAV……and he rejected it.
        More than likely the length was the hang-up, who knows why he rejected the offer…..Rodon got six years.

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     2. Well, my slightly longer post got lost. So this time I’ll just say;

        You’re free to comment on and dislike whoever. But you may not like any other pitchers better. His W-L record is largely because he played most of his years on some pretty bad Phillies teams. Even in 2020 he “only” went 5-5 despite a 3.28 ERA.

        As for CGs, he’s actually tied for 13th since 2016 in CGs, and tied for 4th since 2020 (when he threw his first one). So unless we get Alcantara, you’re likely to be even more disappointed with whatever pitcher replaces him in that regard.

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        1. And it doesn’t cost the majority of us anything if we sign him. They will throw bad money in another direction anyway.

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        2. Good pitchers win on bad teams, But if you want him back at big dollars, fine, your not helping the club if you depend on him. How did he do in playoffs last yr, 2-2 as i said a 500 pitcher, oh that team was bad so it dont count, sorry, Oh his era in those starts .4.91. Romus i am getting better with stats,

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           1. rocco….yes ..you are doing well with the stats.
              Nola’s last three years, 87 starts, have been a notch or tick above average….like you say….mid-rotation guy.
              ERA+ equates to 103……100 is average, and an average FIP of 3.4.
              He will get a pretty hefty pay day as a free agent….just not sure it will be as high as what the Phillies may have offered earlier thuis year…we will never know..

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           2. I didn’t say I want him back at big dollars. I want him back at reasonable dollars, but someone will probably overpay him for his peak and we shouldn’t match that. I greatly appreciate all the quality innings he has given us over his career, but we can’t give every player on the team a mega contract, and he’s on the wrong side of 30 and having a bad year.

              But also no, good pitchers do not necessarily win on bad teams. Felix Hernandez won a Cy Young with a 13-12 record. He did just about everything he possibly could have to win those games; 249.2 IP with a 2.27 ERA is crazy good. But you literally cannot win a game if your offense doesn’t score, and that happens often on truly bad teams.

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        3. Good points Dan. I agree with you.

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167. Back to the game. Schwarber, Harper and JTR had some pretty poor ABs vs a Pitcher who seemed definitely hittable. Haper and JTR had pitches to drive that they just didn’t square up on. Schwarber just looked bad. And, Marsh, who I like and have supported since we got him, not only missed that Fly Ball to LF that he should have had, but had Perex at 3B when he should have thrown the ball there. But, he didn’t. He threw it somewhere between 2d and 3rd in some baffling move that I still don’t understand. That is the type of fundamental mistake that drives me nuts, and his poor D cost 2 runs. He has to be better. And, with the Royals showing us that stealing bases is permissable under the rules, why didn’t anyone in Red pinstripes take the hint?

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     1. When Marsh (126), Stott (112) and Bohm (110) have higher OPS+ than JTR (104(, Turner (78), Schwarber (99) and Castellanos (107) after 110 games into the season…..you may have to wonder if Thomson has more in his bag of tricks to get the team on a sustained winning roll for the last 50 games.

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        1. I thought for sure, Belatti would be call up today. He is throwing well right now

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           1. rocco … Bellatti and Marte are interchangeable. Hoffman has to stay (or he could walk). The next shoe drops when Alvarado is ready to throw again. Either Covey or Marte/Bellati goes down. They seem intent yo keep Covey because of his ability to eat innings so the survivor of Marte/Bellatti will likely be optioned.

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              1. I was hoping Connor Brogdon could straighten himself out, recapture some magic from the past….but, he was just hot and cold down at LHV, inconsistent….. IronPigs eventually transferred him to the Development List on Tuesday this past week.
                 .

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           2. No he’s not, he was awful his last time out. Last year was really the only time he’s had major success.

