Roman Quinn’s interesting spring

Although I haven’t been to the sunshine state at all this March, thanks to posters here and, especially, Greg Giombarrese at BlueClaws blog, we’ve basically been able to follow Roman Quinn for the entire spring.  Each day he’s given us a report that includes Quinn, a prospect everyone in Lakewood is excited to watch play.  Let’s review day-by-day after the break…

(date, level, performance)

3/13  CLW 0/4 (slow start)

3/14 CLW 2/3, BB, CS (bad call according to Morandini)

3/15 CLW 2/3, SB

3/16 REA 2/4, 2B

3/18 REA 1/2, BB, SB

3/19 REA 0/3, BB, 2HBP, SB

3/20 REA 2/2, BB, SB

3/23 REA 1/2, 3B

3/25 LAK 2/2, 3B, BB, 2SB

Overall 12/25, 5 BB, 2 HBP, 1 2B, 2 3B, 6/7 SB with a bad CS.

Soon to be our #1 prospect? He’s a long way away, but if he can keep drawing walks and stealing bases he’ll be a good player even if he hits .270.  To me it’s just so hard to believe he’s doing this (mostly at AA-spring) while learning a new position and learning to switch hit.



51 thoughts on “Roman Quinn’s interesting spring

  1. He’s learning SS, he played mostly CF in HS. Give him a couple of years at SS before we give up on him there. His value is greatest if he sticks at that position.

    1. oh, I knew he played short last year. I misinterpreted and thought they moved him off short. I agree with keeping him there but my back up plan would be second. (throws would be easier. From what everyone says is all his errors are from footwork and throwing….second will be easier.)

      1. Of all the liabilities to have, footwork is the one. His arm is strong enough that he’ll get it through good coaching and repitition and the same with the footwork, those are correctable things.

  2. Hopefully about six months from now Quinn will be one of those guys you can look at and wonder how teams passed on him 65 times. Our system really needs a guy like that. For now my expectations are modest. If he can just about replicate his numbers from last year at a higher level and improve his defense I’ll be happy.

    1. +1
      If Roman Quinn replicates his performance of last year over a full-season, he shoots up the prospects’ list. IF that happens Quinn will be comparable to Billy Hamilton, after the 2011 season. Quinn’s peripherals are better than Hamilton’s at the same stage. Jim Callis had Billy Hamilton as the #35 prospect in baseball after that season.
      Blueclaws blog reported that Quinn’s goal was 80 steals. If he gets close to that, and maintains the same peripherals, he’ll jump into the top 35 prospects, no doubt.

      1. Might have to temper your expectations a bit. Delino DeShields Jr. Stole over 100 last year and is only ranked right ahead of Quinn.

        1. DeShields was also repeating the level and plays 2nd, unlike Quinn, who plays SS, which is higher on the defensive spectrum

        2. Like Alec explained above, Delino Deshields is a 2nd Baseman. DeShields did have great numbers, while ranked only 99, but there is a different standard for SS.
          DeSheilds’ numbers in low A were much better than Billy Hamilton’s numbers were in Low A, but Hamilton was rated 35 after his Low A season. While Quinn is playing SS, you have to compare his production to Hamilton, not DeShields.

  3. In every picture I see of Quinn, he looks 14 years old. He might have to grow a mustache just to be taken seriously. Can he grow a mustache? But seriously, the kid’s got some talent. I like the Lakewood lineup with Quinn and Tocci at the top. Reminds me of the Gose and Harold Garcia days. Perkins, Charles and Walding should have a lot of moving ducks on the pond.

  4. Jimmy for comparison hit the SAL at age 18 he stole 46 Bags and put up a line of 270/330/700 OPS. I think all of that is within reach for Roman. It’s good to be excited about him as I think he will be a fine pro but a little sensationalistic to say he is learning a new position.

    I’m pretty sure he played just as much SS in HS as he did CF and he played the whole year in WPT as a SS.

  5. where do you guys get these team stats from because i cant find them for the prospects spring trianing

  6. Quinn should be in Lakewood, but it would be impressive if he started and had success in Clearwater. Reviewing the roster, there does not appear to be much excitement to start at CLW.

    1. To me, there are two pretty big feathers in Quinn’s cap. The first is that he appears to have very good plate discipline – perhaps even excellent plate discipline. If he draws 70-90 walks a year and even hits okay, he’s going to be a classic, high OBP leadoff man. Second, he seems to have a very good to plus hit tool. If all of these things are true and his fielding is fine, it could make him a star. If he develops even modest power in addition to those tools well, the sky’s the limit.

      1. I basically concur, but if he doesn’t develop at least a little power he’s not drawing that many walks, no matter how good his plate discipline is.

        1. There are others: Luis Castillo, Andrus, Bourn, Brett Butler, Kenny Lofton, Tim Raines. It’s unusual but it can happen.

        2. Rod Carew, Pete Rose, Brett Butler, Omar Visquel and Luis Castillo, Brett Gardner…
          You’re not going to find many recent examples because in the PED era, everyone had some power.
          A lot of walks with no power isn’t typical, but it happens.

        3. Don’t really have a huge amount of time to respond, so let me just sketch out the answer:

          (1) Many of those guys had enough power to keep the pitcher honest – who I am really talking about are the sub .100 ISO guys.

          (2) Most of the others are not 75 to 90 BB guys. They are 50-60 BB guys at best.

          (3) I also think the game has changed beyond the effects of the PEDs era in ways which makes the low power/high BB player much rarer.

          I haven’t run the numbers, but I’d suspect that the number of less than .100 ISO/ more than 75 BB seasons in the past 20 years can be counted on the fingers of one hand. If Quinn can’t develop plus .100 ISO power, his chances of having more than 75 BB in a season are quite low.

          1. Roman Quinn had a .127 ISO last year, while learning to switch hit.
            In 2011, Brett Gardner had an ISO of .110, and still walked over 10% of the time.

          2. Just about all the guys listed had very low ISOs in their first few years in the minors though. Quinn’s first year ISO compares favorably to them (obvious SSS). The moderate power usually doesn’t show up until the high minors or even the first few years in the majors.

            While the guys listed above weren’t consistent 75-90 walk guys, they walked more than 50-60 times a year. Most of them were in the 60-80 walk range in their primes.

  7. I watched Quinn take a round of bp last week and I also watched him last year. He is noticeably stronger thru the shoulders and chest and hits the ball very hard for a JRoll sized guy. He walks with an obvious confidence and his left handed swing looks so smooth its impossible to know that he just started switching last year. Its funny though, he turned around to face me and I laughed because he still looks so young. Last year, I thought he looked 14 and now I think he looks about 16 so he’s aged but not that much. He certainly has a very high upside and it will be fun to see how he plays the full season this year, especially with LWood having a terrible amount of travel that all the players complain about.
    I love seeing the highlights every day on the BlueClaws blog, some guys look ready for a big year.

  8. Quinn realistically is the ONLY possible superior MLB SS in our system…now. His success is as important as J-Roll’s was to “complete” the team’s SS position for years to come.

    The possibility of stardom for a SS heir-apparent allows us to have more confidence in the team’s future in consideration of the team’s agism. Add in Brown who now promises to reach his long-awaited potential. Then Joseph who is very likely going to fill the catcher position while providing righty power for the offense. And should the SS position empty after J-Roll’s next season, Galvis could hold it down in prepping for Quinn.

    Then there is the trio of possible additions to the starting staff in Morgan, Martin, and Pettibone with Biddle following.

    Reason for optimism IMO.

    Excelsior! Ever upward and forward.

    1. I am far more confident in this team’s ability to withstand the imminent, and necessary, transition towards the next generation than I was before the spring.

    2. Did you all see Gelb’s article this morning?

      No real news there to anyone here, but I did find the WAR number of 04-07 draftees to be eye-popping. I also chuckled at the downer it ended on:

      “A lot of these younger guys I like,” Looper said. “Four years from now, it’ll sift its way out, and some of them won’t be as good as I thought. Some of them will get hurt. Something will happen where they won’t make it.”