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              1. Your right. I was trading wrong stats

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                 1. The big club needs length from their starters to give the bullpen (now only 7 guys) a little breather. While Marte and Hoffman haven’t been elite, they’ve been very durable and good most games. Without Brogdon or Bellatti, and with Alvarado hurt twice and Seranthony out hurt for awhile, these two have really stepped up. Meanwhile I’m worried we’re going to burn out Kimbrel. We need Alvarado back because Soto’s control scares me.
                    In the minors, the new draft class seems to be doing well and there have been some promotions to allow them to play and there will be more. McGarry is at LHV now so let’s see how he does. His control has been an issue but he’s not giving up many hits so his stuff must be really good. Simmons is on the IL again but the kid has had a great season. We knew he was raw when drafted but were hopeful he’d figure it out. Well, he might have figured it out. If so, look out because he becomes a top 10 prospect.

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168. Certainly not the prettiest win, but could be the biggest of the regular season if this gets Trea going. Great to see him smiling after at-bats.

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     1. just as encouraging were Harper’s at-bats. He was driving the ball and took the best swings he’s had in the last couple of weeks.

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169. I see, though 5 games, Aidan Miller is batting .483 (7 for 16) with 2 doubles, 4 K’s and 3 BB’s. His BABIP is a lusty .583 though… so he’s either really lucky or his hitting the ball really hard. I’m sure he’s still getting use to professional pitching and wooden bats. Has anyone seen him play yet?

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170. Hinkle I bet Romus was that kid in High School. With thick glasses running nose, messy hair. Who was always raising his hand to answer.

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     1. rocco…not fair, and how in the world did you find that out!
        i figured my past was buried….but you, being such a great private eye type, unraveled it.

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171. On Nola, I want to see him down the stretch. I know he is not having his best season, but I do know his stats are deceiving. Last I looked he was top 10-25 in WHIP, Innings, and SO. He is averaging a SO an inning. HIs ERA is 54th in the league. Obviously his hrs allowed are what’s hurting him. I really liked how he battles against the Rays, and I believe that is the playoff Nola will get again. Sure he’s not perfect, and he does to better with more rest, he’d benefit the most from a 6 man rotation.
     The issue is how you view him – the glass half full or Half empty … or in baseball terms – an Ace who pitches like a #2 sometimes or a #2 who pitches like an ace sometimes. Now I am aware he has pitched like a #4 at times this year … but I want him back – it’s the contract that’s the issue.
     Be careful what you wish for, because Nola is not easily replaced , even in a bad season for him.

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     1. There’s no doubt that Nola has cost himself him major money. His agent is not Scott Boras, but I could definitely see Nola taking a 1 year deal or something with an early opt out to try to rehabilitate his value. Giving Nola a QO is still a no brainer for me, and if he takes it, that’s fine.

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     2. Is it a bad season though? I keep seeing that but it’s not the first time this has happened with him. He JUST had a 4.63 ERA in 2021. I think the innings he gives are very valuable but I don’t think you want to win a bidding war for him.

        The only thing consistent about Nola is you look at his underlying stats and think his numbers should be better.

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     3. Tac3…….he rejected the Phillies offer 6 months ago and you can bet Middleton made a very good offer, he does not do cheap.
        Slap a QO on Nola after the World Series….if he takes it, thent great…$20M for 2024.
        If not…the Philies can use the $26/27M AAV they offered Nola back earlier this year, and go get someone like a Blake Snell

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172. Looks like Marsh is headed to the IL and with the Phillies having an open 40 spot, looks like Weston Wilson is getting the call.

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     1. I’m a bit surprised it was not Muzzotti as he has been playing well in AAA. I do understand Wilson with the 25 Hrs was enticing. Not sure Muzzotti has a future with the team as Cave, Rojas, and Wilson all have now been selected above him recently.

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        1. Muzziotti is tiring or irritated he’s been passed by:

           April .364/.367/.432
           May .330/.413/.505
           June .351/.422/.459
           July .225/.317/.296
           August .182/.167/.273

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173. Bohm is a perfectly defensible option to hit second right now, but boy do I wish he was a faster. Stinks not being able to score from first on a double.

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     1. Always with the negative waves,
        ….LOL

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        1. Yeah, my fault. Should have known he just wanted to pad Stott’s RBIs some more haha.

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174. On a different note, I hope Salvy isn’t seriously hurt. But it’ll be super cool seeing KC play by the old NL rules for the rest of the game.

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     1. Wha thappens if Greinke is removed as the pitcher with a reliever?
        i do not think Greinke will last 5 innings the way it is going right now.

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        1. Same thing as pre-DH. You can put another pitcher in his spot in the batting order, do a double switch, etc.

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175. Good to see Schwarber hit a HR but I think he is better used in middle of order and speed at top of order. Plus alternate righty lefty.
     Turner
     Stott
     Bohm
     Harper
     Casty
     Schwarbs
     JT
     Marsh
     Rojas/Pache

     Many of the hitters are interchangable but this is what I think would work

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     1. Agree with the sentiment, but would leave Trea where he is for now until he’s had a little more prolonged success. So could just move everyone else up one in your proposed lineup.

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176. Really, a guy you time with an hour glass you send from first to third! Wow!

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     1. Did the broadcast show the coach sending him? Thought maybe he just misread the play himself.

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        1. It didn’t show it, but either Rubin or Tom said “their sending him”. Luckily a HR followed, but it could have been one more.

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           1. My bad on Reuben, someone in the booth.

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              1. Hmm, very strange. There’s been a few questionable decisions by the third base coach this series.

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177. Tai Walker maybe has 8 more starts left this season, if the Phillies go with the 6-man rotation thru Sept.
     He leads now, and possibly could finish the season with the most victories in the league if he can get Ws in 5 or 6 games down the stretch.
     I seriously doubt he gets selected NL Cy Young winner….but he sould be nominated in the top four or five of the finalists.
     Right now looks like Snell, Strider, Steele and Stroman will all be in the running…maybe even Kershaw if he stays healthy.

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     1. It’s been a while since wins were a serious consideration in Cy Young debates. I’d be surprised if Walker gets anywhere near the top 10, to be honest.

        Among NL starters with 100+ IP, he is:

        17th in ERA
        20th in fWAR
        13th in bWAR
        27th in K/9
        29th in BB/9
        19th in xERA
        24th in FIP

        And that’s without even considering relievers. And there’s guys like Bednar and Hader on that list…

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        1. Many of those peripherals, individually, probably will not be a negative rating for him.
           WAR and FIP could be however.
           Like I mentioned…if he ends up winning 5 or 6 of his remaining starts…..that indicates , he has oitched at least 5 innings in those starts or wins, and secondly, he has given up one fewer run to the opponent than what the Phillies have scored.
           The Ws alone will improve many of those peripherals.
           Saying all that….I still think the odds are against him since guys like Snell, Strider and Steele will be right there in wins.

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178. Justin Crawford hit his 2nd HR Saturday night it was a Grand Slam in the 9th. Unfortunately they still lost the game but on the season he’s sitting 333/389/849 OPS
     Also only 50 K to 23 BBs which is something you like to see.

     Bergolla too at 18 is playing very well 276/382/705 OPS with 11K to 23 BBs

     Rincon 19 is not lighting it up with average but he has 8 HRs with a 365 OBP 60 Ks to 54 BBs

     We have something going on: Clearwater Threshers (67-33, 23-12)

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     1. DMAR…..agree.
        Threshers have many ‘to-dream on’ prospects.
        Those you mention, and I am also intrigued and excited about OFer Boyd and Malver Prep grad, catcher Jordan Dissin.
        Philies seem to have many potentially impactul future MLB players at all four A levels…JS, CLW, the FCL team, and even at the Dominican Academy.

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        1. Boyd yes also could have mentioned Cade Fergus who leads the team with 12 HRs. He’s still a little K heavy and 22 is not exactly young for CLW….

           Also LKW has won 3 in a row. There isn’t much in the way of prospects there but Kendall Simmons is having a type of breakout season batting 303/411/988 OPS at 23 y/o he’s still young enough to say he may impact a big league roster one day…

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           1. Fergus just promoted to JS- 34.5% K rate at CLW.

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           2. The farm system this year is interesting. Here are my overall views.

              The bad news is that, while there are promising prospects, there really have not been a group of breakout guys and there’s no soaring potential superstar like we saw last year with Painter. Crawford is getting there and, again, it’s promising, but he’s far away from the majors and he has a lot of strengthening to do before we view him as a likely future star.