      I’m excited for the guys we have coming up – they should be decent major league players. I just don’t know if there are MVP (and MVP-type, aka Utley) guys it might take to give us another mini dynasty.

      1. “You can’t burn the candle at both ends,” said Marti Wolever, a Phillies assistant general manager who runs the team’s draft. “If your club is getting older and you’re picking later and you don’t have the picks and YOU’RE NOT GOING TO SPEND IT INTERNATIONALLY, something is going to give here, fellas. And it’s just a matter of when it’s going to give. We’re getting to that point.”
        In a nutshell….being too thrifty with the international monies in the ‘oughts’ has hurt them.
        The Braves , Rangers, Bosox and Yankees were teams that did some spending, along with the A’s and lately the Royals. However, now, with the new CBA international rules, scouting will help the Phillies and they should be fine going forward.

        1. At least now we’ve finally had it confirmed once and for all that the Phillies use no advanced statistical anlysis when evaluating players. (Or any “appropriate” statistical analysis”)

        2. Just wondering who do the Yankee’s have coming from big expenditures in the International draft? After Cano who only cost them $150K (good scouting on their part) I haven’t seen any evidence.

          the Rangers yes, Boston who? The Braves who? What big spend did the Royals make internationally? Agree Cespedes would look good in LF for us right now Brown in RF but word on the street was he had some fascination with the A’s.

          And its not like we haven’t spent at all: Domingo, Freddy, Carlos, Pujols. I just don’t buy this criticism when the product on the field from 07-11 was well worth the price of my ticket.

          1. Not on the major league star wise but certainly in the minors:
            Boston: Xander Bogarts (Top 10 prospect in baseball), Jose Iglesias (Defensive Wizard), some extreme boom bust low minors guys
            Yankees: Jesus Montero (who became Michael Pineda), Gary Sanchez (Top 100 prospect), Ivan Nova (not big money), Manny Banuelos (Top 100 prospect), Arodys Vizcaino
            Braves: Julio Tehran, Randall Delgado, Neftali Feliz, Elvis Andrus, Christian Bethancourt (Joseph with less hit and way more arm and defense), Mauricio Cabrera (live arm righty)

            Remember that it takes a whole for talent to trickle through, the big money bonuses really started in the early 2000s (the extreme bonuses, not just dropping 250k on a guy). The 2006 signing class (Galvis and Hernandez for the Phillies) is just starting to reach the majors

            1. I get the names but none of those names equate to championships and I’ll put our record 07-12 up against any of those clubs so to me its a nonsense argument. Maybe Marty might want to take a look at his own scouting acumen first. Our current system or lack there of is more an indictment on those guys. Maybe the answer is better scouts.

              Let’s take a kid I really like for example Adam Eaton drafted in the 19th round of the 2010 draft. Our guys took names like Eldmire and a bunch of other dreck. And I grant so much of this is luck.

              I just can’t stand those that want to make money the issue when at the end of the day its about who you have evaluating what talent to bring in. Spending, Advanced Metrics what have you they are just philosophy, they are neither right or wrong.

              And until the team that spends the most year in and year out wins the WS year in and year out or the team with the biggest staff of math wizards wins the WS year in and year out its all hog wash. Is all I’m saying with all do respect.

            2. Eaton is interesting, he was a senior sign out of college that the D-Backs worked out privately. They completely retooled his swing and changed his footwork out of the box, it changed his hit tool by at least a grade and took him from 60 to 70 speed. He is a developmental story. The Phillies haven’t made any high profile rookies but Diekman, Stutes, Schwimmer, Rosenberg, Knigge all were nobodies who are now useful bullpen arms.

              This isn’t about 07-12, this is about 13-16 and the lack of talent in the system due to poor talent acquisition

            3. We’ll see what happens I think its called parity. The Yankees and Boston were both bit by the same bug I wonder if they are facing the same criticism.

          2. Whenever Marti Wolever, asst GM, says it matter-of-factly in an interview….it is/was a big deal and detriment And he can say that now…..the new CBA inter-restrictions equals the playing field.

      2. Strange that you would tie Chase to MVP type instead of either Howard or Rollins both of whom have an MVP award and Chase being the one that never got one.

        I get what you are saying. I think it speaks to perception,

        1. That is what I said (or tried to say) – MVP-type being Utley. I thought the MVPs would be obvious. Worded poorly, I guess – when talking about the future you’d probably only be interested in MVP-types and not concerned if they actually win the award.

  9. The spotlight will be on Ruf to see if he can become what we need in LF, and on guys like Asche, Joseph, Quinn, and Franco to see if they can continue their growth of last year. The light will also shine bright on Pettibone, Morgan, Martin, and Biddle, all of whom could have a shot at winning a starting spot in the rotation in 2014. For our system to grow though, we’ll need players beyond this list to step up to the next level. We’ll need guys like Wright, Watson, Milner, and Walding and the younger guys Tocci, Cozens, LGJ, Green, Gueller, and Pullin to step up. And who out of Gillies, Collier, Altherr, Hudson and Hewitt will surprise everyone and become the player we’ve been waiting for? Opening day is an exciting time…..

    1. We’re definitely not lacking names to look for in the box scores this year. We have a lot of intriguing guys even if they’re not top prospects.

  10. I am not as people know a sabre guy, but it is a tool and to ignore it to me is so stupid. you should use it along with every tool possible to succeed. i believe the phillies are coming a team that thinks it knows more than anyone else,thats the attitude, that reid had with the eagles, and you saw what happen to that team.

  11. Well i know one thing , my days of going to games is coming to a close soon, verdanler gets 28 million a year, , baseball will price themself,out of the average person going, unless you want to sit in the bathroom and watch it on tv, owners are just getting nuts, with these salarys, and the quality of players is going to suffer, how many of these big contracts can you have, its not like basketball you have three superstars and the rest cheap fillins, you can win, not baseball, you need good players, and if you going to pay these type salary, your going to see the worst baseball ,

    1. You realize that the revenue is almost entirely fueled by TV revenue but local and national. People going to games is essentially fixed revenue stream, the ability to sign players is coming from other sources. Yes Verlander likely won’t provide surplus value but those aren’t the deals that kill you (it is $28 mil a year on top of two bargain $20 mil years). For example, Halladay could provide nothing this year and the Phillies already got full value of that contract. Like in many sports you get burned in baseball when you overpay a non superstar (Werth, Ibanez, Michael Young, Mike Hampton, CJ WIlson, Jason Bay, Pence, Zito, Eithier, Lackey, Burnett) or you have no concept of aging curves (Howard, ARod, Crawford, Adrian Gonzalez, Texeria, Dunn)

  12. I know matt and others really know the draft, question, what is your opinion of the drafts under marty. reading about how there is only one postion player from the draft to help since 2004. and one thing that interest me is marty saying in the article, when you draft low, and dont spend money in international market, is that a dig on phillies low budget or my imagination? some of the thing i have said about them being cheap in the draft is right there in article, 29 one year in spending ,letting workman walk over 75000. a third round pick. maybe i am dead wrong, but i really think as a big market you have to spend money in the international market as well as the draft to help,

  13. Toward the end of last season in Williamsport, the night Roman Quinn hit his only home run, Andy Tracy and I talked about him for about 15 minutes after the game. I said the thing about Roman that always stuck out to me was how young he looked. Mitch Walding and Larry Greene looked like men in men’s bodies. Roman Quinn looked like one of the bat boys got in to the equipment room and found a spot on the team. Andy said, “he looks like a kid because he is a kid.” That has always kind of stuck with me.

    He had moments last year where the pop already in his swing would shine through. Saw him hit a couple balls off the wall to the opposite field in games, and then of course the home run came left-handed. I asked Andy if he thought Roman would be like a 5-8 home run guy and he said playing in Citizens Bank Park, there’s no reason he wouldn’t be able to develop enough power to be a 12-15 home run guy. Now if he’s playing in San Francisco, that’s not as likely, but playing in CBP will make the pop he has stand out. And he’s only going to mature as a man, so I’m not worried too much about his future power.

    1. Mitch, did you get promoted to cover Lakewood this season or are they making you repeat Williamsport? Seems to me you had a good year and performed well, what’s the story?

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