              That said, a number of things appear to be headed in the right direction. The system just feels a lot deeper than it was before. There are big arms up and down the system and, of course, three great starting pitching prospects. We seem to be hitting on a high percentage of our first round picks, which is huge. Also, there just seems to be a group of hitters that’s large enough for one to believe that some percentage of those players will develop.

              Finally, I love that we scouted the minors and came up with a large group of older (but not actually old) prospects who could develop into something. Matt Klentak NEVER did this and it drove me crazy. The new talent people are on top of that and, if nothing else, there’s a Jake Cave or Weston Wilson available when you need someone.

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              1. “I love that we scouted the minors and came up with a large group of older (but not actually old) prospects “…..Mike Ondo does a very good job there, and the POBO/GM listen and heed his advice.

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     2. It’ll be interesting if they can improve on their hitting since the speed is getting them on base more and the fielding is not as good at that level. Crawford and Bergolla both need to at least elevate the ball a bit more from a high groundball rate to more of a line drive hitter. If they can do that they will show modest power and better exit speed. 2024 should show going forward are they legit top end prospects or not.

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     3. Here are some analytical points that suggest how much having Marsh/Pache (perhaps even Cave) in LF and Rojas (straight from the farm) in CF means to our 2023 OF defense. Schwarber brings so much leadership to this team but the LF substitution needs to become mandatory for the 8th/9th innings of any game in which we hold a lead.

        Entering play today the Phillies were 29th in outfield OAA at -9.

        The Phillies without Kyle Schwarber would have been t-9th in outfield OAA at +6.

        This is amazing to me. One man takes a top 10 unit to nearly league worst status.

        — Robert Orr (@NotTheBobbyOrr) August 7, 2023

        Let’s hope the defensive skills of Crawford and Boyd can continue to ascend.

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        1. BH needs to be able to go out to 1B everyday so that can happen. If he can’t and I’m sure there is good reason he can’t it definitely hampers Thomson.

           Assuming everyone is healthy for the last month of the season I’d like to see Marsh in LF everyday and either Rojas or Pache in CF everyday. Kyle the permanent DH…

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           1. Rojas has done enough that I think he’ll be the front runner for the extra position player when the rosters expand in September.

              And yes, I think Marsh should be in LF. He’s decent enough in CF but he can’t seem to track the difficult balls. I think Rojas and Pache are the elite defenders in CF.

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              1. Wanting Pache or Rojas in CF isn’t a slight for basically anyone. They’ve been true 80-grade defenders (which was expected of Pache, but Rojas was always more in the 65/70 range projection, as far as I remember).

                 What’s cool is that Pache is at 2 OAA, while Rojas is at 3. Which just sounds like they’re pretty good… until you realize that OAA is a cumulative stat. Pache is the only CF in baseball to have 2+ OAA in under 90 defensive innings, while Rojas is the only 3+ under 200 innings (and Rojas is only at 117…).

                 To make the perspective a little bit easier: among players with 80+ innings in CF, Pache and Rojas rank 1st and 3rd, respectively, in UZR/150. Travis Jankowski (90 innings) is 2nd.

                 Defensive stats take a while to stabilize, so there’s a massive grain of salt there. But they both have reputations as excellent defenders and they’ve been showing that when on the field.

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                 1. Rojas’ DRS back at the end of June was better than every CFer in professional baseball –minors and majors—….sans Kevin Kiermaier.

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                 2. Phillies, in their history, have had one Gold Glove winner at 2B…Manny Trillo.
                    Right now Stott is right up there with Albies, Hoerner, Estrada, Turang and Kim according to SDI/Rawlings.
                    When it comes to just DRS, he heads all NL 2Bers @ 7 Fangraphs and also BaReference.

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179. Sometimes the 7-figure signing bonuses for international kids just do not work out in the long run…and sometimes it pays just to be lucky…..in July 2018, Elly De La Cruz signed with the Cincinnati Reds as an international free agent…..he received a $65,000 signing bonus.

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     1. It’s hard enough to project 18 and 20 y/o HS and College Kids. Imagine seeing 15-16 y/o kids and saying yeah millions for this one and only thousands for this one…

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        1. Some teams just seem to have the knack of identying those future stars.
           And then inking them at very modest bonuses.

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           1. Mead got promote to big club, Friday shame 22 yrs old and a good prospect, we let go,

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              1. True but Sanchez has saved our butts this year.

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              2. Meed 1-8, 5ks.
                 On the Meed watch.

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              3. Looking at Mead’s profile/minor league #’s he appears very much to be similar to Alex Bohm, who I’ve been told is a bad mlb player.

                 From Keith Laws prospect rankings

                 “He’s playable at third base and has dabbled at second, although he’ll likely just be a 45 defender at any skill position. His bat is his ticket, though; he should hit for average, and might be a 35-40 doubles guy in his first few years, while he could find another half-grade of power and convert some of those to homers in his peak.”

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                 1. Ultimately, probably a max 15 HR/ 30 doubles guy.
                    But if he matches or betters his minor peripherals of 16%-K and 9%-BB and also .370plus OBP….I can see him as somewhere around a 3WAR player.

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                 2. What are the odds that his major league numbers are going to match/exceed his #’s in the minors? I don’t see a .370 OBP and expect his k-rate to creep up a bit.

                    Just amuses me that we mourn the loss of a prospect like Mead while his overall profile compares to a player we already have who gets disparaged for not being good enough.

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                 3. I Never saw Meade play, I just mention he would be a nice prospect to have, based on what people on here have said about him in past . I Don’t have a clue on what he will wind up doing, Second i think romus works for wip ,today if all about Nola and would you give him 5/ 110 contract, 68 percent said no, But all the people at the Station said they would plus couple others on Saturday, I just pointed out i never had him as a Ace or second starter, always thought he was mid rotation guy, If mid rotation 500 pitchers command 30 million a yr, then you got to try for less yrs on this guy, His loss of velo bothers me, and his lack of command in the strike zone, that’s why i believe he is giving up so many homeruns, But with the lack of arms in the minors who are near ready, and the bare market, he will get his money,

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                 4. From what I’m hearing, Mead is going to be negative dWar where ever he plays. So his bat is going to have to carry him because his defense is going to bring down his value.

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                 5. Well, yeah, that’s Alec Bohm’s issue. I think people here think I’m an Alec Bohm hater, but I’m not. He’s improved a lot as a hitter and as a fielder, although his fielding is still well below average. My issue is that he needs to hit a lot (more than he has thus far) to be a well above average player. And he particularly needs to hit with more power or well over .300.

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180. Really exciting to see what Crawford has been doing! Hoping it continues, and we may have ourselves a genuine palyer. The K/BB ratio is really good. And, full credit to v1. He is the one who taught me to pay attention to that. If a player Ks too much and doesnt Walk, his chances for success are slim. Crawford looks like he can hit, he can play D, and he can run.

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181. The starting pitching was very shaky over the weekend. Nice to get 2 out of the 3 games with the Royals. The Phillies are now 61-51 with 50 games remaining.

     If they can go 29-21 the rest of the way (and that sounds reasonable), they would end the season with a 90-72 record which would be enough(I believe) to move on.

     On Tuesday, they face Josiah Gray (who dominated them last time). Corbin has pitched much better of late. His slider can give our many left handed bats fits.

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     1. ciada…hope they do not take the Nats lightly,
        ….Nats are 11-5 over their last 16 games with kids that want to make their mark.

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     2. That seems very reasonable to me and if they do that I will be impressed considering we had to start the season without Bryce and Turner’s slow start.

        The NL around us the Braves and Dodgers is just mediocre enough that we emerge again as real contenders to go back to the WS.

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182. Maybe this is a mailbag question but who has options left or can be retained for next year? Excluding the the obvious regulars.

     Hoffman?
     Cave?
     Clemens?
     Muzzotti?
     Hall?
     Brogdon?
     Bellati?
     Marchan?
     Wilson?

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     1. List from fangraphs. Covers most of these guys.

        https://www.fangraphs.com/roster-resource/opening-day-tracker/phillies?season=2023&status=all

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183. I can listen to Dave Dombrowski 24/7. Add in Jayson Stark, and this podcast is a no-brainer.

     “Is it possible? I’d say yes”

     Could Bryce Harper now be the Phillies’ first baseman of the future?

     That’s one of many topics Dave Dombrowski tackled with me and ⁦@dougglanville⁩ on the new Starkville.

     Listen freehttps://t.co/OvCwsQufa9 pic.twitter.com/typwMbraC0

     — Jayson Stark (@jaysonst) August 8, 2023

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184. And, Hinkie, he was very willing to share a lot of his thoughts. Like without mentioning names, when he said teams that were thought to be sellers got back into the race, I think that was the Cubs, Snell, and the Brewers. Wanted someone who could pitch out of the BP in the Playoffs if they needed him to. Didn’t want to pay a high price for a guy with some power, but who would also K a lot, like Teoscar Hernandez. Would not listen on Painter, Abel, McGarry, Rojas or Crawford. All in all, a very interesting session. For me, I am happy with what he did and didn’t do. I wanted another BP arm, but that seems to be Sanchez or Lorenzen. I am all aboard with giving Rojas a shot. A scout told Jayson that Rojas is already a top 5 Defensive CF in the League.

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     1. Matt … no doubt Rojas is a special defensive player. He was getting Victor Robles comps as a defender when he was just 18.
        I’m envisioning a postseason roster that allows the Phillies to protect leads with a dominant BP (Kimbrel/”healthy” Alvarado/Ser-Ant’ny/Soto), and a shutdown defensive OF they can employ late (Marsh LF/Rojas CF/Pache RF).

        BTW … Dombrowski has beefed up the CF position to the point that I didn’t even blink an eye when I saw that Oakland DFA’d Ramon Laureano the other day. Don’t need his glove/cannon arm anymore.

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        1. You were a big Laureano fan, Hinkie, and I saw he was DFA’d, and didn’t even give it a second thought. I agree with you. Come September, they will have both Pache and Rojas ready. I don’t know who gets left off a post season roster, but our OF Defense willbe a real plus. Notwithstanding a rough game the other day, I believe Marsh is a real good Defensive LF.

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185. Read an article on Wes Wilson. Seems like a great guy, and I am looking forward to rooting for him to get his 1st Major League hit!

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     1. Wilson might have the same career as Curtisls Meed even if he started 6 years later.

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        1. Denny….he cannot afford to come out cold in his first few games. He was a big swing and miss guy at LHV (27%), so if he can put his bat on the ball he has a chance of sticking around a bit longer. This is his biggest opportunity now, so he definetly going to be hyped up for it.

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186. Looking ahead to free agency, I projected the top ten contacts. It's obviously Ohtani then a huge drop off, with a bunch of good starting pitchers.

     I also listed 36 more players I think will get $10M+ including some intriguing KBO/NPB posting candidates https://t.co/naE9Spwaby

     — Kiley McDaniel (@kileymcd) August 7, 2023

     Kiley McDaniel projects Aaron Nola to get 5/110M. Does that sound familiar to any of you?

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     1. He only predicts Nola @ $22M AAV…..I see it a few million higher.
        In fact, willing to bet the Phillies offer last spring was a higher AAV than @$22M
        I thnk he will be somewhere between Wheelers $23.6M and Rodon’s $27M AAV

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        1. My guess the Phillies offered something like 6 years and $25-6 mm AAV and he thought he could do better. Oops.

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           1. Yeah…a big oops.
              One thing Middleton is not…is cheap.
              Nola may have been wise to take the offer last spring.

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     2. Yup. He stood to get a lot more from the Phillies I’ll bet, but now that he’s had an objectively mediocre year, that I agree is the new market. He bet on himself and lost.

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        1. They need to tender an offer (to get the compensatory pick), but if I’m the Phillies, I’m moving on from him.

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           1. Two 2014 college draftees…. Rhys and Nola, both free agents same year.
              I hope they DO NOT QO Rhys…..and looks obviously they will QO Npla..

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     3. He’s only projected that because he totally tanked his walk year i.e. he went from 5.9 WAR to 1.1 WAR. If he was close to 3 WAR, he would get more than $110M.

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        1. I can still see a club coming in at $24M or$25M AAV…(5yrs)
           Steve Cohen would do that without any hesitation.

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187. Comments closed, new discussion thread opened.

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Comments are closed.